Cleanup Thread: MCU Character Pages

Should we add Monica Rambeau into the MCU: Avengers – Allies page, seeing how she is an ally of Carol and Wanda, two of the most powerful Avengers? Or will her inclusion make the page exceed its limit?

I would say yes.

Yes to move her or yes it would exceed the page limit?

The latter.

Got it. Monica will fit more in the “Other Superheroes” page when she takes the “Spectrum” or the “Photon” alias in “The Marvels”.

I did alot of crosswicking and made MCU Melinda May. Its at 40,550 bytes at the moment. I think it might need some more work done on it first but its getting there if anyone wants to take a look.

Melinda May’s potential page is looking good. I guess we can say that the Cavalry has arrived.

There is a huge list of character pages from this series on the Cut List with "No longer needed" as their cut reason.

What's up with that? We need better cut reasons than that, anyhow.

They are usually cut if they are too short or if the pages they were moved from became too short.

~Septimus Heap That was me. For a long time I was working on a reorganiztion of the regular Marvel Comics Universe as seen here. Alot of the pages that start with Marvel Universe are basically duplicates of already made pages. The idea was to restructure it like the MCU, and I had chosen Marvel Universe as the header i.e. Characters.Marvel Universe Spider Man vs Characters.MCU Spider Man. Why I decided to cutlist the pages is because I realized while the reorganization would be nice, alot of the pages already have the Marvel Comics header instead. So because most of the pages are just extra they could probably be cut. Hopefully that makes sense.

Edited by GateStarX on Jun 27th 2022 at 1:45:31 AM

Can we remove the Variants from individual character pages and add them to the Multiverse page? I'm saying this because while these characters have had a similar history to their Sacred Timeline counterpart, ultimately they're completely different characters from them with a different Earth designation. The Arrowverse character pages also did the same thing with the alternate versions of the characters; they made a separate folder from them in their own Earth. I find it much better if character pages are solely focused on the character and their arsenal (like Captain America, Iron Man, Spider-Man, and Thor). Here are my suggestions if this is approved:

• If their inclusion makes the Multiverse page too long, we can create a new page for their Earths like with Earth-838.
• Delete the Spider-Man Variants page and the Loki variants page. I have separate suggestions for the two:
  • With the Spider-Man Variants page, we can include Andrew and Tobey's Peter's pages in the Multiverse page OR merge the tropes they had with their original character pages from their film series. I would prefer the latter.
  • With the Loki variants, we can add the alternate Lokis introduced in What If...? to the Multiverse page and with the other variants maybe we can create a page called the Void where we can also relocate Alioth. We can also place Throg there.
• We can take a page out of Arrowverse character pages and provide links below the biographies of the character pages and character folders like "See [Insert Trope page here] to see his Earth-[insert numbers] counterpart." That should probably also be applied to the alternate versions though too.

Personally, I've always found it problematic that on the Arrowverse character pages the alternate versions are separated, as it makes them harder to find even when they are major characters.

And frankly, as far as I'm concerned I'd rather have different character pages for the MCU versions of the Raimiverse's and Webbverse's characters, because they're not exactly the same and are more Broad Strokes versions.

Just wondering, why is May the only character that has her LMD, Framework and Lighthouse versions on her character page (aside from Coulson's Chronicom LMD and Fitz's Doctor)? BTW, they're not reallly "Variants" (except for maybe the Lighthouse version), so "Alternate Versions" might be more appropriate.

I’m gonna strongly be against keeping the Variants off of the CSP for the characters. It consolidates all of the versions of the character and helps keeps things consistent. The alternative is giving just about every alternate Earth its own page, which presents far more potential issues. I also see no need to alter the Variants page for Spider-Man and Loki.

Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Jun 27th 2022 at 10:39:47 AM

I say keep the variants on CSP pages. The alternative opens up a bigger potential problem.

I also agree with keep variants on CSP pages. The Multiverse page is already difficult enough to navigate to find less important people on from different universes, and adding several big folders from CSP pages is just going to bloat it even more than what's necessary.

Plus, any alternate versions of well-established characters deserve to remain with their main counterpart imo.

Edited by MatthewWayne on Jun 27th 2022 at 12:22:53 PM

I basically agree with everyone else. The only thing I have to say is a minor formatting issue which would be move the Loki page from MCU: Other Loki Variants to just MCU Loki Variants.

The title is correct, though - two of Loki's variants have their own pages, so that page catalogues the other ones. Especially because it's not like Spider-Man where the Variants pop up once and disappear, with Loki, his variants drive the plot of his show, so a distinction between the two makes sense.

Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Jun 27th 2022 at 5:19:09 AM

Yeah, but formatting wise, it should be

• MCU: Loki
  • MCU Loki Variants
    • MCU: Loki (Variant L1130)
    • MCU: Sylvie

With a little crosswicking, Sandbox.MCU Ghost Rider is at 41,007 bytes. It does need to be formatted alot better though. right now its just a couple of folders.

We can probably hold off on Ghost Rider for the time being. There hasn't been any GR-focused titles so far.

Well it makes me a little sad but I get it. I couldn't really figure out how to format it anyways. I did also did some crosswicking and made MCU Odin at 41,838 bytes.

Also because I'm tired and don't really wanna do the work atm, I was looking at main characters that could have their own pages and with variants I think each Pym family member could maybe get their own pages. Again since I dont want to do the work at the moment I'm not sure, but at least Hank Pym would get over the 40K mark. To negate not having enough characters on the Pym Family page id suggest moving the Lang family and Scott's friends to the page, like how the Stark Family page has friends and employees. TBH though I'm coming off a night shift and am up way to late so If someone with a little more cognitive function could check things out that would be great. Also Good Night.

Edited by GateStarX on Jun 28th 2022 at 5:01:34 AM

I don't know, right now it just feels like we're creating pages just for the sake of creating pages, when that's not the point of a CSP - they're designed to take the load off of pages that are becoming too large, not just giving every character who crosses the 40K byte mark their own page. The Pym moves in particular just seems like we're trying to give characters their own page and then do a bunch of cleanup to justify it, rather than making the pages as part of the cleanup.

To be fair, personally, I'm here to expand the MCU, I love the franchise and i like adding new pages to it. I'm helping with the cleanup because I want all the pages to be uniform and I want to work within the confines of the cleanup thread. If it were up to me I would have split alot more. But since I do agree with some points regarding cleanup I want to work with everyone else to get the best result. Idk, usually if anyone can get past 40K, i think they deserve their own page. Believe me, I've tried getting other characters over that limit and just not had enough to work with. I tried with Wong and Kate Bishop but there just wasn't enough to crosswick and I'm still not the best at making new examples. Every character that has enough tropes to get past 40K means they are beloved by alot more than just me.

Just because I want to help clean up some of the more lackluster pages doesn't mean I don't want to create new ones. If I can see an opportunity to get a character over that 40K mark or it was already like that I'm always going to be in the positive for launching it.

Also regarding the cleanup, most of the pages meet the 40K limit now or are close enough to skirt by. If anything, cleanup now would involve making the supporting characters pages more accessible to the average troper, perferably without taking away what makes this section what it is.

Here's the thing again - you're talking about creating pages like it's a badge of honor, saying that crossing 40K means that the character "deserves" their own page or that it's a sign that the character is particularly "beloved" by fans, when that's just not what it is - it's just that a character has a lot of tropes attached to them. Like, I highly doubt there's anyone on Earth who loves the Riddler from the Arkham Series (a premier Hate Sink who only gets worse and more pointless with each game), but he's got a lot of tropes, so he's got a page. It's, above all, meant for formatting, ease of navigation, and to keep large pages from getting too large. Expanding is all well and good, and no one would be using the site if we didn't like to add tropes or create new pages for things, but expanding characters just for the sake of expansion will only inevitably lead to misuse and even more cleanup for us.

In fairness, it is pretty strange to see how certain characters will get entire pages worth of tropes to scroll through while others just...don't. Like, it bothers me when I see stuff like most of the main Roy kids having their own pages in Succession, except for Roman and Connor, even though they're just as prevalent characters as their siblings/father.

Or how Jeff Winger has his own page in Community, but literally nobody else does.

Also, the Riddler is a prevalent enough character throughout the Arkham series to justify having his own page, same with Scarecrow and Joker, so that doesn't bother me much. Also...I kind of like him as a character.

Edited by MatthewWayne on Jun 28th 2022 at 8:51:17 AM