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Carnage.

Carnage

So Ive meaning to ask for punisher is there any reason that comic jigsaw doesnt quailify as I did a search and found nothing. I was supposed to ask lighty back when I sent him a PM for the tv series but forgot.

edited 12th Mar '18 11:31:04 AM by miraculous

I'm not sure he's ever really been brought up.

Here's Carnage's entry. Also anyone else find it interesting and ironic that we got a Spiderman story that introduces Carnage with no direct connection to Venom, while the upcoming Venom film is to feature Carnage but supposedly will ommit Spiderman ? Just something I noticed.

• The Amazing Spiderman 2: Cletus Kasady, also known as the Carnage Killer, is a death obsessed and sadistic misanthrope who casually dismisses his own past with an abusive father, and a serial killer terrorizing New York's underworld, introduced killing Ben Parker's killer as Spiderman was chasing him down. So much fear and paranoia spread among criminal organizations that it started a war that to hunt him down, which proved costly to the city. Initially targeting criminals in violent murders, it's later shown Kasady isn't above going after innocent people, as Spiderman witnesses him preparing to kill a young teenager who witnessed one of his crimes. Kasady's reason for killing stems from his curiosity on death and wanting to understand it, believing criminals to be easy targets. Later sent to Ravencroft, Kasady is experimented on with The Symbiote in the "Venom Project", which he immediately takes control of, and then presumably murders the scientists. Kasady later goes on another rampage, releasing Ravencrofts most dangerous inmates and infecting them with the Symbiote, and creating a hive to start a family in his own twisted image and spread the message of chaos in death to the world at large. Dubbing himself Carnage, Kasady's newest rampage endangers the civilian personnel on the island, and in both confrontations with Spiderman, tried to goad the hero into killing him to prove that they are the same.

I can definitely vote for Cletus Kasady

Also I've been looking at the JAG Monsters and I believe we need to cut Rico Caldas and his unnamed partner.

I believe that they are not heinous enough for the CM trope as their only crime was to strap a bomb on a child so that they can draw out his mother and kill her so their she couldn't testify against their boss.

While this is a heinous crime itself the child or anyone else on the matter don't actually die and if you compare them with the likes Daniel Budd and Pitram Mondal who had more casualties and actually used child bombers multiple times and actually killed children, they don't really stack up.

It doesn't help that Rico and is unamed partner have to share this crime which would mostly benefit their boss, while Daniel and Pitram are clear instigators who directly strap bomb children and use them for their own selfish purposes and no one else.

Even comparing Rico and is unamed partner with other CM duos like Malcolm Tallridge and John Bordinay who killed over a dozen immigrants, including three children and Operatives "Lin" and "Davis" who killed ten people with a super virus and attempted to spread their super virus to the whole city, they are clearly outmatch by them in terms of heinousness.

Thats my opinion on the matter. Im willing to listen to everyones opinion on wether Rico Caldas and his unnamed partner needs to be cut.

edited 12th Mar '18 1:48:01 PM by G-Editor

Carnage. Removing his dark humor takes away one of his trademarks though.

I think I'd be fine cutting Rico and his partner.

Cut away.

Im fine with cutting Rico as well (though since I only started watching from season 5, I thought why they counted was brought up before). as they dont really stand out that much anymore.

edited 12th Mar '18 2:21:47 PM by miraculous

I actually considered doing an effort post on Carnage at one point, but I felt the game was really uncertain on how legitimate his Freudian Excuse was. Shortly before the final boss fight, Spidey shuts down Cletus' claims that he wanted to create a family sorely to spread chaos:

Cletus doesn't deny this. Or refute it for that matter. He just lies there and lets the player make the next selection on the dialogue tree. There's also some audio logs where he talks about how the symbiote talks to him and that they'll be inseparable like "best friends. Or... family''. And after Cletus is defeated, the first thing he says is that "I don't want to be alone again".

It seems the game tried to suggest that Cletus is longing for some sort of family that might support him, even if he is trying to kill people. The moment where Cletus refutes his Freudian Excuse only at the beginning in his first audio log, the rest of the game implying that Cletus might be lying to himself on some level. It's very poorly written, but I think there was some attempt at making Cletus a tragic figure on some level.

I'm abstaining for now because I might be reading too much into things, but those were my thoughts when I first considered proposing him.

edited 12th Mar '18 3:16:41 PM by chasemaddigan

Looking over the JAG/NCIS page, I'm wondering if Louis Wexler is bad enough. He is a Serial Rapist of over a dozen women, but I'm wondering if that is heinous enough in that setting. It wouldn't be stand out in SVU, but I'm not sure about NCIS.

I think Louis Wexler does just enough to qualify. His number of women he raped are in the dozens and rape is very rare in the JAG/NCIS universe. I think there was only one other Serial Rapist, whose number of women he raped were only 6 but he was outclassed by Louis Wexler body count of dozens. If he was in SVU yes he most likely wouldn't qualify, but in the JAG/NCIS were rape is very rare, so I believe Louis Wexler's crimes is just unique enough for him to stand out. I would say Louis Wexler can stay for now.

Anywho any more votes on cutting Rico and his unnamed partner?

edited 12th Mar '18 3:32:36 PM by G-Editor

To be fair, Carnage does still state his intent to have his new family spread death and chaos during his fight with Spiderman, after Spidey's interrogates him. But that can be seen as gameplay story segregation. And that said, Kasady's idea of family is still essentially find people who are as twisted and disturbed as he is and infect them with the symbiote.

Rico Caldas's entry mentions that they planned to kill the women, her son and his classmate. We also take intentions into account. Someone attempting to murder twenty people and failing is just as bad as someone who successfully murdered twenty peopled.

That said, the entry could be wrong. Wouldn’t be the first time.

edited 12th Mar '18 3:32:02 PM by NTG

I'll cautiously Game!Carnage - I actually have seen that game's ending and felt annoyed that they seemed to be trying to make him sympathetic.

Going to have to go with no to Game!Kasidy, poorly done or not, this family business sounds way too potentially mitigating for me to write off.

Rico shares his crimes with his unnamed partner so their crimes are more evenly split, and he was order by boss Carlos Mendez to find a way to kill Angela so she wouldn't testify against him. While Mendez never gave Rico and his partner the idea to strap a bomb onto Angela's son Kody, they were still committed on Carlos behalf rather than his own.

Compare Rico and his partner's crimes to Pitram who had similar resources, but committed far more heinous crime with multiple children he strapped bombs onto, with a much greater-scope of destruction he intends to commit, whose crimes have no benefit other than himself, I don't see how Rico stands out anymore.

That's my opinion on the matter of course, I'm willing to listen everyone opinion of wether Rico and his unnamed partner needs to be cut.

edited 12th Mar '18 3:52:08 PM by G-Editor

No to Carnage. He seems to have an actual redeeming trait, which IIRC is something we decided on him a while back.

Pitram seems to be the head of a terrorist organization, while Rico and his unnamed partner are just henchmen. So I’m not sure whether or not they have the same amount of resources. I guess it depends on the rank Rico had in Mendez’s organization.

The fact that the bomb was Rico’s idea, also makes mean lean towards keeping him. His boss presumably only wanted the women death and left the details to Rico. So he’s the one responsible for endangering the lives of the child(ren).

That said, it’s really hard to tell without knowing more details. Could you tells us, what exactly happened in that episode?

Given this new information, I'll be switching to a to Carnage.

Has anyone played the point and click game Full Throttle? I was wondering what's everyone opinion about Ripburger's chances of qualifying?

Gonna agree andngive a reluctant nay to carnage.

I’ve played FT. Now, I could be remembering wrong but I don’t recall Ripburger being heinous enough.

I was kinda thinking that, but the final act makes me uncertain. I'll think about it before deciding whether to effort post him or not.

I remember the ending of that game, so I'm gonna vote down on Carnage.

@The Immortal Angel Newton I also saw the game play for Full Throttle and was planning to EP Ripburger. But I dropped it due to I don't think hes heinous enough since basically what he did is that he kills an old man and then frames the main protagonist for it and he also attempts to kill the Main Protagonist and a Motorcycle gang after he got exposed. ACW said that it wasn't heinous enough unless the murder is a brutal one or the target are basically children.

edited 12th Mar '18 4:24:49 PM by ElfenLiedFan90