Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

Since it seems like that page is still under construction, do note that new work pages need a bare minimum of 3 tropes, and preferably 10 (the limit on Works Needing Tropes). Stub pages will quickly be brought up in the YKTTW workstation thread.

As one, final Fan Works edit before we go into full banned-mode, I motion we 'cut' all of the Power Rangers Dark Fic examples.

I managed to persevere and read through the fic (the things I do for this cleanup), and learned that every one of those examples are either out-heinous(ed)(?), have little-to-no-characterization, or have redeeming features.

Also, the whole thing's just a convoluted mess of hearts getting ripped out, babies getting fried, and genocides being perpetrated all while the Power Rangers team up with The Avengers, Batman, and the friggin' Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

I say we burn them all with Holy Fire and proceed with the ban.

edited 22nd Sep '15 8:54:02 AM by Ravok

To the power rangers examples.

Seconded. May we forward the moratorium so we can get off this subject and start talking about actual candidates?

Cut the Power Rangers.

Yay! Numerous hours of my life weren't just wasted for nothing!

@ACW: Would you mind, when you get the chance, requesting those examples be removed at the Edit Requests Thread? I'd do it, but I'm not sure if you have to have a special postition to request or anything.

Let the moratorium begin!!!

edited 22nd Sep '15 9:14:39 AM by Ravok

Anyone can request. Hell, it's not even required that I be the one to do the weekly batches; it's just turned out that way (which is fine with me).

Ah, alright. I suppose I'll just pop over there and request the entries' removal then. Thanks.

I join those desiring a moratorium. We gain nothing from putting up examples like that.

New write-up for Mordrid.

• Doctor Mordrid: Kabal was once Mordrid's sworn brother until his ambition grew and he betrayed the other sorcerers, who imprisoned him. He breaks free and escapes to Earth, after which Mordrid is sent to Earth to prepare for Kabal's arrival. Kabal kills a number of people to get the elements he needs to complete a ritual that will open the Hellgates in the Magic Dimension, setting his spawn loose upon mankind and turn Earth into a hellworld with Kabal as God-Emperor. Mordrid travels to the dimension to investigate, discovering that Kabal has slaughtered all the wizards in the garrison save for one guard whose eyes he gouged out. When two Satanists offer to help Kabal, he ritualistically sacrifices one of them. During the climactic battle between Mordrid and Kabal in the Museum of Natural History, the evil sorcerer revives a Tyrannosaurus Rex skeleton in the exhibit to kill innocent bystanders in an attempt to make Mordrid back down.

edited 22nd Sep '15 4:11:32 PM by Morgenthaler

I removed the ...Grid ones from Monster Fan Works Reformat.

My thought regarding the concerns people have raised about my suggestion was that it should easily be possible to make a trope page for any work that has actual merit. But it was just an idea, and we can put off discussing it for now.

I'm off tomorrow, so I'll try to do an effortpost for another Department 19 character. Only in one book, but unlike Dracula this one's a human.

edited 22nd Sep '15 12:34:19 PM by ACW

@ nrjxll, I am opposed to that idea in general, just because there might be some obscure books, movies, video games, etc that would be caught up in that rule. It seems like this would create a bias towards only the really mainstream works and ignore more obscure published works, because now proposing an obscure work involves a lot more work then proposing something that is really mainstream. We shouldn't be making more work for ourselves. There is a huge middle ground between example between finding examples only in really mainstream works and searching the sewers of the internet for examples.

I do support this one month ban, but to play devil's advocate for a moment, I think we could still look at unpublished works in the future, we can just be more discerning on what type of unpublished works we are willing to consider, like a minimum standard of a coherent plot and characterization, rather then an excuse to show torture porn for the sake of shock value. Also I would suggest we only look at fan fics that feel like that they could be part of the universe they are based on, rather then works that feature Ron the Death Eater characters. A Batman fan fic that features a villain evil enough to count (if it has enough plot and characterization) is a better choice to examine rather then an example which turns a Care Bear into a Serial Killer.

edited 22nd Sep '15 5:00:05 PM by Overlord

Overlord's idea

I support keeping it YMMV; after all, misuse aside, there are some (most?) that haven't been unanimous (hello Hades). And conversely, there have been some characters that people think SHOULD count but were voted down.

This, basically.

I think we need to discuss Heinrich. I don't remember him being brought up and if he was, he must have been shot down because I noticed a year ago he was on the page and now he's not. He might have been mentioned in passing but I think we need an actual discussion on him. I think what happened was that he somehow had a Freudian Excuse in that his father was abusive, though I don't really consider abusive parents to be a disqualifier in this case especially if you end up emulating said parents to a T and cross boundaries even they wouldn't. Experimenting and giving your children GUILT and giving the protagonist a Sadistic Choice between their lives and Angie's is more than "a little dickish". I know he definitely passes the heinous standard. An actual discussion on why he doesn't count would be nice instead of simply cutting him.

Heinrich from Trauma Center? Wanna effortpost him?

The Runescape page is as good as its gonna get. ACW will submit it tomorrow I suppose. Though, I will say that it feels odd to have been solely responsible for the creation of an entire subpage. I added the image, quote, and wrote four of the entries and rewrote one. I guess that's to be expected when I'm the only troper active in the particular piece of media.

Are there any other monster subpages that a single person more or less created?

Ambar is the reason we have the Godzilla page, and Hambergertime is the reason we have the Shin Megami Tensei Page.

And forsetipurge will be the reason we may have a Jack Reacher subpage (currently 3 entries, one to come this weekend, and there was another one who sort of fell by the wayside).

I was going through the ymmv sandbox, and there are two characters listed I would like to discuss, one I support keeping and one I support cutting. I will start with the one I recommend cutting first:

Who are they?

Saki Yurikawa from Reikothe Zombie Shop.

What does she do?

Saki Yurikawa is a teenage girl who is also a serial child killer. 10 years prior to the story, Saki had a sister that she liked to bully. One day, while at school, Saki accidentally knocked her sister down the school steps, causing her head trauma that resulted in a coma. As the years passed, Saki began to believe that her sister would never awaken from her coma. Saki became desperate for a new sister, and, rather than ask her parents to adopt, she began kidnapping little girls and asking them to be her new sister. When the girls refused, Saki would stab them to death. By the time we are introduced to Saki, she has already killed 20 little girls. As the volume goes on, she continues to kill little girls and anyone that gets in her way. By the end of the first volume, she has killed 29 little girls, a reporter, a cameraman, two guards, and a nurse. While trying to kill a thirtieth girl, Saki is stopped and zombified by Reiko, making her Rekio's servant, and ending her reign of terror.

Does she meet the heinous standard?

Yes, easily.

Any redeeming features?

Sadly, yes. While Saki did bully her sister, she seems to regret putting her in a coma. Saki always tells the little girls she kidnaps that she will love them and take care of them, and "only" kills them when they refuse and insult or otherwise anger her. Saki does seem legitimately insane, driven by a desperate desire to get a new sister. Saki seems pretty sad about her sister being in a coma, which suggests that she did love her despite bullying her.

Final verdict?

As horrible as she is, she does seem to have loved her sister. Complete Monsters cannot have any redeeming qualities at all. Cut.

Late to the party but I support the one-month moratorium on darfic/creepypasta discussion. I have one question though. What should we do about the current existing examples on the Fan Works sandbox?

The Fan Works page and the Pokemon Fan Works page are the last subpages in need of cleanup due to still having badly written examples and possible non-examples. Should those just wait?

Yeah, I think that'd be for the best.

Also, not to toot my on horn, but 5 out of the 6 villains on the G.I. Joe page were my doing.

Anywho, I'm proud to present, our first proposal (dang it bobg, stealing my moment!) since the moratorium! Woo-Hoo! Yay…

As a moment of consideration, for those of who have not read the 1998 crime novel, Blood Work…SPOILERS!

Who is he?

"The Code Killer", A.K.A. Daniel Crimmins is, you guessed it, a Serial Killer, and the main villain of the 1998 crime novel Blood Work.

What has he done?

A few years before the story, Crimmins tried to become a Police Officer, however he was kicked from the force for his anti-social behavior.

Outraged, Crimmins took up a fake identity and began a killing spree, murdering numerous men, women, and children over his active months.

He earned the name, "The Code Killer" thanks to the fact that he would send taunting letters to the police, and each one would have the same repeating pattern of numbers at the end (Actually a clue to his fake identity's name). The police could never crack the code.

The leader of the investigation, Terry Mc Caleb, would often speak out against The Killer on news stations and press conferences, and Crimmins decided then and there that Mc Caleb was his "archnemesis."

Realizing the police were starting to close in on him, Crimmins halted the killings, hoping to wait until suspicion had died down to start back up again.

Learning that Mc Caleb had a heart attack and needed a new heart to survive, Crimmins, refusing to let his "nemesis" go out so anticlimatically, formulated a plan. Learning Mc Caleb has type AB blood (very rare), Crimmins set his plan into motion.

Crimmins gets a list of type AB blood-organ donors in the area, then begins killing them off, and though the first two didn't work out well, the third victim survived long enough for her heart to be transplanted. (Crimmins also murdered a cashier at the third victim's killing.) He enjoys these killings way more than he should.

Mc Caleb survived the transplant, and is on the case of the 3 murders after the last victim's sister begs him for help in finding the killer.

Crimmins then sets about framing Mc Caleb for the murders, hoping the police would believe he hired a gunman to kill the people in order to get himself a heart transplant faster.

However, Crimmins had set a Xanatos Gambit in order. Mc Caleb can't clear his name? He gets prison for life and Crimmins gets off scot-free. He clears his name? Crimmins reveals (through a pre-recording) that he killed the 3 people to keep him alive, believing it to not only be an act that will go down in history as a huge crime, but also the perfect way to screw with Mc Caleb forever, with the knowledge that he's alive because 3 people died.

Mc Caleb clears his name, the path Crimmins most anticipated, and comes after him. Crimmins reveals he has kidnapped Mc Caleb's Love Interest (The third victim's sister) amd her nephew, a young, preteen, child, and has buried them alive, but he left them an air supply, wanting them to die slowly from hunger and/or thirst rather than suffocation.

Crimmins makes him a deal: Let him walk away, and he'll call (eventually) and tell Mc Caleb the girl and child's whereabouts. He's lying, of course.

Mc Caleb refuses and guns Crimmins down, then demans Crimmins tell him the hostages' location as one, good act. Crimmins refuses, taunts how their deaths will be Mc Caleb's fault, and dies while reminding him he's only alive because Crimmins allowed it.

Mc Caleb finds the hostages, however they are (rightfully) traumatized, but Mc Caleb notes they'll all find some way to move on.

Freudian Excuse or other redeeming features?

His "excuse" is that the police refused to let him on the force because of his antisocial behavior. And that obviosuly justifies murdering innocents to prove his superiority.

While reading his profile, Mc Caleb notes his father was probably domineering and/or abusive and, being a retired cop himself, probably pushed Crimmins into becoming an officer, however this is never confirmed, and Crimmins' only reaction when the subject is brought up is to scowl, then immediately go back to smugly informing Mc Caleb that he has Mc Caleb's girlfriend and her nephew.

Finally, his "saving" of Mc Caleb was just an ego trip, and a way to permanently horrify him with the knowledge that his life was saved at the cost of 3 innocents.

Heinousness?

Numerous murders we learn from his files and the backstory, 4 in the actual book, trying to starve an innocent woman and child to death, and attempting to "mentally break" his, one-sided, "nemesis." Yeah…

Note: This is a trilogy of books, so there's a chance someone could surpass him, but I doubt it. This won't be like the Daniel X situation either, where I propose villains from 3 different books within a few hours, since just this first one took me quite a while to read.

Final Verdict?

edited 23rd Sep '15 5:33:24 AM by Ravok