Should You Know That Show be renamed?

"You Know That Show?", to me, suffers from fewer clarity issues than "You Know, That Thing Where...?" did. The only problem with it is that it may sound like an invitation for discussion, but I haven't seen people misunderstand it that way. I think "Ask the Tropers" is what's too vague, since it doesn't convey in any way that it's for issues with the wiki or its users. It's too general, misused pretty much daily because of it, and if I were to rename a feature, that'd be the one.

The unskippable box would only show up for the first 5 ATT posts or something. Or maybe a time period, like the first two weeks of registration. Would that be less intrusive?

Agreed that it's a large change. I personally don't know if 2.0 will ever happen, so I wouldn't count on it. Let's consider what can be done right now.

Agreed that Ask The Tropers is a more problematic name than You Know That Show and possibly the poorest of the query names as it's a bit too broad. Other names for it were mentioned in previous posts.

Edited by Piterpicher on Mar 14th 2020 at 8:04:28 PM

As for the "ATT is more confusing" thing, I totally agree. I've seen it used for:

• Misplaced TF and TKTS queries
• General questions about trope usages or policy debates (which should be on the forums)
• Questions about unrelated things, such as misplaced headscratchers or people's opinions on certain topics; this is most rare, but it's still something I've seen numerous times.

It's just such a broad name compared to what it's actually intended for.

Maybe this thread itself should be renamed to "Should You Know That Show/Ask The Tropers" be renamed? Because ultimately it could be ATT that receives a rename and not YKTS, as it's more confusing (or maybe even remove the You Know That Show part, but that could make some early posts off-topic).

I've asked once, now I'm gonna ask again. ~MacronNotes and ~War Jay 77, do you think this thread itself should be renamed based on my previous post?

I don't really have a preference, tbh.

I suppose if everyone else thinks that ATT's name is more of an issue.

Another issue that comes up is people going to Trope Finder and mistaking it for a search box, which leads to people making queries like this one that are just a trope name or description and nothing else.

Going back to this suggestion since ATT continues to have this problem almost daily...

eroock: "It may help to improve the disambiguation info on top of the ATT board. I am going out on a limb here but it seems to have worked out for Trope Finder."

I really do like this idea. New info would maintain the common language of saying ATT, while clarifying once at ATT what ATT is for and what it isn't. Right now people latch onto the parts I've bolded and never "click here" to find out if they're in the right place: "Have a question about how the TV Tropes wiki works? No one knows this community better than the people in it, so ask away! Ask the Tropers is the page you come to when you have a question burning in your brain and the support pages didn't help. It's not for everything, though. For a list of all the resources for your questions, click here."

I do like that the list of resources unfolds when selected so the top area isn't taken up by all that space, but the current info directs people to "ask away" and then they tune out without getting to "click here" because they stopped reading before "it's not for everything, though". It says "ask away" so they go ahead and ask away. They have "a question burning in your brain" and go "yes I do, I'll ask it here!" Basically, it never makes clear what Ask The Tropers is for and just leaves the impression that it's for asking the tropers to answer questions. A rewrite could say "ATT is for [this]. If your question doesn't fit that, click here for a list" blah blah.

Maybe it would include the most common mistaken things, like "ATT is for [this]. If you want help identifying a show, you want You Know That Show Where. If you have questions about tropes," blah blah blah, "If your question is something else, click here for a list of resources"

Edited by immichan on Apr 6th 2020 at 3:43:35 PM

I'm a relatively experienced troper, but sometimes, I think I'm on Trope Finder when really I'm on ATT. I don't know why, and it doesn't happen very often, but yeah. Why do you think that is?

Well, whenever that happens to me it's often because I've misclicked the button on the side and didn't read the page before posting my query.

They visually appear to be the same. Same interface, things in same locations, etc. If you don't read the words, just go by the appearance, your brain bypasses and engages the "I know where I am!" autopilot.

... and I just thought "oh I'll put screenshots side-by-side..." with no clue about that. So, uh, just look at the pages back and forth and compare them in your own brains.

Edited by immichan on Apr 7th 2020 at 10:30:09 AM

I think part of the problem might be that people don't know that Wishlist and Query Bugs exist because they're not on the side 24/7 the way ATT, et al, is.

That's a problem too, combined with ATT always being on the top, which can make people who want to report, say, a glitch, go to the first place they can get to.

The best option is to just bring back the big green banner.

Just bring back the green banner and our problems will be solved.

Edit:

Edited by RallyBot2 on Apr 15th 2020 at 4:24:59 AM

Big green banner?

It's something that apparently existed on ATT to direct people to TF (see JustForFun.Ask The Tropers), now it's more of a meme. To be honest, I think we should use a more sophisticated method, as this thread had many useful ideas (by the way, I'm sorry I haven't acted on the rename of this thread itself but I'm lazy) and it's not like that banner will completely stop people from getting mistaken, anyway. Also, it was made during the days where TF was still Lost And Found which was a stupid nondescriptive name and has been fixed and the amount of questions greatly dropped, therefore this situation can likely be fixed if we rename YKTS/ATT too.

As for Query Wishlist and Query Bugs mentioned previously, agreed that adding them to the sidebar would work.

Edited by Piterpicher on Apr 15th 2020 at 4:36:20 PM

Well, we’ve got at least one case of someone thinking YKTS was just for shows. And if there’s one person, there’s probably more.

Well ATT is still repeatedly used for YKTS, I think I will request the title to be changed so that the subject is ATT and not YKTS.

Go for both ATT and YKTS, just in case (I should have done it long ago, but I'm a filthy procrastinator).

Renamed as requested.

What if Ask The Tropers were moved under You Know That Show on the sidebar?

That would annoy regular editors and people who don't use YKTS as much. Most editors are probably used to ATT at the top, including myself.

Edited by Piterpicher on Aug 4th 2020 at 9:31:17 PM

Ever notice that most of the people who post these sort of things have the same sort of avatars? They're either blank-head images or selfies. It's never the lampshade. I find it really weird and a little sketchy if I'm being honest.