The Flash (2023)

So... announced at SDCC is that the Flash film will be... Flashpoint.

Alrighty then. So, sounds like DC wants to reboot their crappy DCU, but instead of turning it into the New 52, turn it into more DC Rebirth. The DCU was taken over by none other than Geoff Johns, so I doubt he'd want to bring the New 52 to the DCU because... the DCU is already the New 52. So, maybe it's to make Superman... Superman again, for instance.

And there's a metric crapton of speculation that this will merge the CW heroes into the DCU. Now that would be... interesting.

More confusing. If there is anything Ao S has shown than that a flashpoint plot works the best if you already have an established world to reshuffle, making the changes meaningful by addressing possible plot points and character paths which weren't taken in the past. In this case it is just another Day of Future past (at best), where later on nobody has any idea what is still canon and what isn't.

I'm pretty sure they just want to fuck around with the flashpoint timeline, because it's actually pretty cool (though I think they need a more developed universe before trying that). Not necessarily reboot their universe afterwards.

I agree that it is way too early to do Flashpoint, and it's also a outright bizarre choice to do this as Flash's first film.

Should have just put him against Gorilla Grodd.

They're not going to reboot their universe with Flashpoint that wouldn't work.

But if you cast the perfect actors for Thomas and Martha Wayne you want to get more use out of them. I can't wait to see Thomas Wayne, Batman and Martha Wayne, Joker.

Flashpoint doesn't necessarily mean that it would reboot the universe. When Geoff Johns first conceptualized Flashpoint he just wanted to create a story in a cool alternate timeline that was created when Barry tried to save his mother's life. When the story was over he intended for Barry Allen to return to his own timeline. It wasn't until Jim Lee and Dan Didio thought about rebooting the DC Universe that Geoff Johns had to change the ending of his story to incorporate the reboot.

It actually makes sense to have it as the first Flash movie, Barry Allen is still inexperienced with his powers and doesn't know the consequences of using his powers to save his mother. They have to recreate the experiment that gave him powers in the Flashpoint timeline they can reshoots his origin there when he is talking to Thomas Wayne about it.

edited 27th Jul '17 5:14:51 AM by Halberdier17

I'm not too sure. Flashpoint is an arc best framed, as far as the Flash is concerned, a radical change of his entire status quo and everything he knows in this weird and foreign reality. But this is his first film, we have little grasp of his status quo and what he knows, so the radical shift matters very little. Then there's the fact the entire story kickstarts from Flash's impetus of saving his mother, which is something we, likewise, have no context for in the movie universe because we weren't even told his mother died yet or how he feels about it. One of the most memorable lines of the comic even is Zoom's "You're the villain today.". Which has zero weight because we haven't seen heroism on Barry's part thus far, so his fuck-up means nothing.

It's like Born Again, Civil War or Knightfall, those are stories that rely on hurling a monkey wrench on everything the hero knows about his reality, and you can't really do that before we see what exactly he knows about his reality.

Flashpoint would be great for a second or third film, presumably after we get a stronger grip on the cinematic dceu universe and the Flash. But now it's way too early.

We know his mother died the previous trailer for Justice League shows Barry talking to his dad in prison and they both touch the glass.

Though they would have to remind people that for this movie.

Too little, too late.

They're straight up rebooting the DCEU?!

So when Barry gets back the future Ben Affleck will be replaced?

Oh man, this is hilarious. And sad, but mostly hilarious.

edited 27th Jul '17 7:35:45 AM by Beatman1

But what's going to happen to Wonder Woman D: ?

Okay, there are 2 sides to take from this.

• On one hand, yeah, Flashpoint does sound like a weird choice for The Flash's first movie considering how it shakes up the status quo of essentially everything and the most we've seen of The Flash so far was a warning from the future, surveillance camera footage, and him about to foil a bank heist by Captain Boomerang. Not to mention that Justice League hasn't even come out yet and he's supposed to have a big role there (doy).

• On the other hand, if Geoff Johns' original plan for Flashpoint was to have Barry return to the original DC universe as it was and Jim Lee and Dan Didio nudged him to make the ending follow along their New 52 plan, then maybe this will be one of those things where the adaptation of the story will be better than the original story?

Wonder Woman kinda proves that the DCEU can be salvaged and they made a big deal of how Justice League is emphasizing hope above all things, so I doubt they'd want to use Flashpoint as an excuse to start from scratch. If anything, I would imagine they'd use Justice League's opening act to give us a better idea what a day in the life of Barry Allen is like.

edited 27th Jul '17 7:52:03 AM by TargetmasterJoe

Wait a minute, maybe it's related to that Bad Future in Bv S?

Wonder Woman's the one property that has zero chance of really being changed all that much since it's the first unambiguous success of the franchise.

I wouldn't be surprised if this movie is used to bring about changes. The Snyders will likely have a diminished role in the franchise moving forward (though I felt that was already obvious) so WB could be using this to try and fix things they viewed as missteps in the past.

Remember, Johns and Berg were fairly candid about what they viewed as problems with BVS and Suicide Squad.

all right since this is a film that will probably about the flash fucking up reality. DAMN IT BARRY!!!!!

Bringing Melissa Benoist's Supergirl into the DCU....

EDIT: Couldn't resist

https://m.imgur.com/gallery/dXbZ2

edited 27th Jul '17 9:16:41 AM by AnotherGuy

The odds of this making major changes to movies that already happened is near nil.

They'll just do an alternate timeline story where Bary trying to save his mom after he realises that he can time travel screws up the world. Maybe he'll get to pal around with Thomas Wayne but there's little chance of more leaguers showing up.

That is if they're not just using the name and not the story.

That's pretty much the series finale for all the CW DC shows if Barry comes back in time and finds out he's Grant Gustin.

@comicwriter rebooting all but one property in this universe is only going to ensure the DCEU has the same problems as the post Flashpoint continuity in the comics. Problems that lead to another reboot. The issues with the DCEU do not need a cosmic retcon to fix.

ahhh barry, the fucker of timeline...

How Many time he wreck reality already?

"Rebirth isn't a reboot, it never was"

All Rebirth does is say that Prime Earth (New 52) and New Earth (Post Crisis on Infinite Earths) are the same exact Earth the only difference is the merged universes (DC, Vertigo, and Wildstorm) and the 10 years missing from everybody.

I think Flashpoint feels early only because Justice League hasn't been released yet. Once it has been released we have been introduced to Barry Allen and his relationships to the rest of the League. There is also strong evidence that Justice League will establish his ability to time travel and it looks like they are approaching things similar to the TV show, where his father is in prison for presumably killing Barry's mother and that is a big defining element of the character.

Now one of the interesting elements of Flashpoint is seeing the entire DC universe turned on its side, but like the animated movie they do not have the time in a two-hour-ish movie to explore all those changes anyway. To get maximum impact you would have to wait until after Justice League 3 and make it a four hour movie. Justice League: The Flashpoint Paradox is considered one of the best of the DC animated movies, and it is completely standalone from any other continuity.

And like Wonder Woman I think it will get a lot of mileage out of the early, darker portrayal of the DCEU by contrasting it with true despair. You thought BVS was dark? In THIS film Wonder Woman mails Mera's head to Aquaman! Justice League will show the character finally reaching a good place in his life after getting his powers and then we'll see how things go bad. And the end message of Flashpoint is that you have to accept the things life has given you and move forward. So it would be ironic if the DCEU used Flashpoint to "fix" things, given that kind of message.

A well-written film can do it. See Chicken Run. The entire thing with "today is your day" still evoked emotions even though it was given like, 30 seconds (LITERALLY) of subplot. Emotional investment can be made quickly if done right.

Ezra Miller flash is a lot more careful about breaking the timeline and only time travels in the most extreme of circumstances.

Uhhhh.....So the movie is happening and we got lots of trailers and such for it

Is there a different forum people have been discussing this stuff on?

Mostly the DC Movies thread.