During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Lizzid people!
I personally would say no.
So tomorrow is when we discuss Cuphead then.
edited 12th Oct '17 8:29:02 AM by ReynTime250
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Yes. As it says on the Discussion Dates page.
Which is listed in the FAQ.
And right at the top of the page.
I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
I checked that right after the question.
I didn't know it was on the discussion dates at first.
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
Oh! And speaking of discussions.....I think I'm fine with taking one of the movies for discussion material. May I take the latest Jackie Chan's film The Foreigner for discussion for this thread?
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
Go for it. Doesn't seem like anyone else has claimed the slot.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
edited 13th Oct '17 8:57:52 AM by ACW
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Calaca
Goku Black
There original writeups were a bit strange as ouja said he is made to kill people and look cool doing it while kazari said he is a fine example of how a maginificent bastard can also be a cm. Are either of thoose things necessary ?
yeah only the part about how kasumi became went insane should be spoiler tagged in hind sight so only his name and ouch poor guy. They did foreshadow him losing control but I dont think anyone thought the writers would go through it and actually make him become a bad guy.
edited 12th Oct '17 10:03:41 AM by miraculous
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Not sure about Calaca.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Yeah, thing about spoilers? The less spoiler tagged the better.
Goku Black
yeah his original write up was spoiled so much that what he actually did was unclear.
Small error it should be : are used to kill them.
edited 12th Oct '17 10:21:17 AM by miraculous
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
@ACW you've got Tyke Bomb in Kazari's entry spoiler tagged. As per wiki policy we can't have tropes inside of spoilers.
Goku Black
yeah try and spoiler around that trope and what he did to ankh
edited 12th Oct '17 10:47:26 AM by miraculous
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Something like "brainwashed warrior" would get the same point across and not be putting a trope in the spoilers.
Goku Black
To be fair since ankh is basically a child, I think the original entry I rewrote this from was going with that so they used Tyke Bomb but yeah brainwashed warrior would work just as good so change it to that.
edited 12th Oct '17 10:51:50 AM by miraculous
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
"Brainwashed warrior" probably works.
43110, I can't promise a time when I'll be able to look at those pothole-reduced entries (it's gonna have to be a time when I can REALLY focus on it and have NOTHING else to do), but here's an even bigger project if you're up to it: Seeing which tropes are under spoiler tags for CM. I know there are likely quite a few.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Oh, don't worry, it's not a rush thing... also, on the entries I've reduced potholes on I also take out the ones in spoiler tags.
On another note... having (unfortunately) read sections of Crossed I've got beef with the entries we've got:
- Complete Monster:
- Addy Pratt's father Joseph has been raping his younger daughters for what may have been ''years'' as "Family Values" starts. He has enough leadership and charisma to keep a very large group of survivors together in the months after the emergence of the Crossed, but he does so through turning the settlement into a religious cult with himself as its messiah.
- Steve from "Badlands" is shown to have been sadistic, ruthless and sociopathic long before the Crossed outbreak, as demonstrated by her treatment of prisoners at Abu Ghraib and her abandonment of people who trusted her after the outbreak. While she's implied to have a Freudian Excuse and seemingly mellows out during her travels with her companions, she proves herself a monster when she shoots Greg in the kneecap to leave him for the Crossed and willingly infects herself at the end.
Writing quality aside... Crossed takes place in a world where the titular deviants go around raping, torturing, cannibalizing and murdering people as they wish (often combining those activities). Being that from a resources stand point, Crossed are just people wholly controlled by their darkest desires, I don't think it's really a comic where anyone can stand out. Moral agency or no, the Crossed are so fucking vile that the heinous standard blows the damn roof off.
Voting we cut both candidates as it's really not a setting I can see someone doing enough to count.
edited 12th Oct '17 11:18:22 AM by 43110
Aren't the Crossed infected with a zombie virus thing? They aren't responsible for their actions.
Moral agency or not... they still raise the heinous standard to ridiculous points.
No? I was under the impression brainwashed/infected/controlled characters don't actually contribute to the HS.
That said, the second character doesn't sound particularly bad.
edited 12th Oct '17 11:20:21 AM by HamburgerTime
Oh, also given that one of the survivors in one section was previously a Serial Killer who tortured young men to death, gets kinda wonky.
Goku Black
Yeah cut them.
So what do you think would work as a picture for the kamen rider page bat fangire trying to kill his wife, dr miyo burning his sister to death, tenjuro banno torturing somone possibly his son or asakura feeding his brother to his pet.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Yeah, that's the other thing.... there's one section where the main character sells out a shit load of people to the Crossed will spare him; One where the main characters kill a group of kids when they don't feel they've got enough resources to spare for them, etc.
edited 12th Oct '17 11:23:23 AM by 43110
So does anyone count? The lets play I'm seeing has not got to the end yet.
Edit :![[lol]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/lol2v12_4863.png "[lol]")
![[lol]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/lol2v12_4863.png "[lol]")
![[lol]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/lol2v12_4863.png "[lol]")
that was a joke
edited 12th Oct '17 8:16:14 AM by miraculous
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."