Unfortunate Implications Citation Discussion

From YMMV.Cars 2:

• Unfortunate Implications: Stephen Krosecz of Animated Analysis argues that the heroes are prejudiced against the Lemon cars, that the film doesn't seem to treat this as a bad thing, and that one could interpret this as an ableist message.

There's only one citation that doesn't work anymore; moreover, the description says that multiple people have to be cited, not just one person. Is the latter point being enforced?

As a side note, I find the whole "the heroes are wrongly prejudiced against the lemons" rhetoric to be prima facie incorrect based on how the lemons are perfectly willing to attack innocent race cars for their own profit; tellingly, their leaders are listed as Complete Monsters on the same page.

There was a big thing about that line on Tumblr, about whether it's Unfortunate Implications or genius subtext, but there is absolutely no way I'm going to be able to find the posts.

Somebody added a link to Sundown towns since you posted, but I don't think that's sufficient on its own.

Agreed, that wikipedia link seems pretty flimsy on its own. Interesting read, though, and by "interesting" I mean "disturbing". Thankfully, Obelix's got me covered◊.

Tumblr links can help clarify the viewpoint behind such entries but they themselves don't make for good citations due to the whole individual blog issue.

Edited by AlleyOop on Mar 7th 2020 at 8:47:03 AM

On The Loud House S 2 E 3 Baby Steps Brawl In The Family:

• Unfortunate Implications: The entire episode is written to the point of making the sisters come off less like Lincoln’s siblings and more like a bunch of short tempered, self-centered, hypocritical, power hungry, immature psychos who have recently taken over their own so-called brother’s life in his house by using the “Sister Fight Protocol” to stop unnecessary fighting, Lincoln coming off more as a feeble-minded single child who’s hopeless at standing up for himself and the parents coming off as Lincoln’s two folks who have been mentally broken into complete submission by said psychos. Given that this isn’t how the Louds normally act and knowing real-life mental illnesses, it can be rather unsettling.

No citations or indication it's more than one troper's opinion. Delete.

And what does it even have to do with mental illness?

Are articles from print sources acceptable as citations for this? Or is that similar to the paywall journal problem since people can't just click a link and verify it?

(Specifically, Star Wars Insider magazine for... you guessed it, Star Wars)

((Paywall journals are buuuuuullshit and don't pay the authors and blah blah I can't tell y'all how many times I've been researching something and hit a freakin' paywall but y'all relate right? Right?))

Speaking personally, I believe that paywalled or offline sources should be permitted, so long as the information is published, can be viewed somewhere in the world, and is reliable.

If you can provide a specific citation so that it's clear it's not someone peddling bullshit, then it should be fine.

There was an ATT query a few years ago, and the mods said that citations that are behind paywalls are not allowed. That was back in 2015, but I doubt that the rule would change in time since.

YMMV.Transformers Prime features an entry with a citation from TF Wiki Dot Net, where the Notes section makes a snarky comment about the implications ("which is unintentionally so insulting to homosexuals that it could create an awkward silence in the Void."). Is that a legit citation?

Pewdiepie's YMMV page has this:

Which just seems like a bit of a stretch to make PDP look bad.

Edited by ScarletNebula on Mar 16th 2020 at 6:20:23 AM

Yeah, PDP has said some messed up things...but that's looking for racism where there isn't any.

Also, no citation means instacut.

That has no citation, so it should be removed.

Edited by ADrago on Mar 16th 2020 at 8:20:08 AM

For what it's worth, PewDiePie responded to that claim in a video.

Over on Fire Emblem: Three Houses:

• The notion that the game operates on Gray-and-Gray Morality leads some fans to believe that this applies to every character, including unambiguously villainous characters like Miklan. Edelgard’s comment on how if weren’t for the crest system, he possibly could have been a better person lead some to claim that he was merely a victim of circumstance, abused and disowned by his parents simply because he didn’t have a crest. This is ignoring the fact that Miklan wasn’t completely disowned by his family until the multiple attempts he made on Sylvain's (who was a child at the time) life. Not to mention the fact that Miklan was disinherited for other good reasons, as the Gautier territory needed someone with a crest to protect their territory as well as the rest of Fódlan from the Sreng region using the Lance of Ruin. While Miklan’s defenders exist only in small numbers, Intelligent Systems seems to have made an attempt to quash any sympathy anyone might feel toward him by having Yuri elaborate further on his villainy in chapter 5. Not only is he a murderous bandit that relentlessly terrorizes towns beyond any sense of reason or need, he also steals food and abducts women. Even Yuri, a leader of a gang of thugs, is disgusted by his actions and claims that he could have lead Miklan’s gang better, which directly contradicts Edelgard’s original comment. Not helping matters is that Sylvain, a victim of Miklan's abuse, shows sympathy towards Miklan's situation, and claims he had a harder life than most which leads to some Unfortunate Implications on Intelligent System’s part, ^note Implying that Miklan’s abuse and actions were at least partially justified because he had a hard life, and he should be viewed sympathetically because one of his victims thinks so with this likely being the reason why they felt the need to further establish that Miklan is worse than we were originally shown. However in doing so they sent mixed signals, only further contorting the narrative that’s been established by the game before the Cindered Shadows DLC was implemented while also inadvertently making Edelgard and Dimitri look like bad people for sympathizing with him.

Aside from the entry itself being a Wall of Text that used to be even longer, no citation is provided for the Unfortunate Implications, and given how it's written, I doubt any can be found that aren't random fan accounts given it's centered around fandom meta.

I have no idea what this entry is saying due to its size and confused state. Burn it

If anything, that’s Misaimed Fandom. But that’s a pretty big “if.”

It is listed under Misaimed Fandom, yes. And while the point is perhaps relevant as an example of such, it seems to have been added because of a troper's particular fandom wonks that several other tropers who already are prone to Natter continued to pile their own arguments and interpretations onto.

Edited by AlleyOop on Mar 20th 2020 at 7:57:15 AM

Burn it, it hurts even to look at.

Any thoughts on the Cars 2 example on the top of the page?

Aren't they the villains of the film who try to blow up and kill innocent cars. That may be the actual reason why the heroes don't like them.....

Bumping

From All About Eve.

• Unfortunate Implications: It has been argued that this movie has anti-homosexual and sexist undertones. Addison and Eve are presented as villains, and, as noted, are often interpreted as homosexuals^note Though this is strictly Fanon with no definite evidence in the film itself. Eve's focus on her career, in contrast to Karen's devotion to her husband, and Margo's eventual acceptance of Bill and of her fading career, is shown as devious, and she eventually succumbs to Addison's domination. The greatest example within the movie itself is Margo's speech to Karen, where she outright says a woman is not a woman without a husband, and having a career just leads to ending up alone. The Other Wiki has full details.

Is a Wikipedia article really a valid choice especially when what they site argues back and forth on the point their using (Well using a point that's not even confirmed in the film....)

Yeah even that confused me.