Ambiguous Name: Morally Ambiguous Ducktorate

"Ducks could be anywhere on the good/bad scale"? That doesn't strike me as much of a trope. More like the lack of one.

That is not a trope.

Not anywhere, somewhere in the middle. "Ducks are neutral or unknown" or "Ducks are neither good or bad, they just are" would be closer. And this isn't about ducks as a whole, ie "one duck is there, and an other duck is somewhere else on the scale", this is "this particular duck is all over the place ending up being morally ambiguous and this other duck is just neutral."

Edit:Or "Ducks are morally ambiguous or neutral," instead of "Ducks are evil or morally ambiguous" as an laconic.

edited 3rd Aug '13 11:45:21 AM by m8e

...but they're really not.

I'm really not a fan of the "morally ambiguous" wording, because I can't think of many ducks in fiction that are "neutral" or otherwise "ambiguous". So-called trope namer Donald Duck is clearly a good guy, with Jerk with a Heart of Gold tendencies and a lot of Depending on the Writer. Daffy Duck? Cloud Cuckoolander more than anything else, but if push come to shove also clearly a good guy. Darkwing Duck? Clearly a good guy again. Sure, you can call them Anti-Hero, but as noted earlier, "Anti-Hero who happens to be a duck" is really not a distinct trope from the main Anti-Hero.

Well, both Daffy and Donald have been used as both propagonists and antagonists. Donald have have been mean to chipmunks, bees, bears, ants and a few other animals, even tried to kill some of them. Daffy have tried to get Bugs Bunny shot. Basically kill him by proxy.

Darkwing is more interested a getting his picture in the paper than actually doing the good thing. He might not really fit the trope but tropes don't have to be Omnipresent.

Howard the Duck isn't really placable either, and Arne Anka have given us quotes like "All relationships end in lies! Lie from the beginning, at least then you are honest!" and "I say like the chinese, the future is like a baboons arse, colorful and full of shit."

edited 3rd Aug '13 12:20:50 PM by m8e

I think perhaps we could have a trope about talking ducks as comic characters, and call it Wise Quacker.

That sounds like it's about ducks being portrayed as wise, which is already reserved in the avian market.

Talking Animal BUT IT'S A DUCK!

The thing about ducks is that they're kind of average, at least as far as birds go. Average size, no polarising characteristics, and while they're not predators, they've got a temper. Which really makes them good for an ambiguous role, or one that changes depending on what the other characters are (Donald is a prime example of that).

And they're totally awesome.

So, Tropeless Duck?

No, generic and ambiguous doesn't mean tropeless, it's really the opposite. They are flexible and can fill a lot of different roles/fit a lot of tropes.

For example bears are generaly limited to the extremes, being either really Bad News or very 'beary' funny//Friendly, bears in the middle are the aversions. Ducks is the opposite, they fills the roles in the wide middle and the extremes is the aversions. They are the generic (albeit clumsy and badly tempered) ones just like humans, they are the ones that can be a jerkasses one moment and Pet the Dog and be kind the next, they are the ones that can be a Jerk with a Heart of Gold, but not be a complete jerk or just have a heart of gold.

edited 10th Aug '13 2:02:36 PM by m8e

The thing is, Donald and Daffy usually switch between The Lancer and Sit Com Arch Nemesis. (At least Daffy does in The Looney Tunes Show, being merely the latter in the old Looney Tunes shorts. Donald in the earlier days either was or suffered SCANs, depending on your point of view.) And yet, there was enough deviance there (at least compared to Mickey and Bugs) to inspire the Snow Clone...

Agree that, off-hand that, the name implies "evil ducks", but the examples go for either Anti-Hero or Sit Com Arch Nemesis; in fact, as said before, the co-makers are more of the latter.

The Trope title should be merged with Feathered Fiend. The Trope itself... only really exists because Warner Brothers and Disney decided to make their eventual (corporate-)Lancers ducks EDIT: and is actually "Ducks are the stock standard Western Animation Sit Com Arch Nemesis".

edited 17th Aug '13 9:08:50 AM by DonaldthePotholer

I'm not sure if such a thing even is a trope.

I get that Sit Com Arch Nemesis is a trope, and that this is a role often fulfilled by Donald Duck and to a lesser extent Daffy. However, that doesn't mean that SitcomArchNemesis Who Is A Duck qualifies as a separate trope.

I guess the issue ultimately on the table is whether Follow the Leader or Strange Minds Think Alike can create Tropes wholecloth by themselves (i.e. without any further basis or justification).

And I too lean towards "no". So, I recommend migrating^note Pun unintended the examples between Feathered Fiend, Anti-Hero, and Sit Com Arch Nemesis, then redirect the name to the first.

While "ducks are morally neutral" migth be a trope, this thing isn't.

So aye, toss the examples and wicks and cut or redirect this.

Clocking.