Likes and dislikes about TV Tropes

Despite its limitations in conversation I actually like the fact that this place does try to keep a positive tone most of the time too. It's one of the few places where abhorrent posters are kept in check.

It sounds like from reading the rules about lolicon and shotacon in the anime and manga section. And hearing about what TV Tropes did about it, that TV Tropes might be taking too extreme of a stance.

I mean, some people have really questionable BDSM kinks, I wonder if that's banned, too?

I don't like sexualizing children, but I also don't like BDSM and some of that worries me. But I'm told that's kink shaming if I do that. So, wouldn't something like this be a kind of kink shaming, too? I'm often told that BDSM, even as disturbing and questionable as some of it sounds, can be safe and consensual and just fantasy. Can't that also apply to other things? Or is BDSM not allowed on TV Tropes, either?

And also, even though sexualizing children, and I believe some BDSM feelings are bad and unhealthy, just like lolicon and shotacon. It's really, really widespread in anime and manga. I'm afraid of what anime and manga I can talk about, when most anime and manga nowadays has lolicon and shotacon content. What anime and manga can I and can't I talk about?

It's not that I want to talk about lolicon and shotacon... I'm just not sure about what anime and anime things I can talk about..

And do people mean actual underage characters, is anyone under 18 a loli and any character under 18 who is sexualized lolicon? Or is loli a body type and if they look "too young", they're seen as lolis and discussions about them are banned? Because anime and manga have a lot of adult lolis nowadays.

Because um... most anime and manga today have both. Most anime are about school children. And most of them are sexualized, even the ones made for children. And most anime today seem to have an adult loli or shota character.

So I just wonder what kind of anime I can talk about and what people can say. I'm afraid it might be too strict. But I am new here, and I don't know what all happened.

Toradora is one of my favourite romance anime. Is talking about that allowed? Or is that considered lolicon? I like Honey and Clover, too. Is this all okay?

I don't know much about TV Tropes yet. But what I hear makes me a little bit afraid to talk about two of my favourite romance anime, Toradora and Honey and Clover.

edited 25th Jan '15 8:06:52 PM by RobotPrincess

You only have to be afraid of talking about it if you are going to be a creepy, obsessive weirdo about it. Lolicon and Shotacon exists whether we talk about it or not, same with BDSM. If those who want to discuss it don't decide to be myopic perverts it's fine.

Oh, good. I was worried I wasn't going to be able to talk about some of my favourite anime.

Regarding the comments that we don't have enough analysis of tropes, you guys do know that you can make an Analysis.Trope Name Here page for that, don't you?

...for some reason I was under the impression that namespace was only supposed to be used for works. Checking the namespace index, I don't know how I got that idea. Thanks, Maddy.

Oy, has it been that long since the 5P thing started? Anyway, RobotPrincess, I'd suggest reading The Content Policy and the 5P Circuit to get a better idea of what passes and what doesn't - and for the sake of your own peace of mind.

edited 26th Jan '15 6:52:32 AM by Pyrite

@ Maddy: To put it differently, my issue (and it's really a minor one that isn't interfering with my ability to sleep at night) is that many of the trope pages, particularly shonen anime, are cluttered with tropes that serve solely descriptive purposes. For example, pointing out that a character has blue hair doesn't really do much unless there's a plot-specific reason why that character has blue hair. There's also the issue (again, a really minor one) of using multiple tropes of similar nature to describe a character, action or setting. You don't need Woobie, Destroyer of Worlds, Dark and Troubled Past, Shoot the Dog, Broken Bird and Break the Cutie to analyze the basic fact that the character in question has a history of neglect and abuse and is volatile as a result. Just pick one or two and hit the broad points.

People have been making an effort to trim some of the more bloated trope pages, so it's not like the problem isn't being addressed.

Aprilla ah, though much of that is a problem inherent in having an open wiki at all. People add shit. Sometimes it's good shit and sometimes it's... not. The only way to get rid of it completely would be to lock down the wiki and only allow editing by a carefully vetted group of people who have demonstrated (How? I haven't even the foggiest ghost of a shadow of a clue.) that they comprehensively understand what makes a trope different from simple pattern, and how to read for comprehension and who understand slight nuances. And who write proper grammatical English. And who are well versed in fiction, whether over a broad range or in a one narrow area.

edited 26th Jan '15 10:55:52 AM by Madrugada

You know, that IS a good point.

I've been a troper for a little over a year now, and what I can say is this:

What I like about TV Tropes:

- The Useful Notes within some tropes is actually quite informative.

- There are some interesting characters here and there.

- The entries and tropes are described in a way that's useful, but doesn't take itself too seriously.

- It's possible to find new works to enjoy that one's never heard of prior.

- The forums (at least, from what I've seen) tend to be well-kept and don't seem to suffer from too many trolls/spammers/ etc.

What I dislike about TV Tropes:

- Ever since the updates were announced but not released, it takes longer to load any page. While it's not as awful as it used to be, it's still a bit of a nuisance to need to reload every other page because it keeps timing out.

- At times the community can feel really exclusive, and it often seems unintentional.

- Occasionally the formatting and I don't agree with one another.

edited 26th Jan '15 11:48:23 AM by ParadoxialStratagem

The Useful Notes section rocks.

Mine entertainment library has grown considerably because of TV Tropes. There are some great books, graphic novels, video games and other media I've found that I never would have known about had it not been for this community and the pages.

It was thanks to this here website that I found out about xkcd. :)

@Aprilla: To be fair, You Gotta Have Blue Hair isn't about blue hair specifically, but rather about hair colour as a lazy way of making characters look different when they'd be hard to tell apart otherwise. You definitely have a point about overly specific tropes, though.

Anyway, as for my "likes", let me repeat what I said in my 'thank you Fast Eddie' post:

Yeah, I really like the forums.

The wiki is great too, though. It's an absolute treasure trove of information, but what I like most about it is the tone: it's informal and snarky, but unlike, say, Cracked, it doesn't take it too far and get cynical or smug.

Now for the downsides. I'll rank them from least to most annoying. First off, still quoting from the same post, this isn't so much a dislike as a "could be better":

Secondly, I mentioned that I like the wiki's balance between serious and snarky, but sometimes it feels like it's slowly drifting further towards the "serious" end – in other words, becoming more like The Other Wiki. The renaming of the "You Fail X Forever" tropes to "Artistic Licence – X" is a sign of this, and though that happened ages ago, I still disagree with it. "You Fail X Forever" not only sounded funnier, I also think that it was a lot more correct – that in most cases, the examples on those pages really are due to ignorance or indifference on the creators' part, rather than a knowing decision to use "artistic licence".

I can't think of any other specific examples right now, but I feel like the wiki has gotten a little stiffer in its bones over the past few years – more neutral, more "professional", but also more boring.

Thirdly, the community is sometimes a little too focused on stereotypically "geeky" interests – superhero comics, tabletop RPGs, anime, etc. – for my taste. I'm not interested in most of those things, and actively dislike some of them. (Especially superhero comics. Franco-Belgian Comics master race!) Then again, the charm of TV Tropes is its inclusiveness: even if you like different things than most tropers, the community is large and varied enough that there's almost always a place for you on the forums.

Fourthly, there's so much angst flying around. There seem to be worryingly many people who are using this site not as a fun complement to Real Life, but as a refuge from it. As a result, we have disproportionately many users who are struggling with depression, anxiety, low self-esteem, crippling shyness, etc..

This is one of the reasons why I miss the Nunnery: by its nature, it attracted people who were (on average) more confident and comfortable with themselves than, say, the Romance crowd.

edited 27th Jan '15 1:03:03 PM by MidnightRambler

I know; I miss the Nunnery too. I remember Volatile Chills was one of the biggest fans of the dreams I would share.

Oh yes, Volatile Chills. Good times.

As I already stated before, one reason why I enjoy this site less is due to the fact that, as I'm very passionately obsessed with certain things, you would think that I could find some like-minded people, but I feel a bit disappointed when I hardly find anyone like me. I guess I can't really blame me or anyone, we all have different tastes after all.

@Midnight Rambler: You can count me as being one of many people on this site who angst a lot. Yes it's true, I spend way too much time here due to personal issues.

He's still here, just mostly hangs in the Romance thread from what I've seen.

I like the variety of story ideas available on Tvtropes. I dislike the Grammar Nazis and how difficult the forum is to navigate.

10/10 would create HOPEY tree again.

I'm pretty satisfied with the site as a whole, as well as the forums. I love the laidback atmosphere and the informality, combined with the relative lack of lag.

Indeed I'm not. I'm using a laptop.

edited 9th Feb '15 4:31:00 PM by Weirdguy149

Lack of lag? You must not be browsing on a mobile phone.

I tried browsing TV Tropes on a mobile phone. Yeah, don't do that.

It's better now, the lag is finally gone. And I think the mobile site is better than the normal site once was on mobile.