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Ambiguous Name: Candlelit Bath
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Total posts: [60]
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Ambiguous Name: Candlelit Bath get usage counts

Piffy
Okay, just by looking at the name, were you able to tell it was a horror trope?

The page claims that candlelit baths only happen when someone's about to get murdered, but I'm skeptical, and it's certainly not an instant association I have.

I think something like "Deadly Candlelit Bath" or "Candlelit Baths Summon Murderers" or basically anything that indicates the murder part would be much better.

(Edit because I was using wikidot italics markup. Whoops.)

edited 13th Sep '12 8:20:17 PM by Pig_catapult

Because underscores break everything: Working link to my Troper page
The obvious solution is a trope transplant, and turn Candlelit Bath into a fanservice supertrope.
 3 nrjxll, Thu, 13th Sep '12 8:41:43 PM Relationship Status: Not war
Okay, just by looking at the name, were you able to tell it was a horror trope?

Heck no.

Ditto Discar.

I'm not sure what would be fanservicey about a Candlelit Bath.

 5 nrjxll, Thu, 13th Sep '12 8:53:35 PM Relationship Status: Not war
Nothing in particular about the candlelit part (at least that comes to mind), but bath scenes tend to be fanservicy.

Although now that I think about it, I fail to see what adding candles does to distinguish something from an ordinary bath scene anyway.

 6 Septimus Heap, Thu, 13th Sep '12 11:32:28 PM from Valle di Muggio Relationship Status: Mu
Christmas worms
Do we have any evidence that it's indeed ambiguous instead of just "I don't understand it"? Especially since
but I'm skeptical, and it's certainly not an instant association I have.
needs a citation.

In uffish thought
I don't see any need for a rename unless there is significant misuse as a non-horror trope. The name doesn't have to show everything.

[up][up] Candlelit baths are traditionally quiet, peaceful, possibly romantic, relaxing since the candles may be scented, etc.. As a horror trope, I expect the contrast to be emphasised.
Well, I was half expecting to see the old color scheme, but it is old enough that it didn't really need a YKTTW... or any starting examples, for that matter. So it might be from the time when we were overdefining tropes.

 9 Spark 9, Fri, 14th Sep '12 3:22:30 AM from Castle Wulfenbach Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Gentleman Troper!
I concur with Discar.
Special trousers. Very heroic.
 10 Another Duck, Fri, 14th Sep '12 3:26:30 AM from Stockholm Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
I'd want a misuse check before agreeing on a rename.
Check out my fanfiction!
 11 Septimus Heap, Fri, 14th Sep '12 3:27:59 AM from Valle di Muggio Relationship Status: Mu
Christmas worms
Ditto, and where is the fanservice? I only see a murder/accident trope here.

Welcome, traveller, welcome to Omsk
I'm going to be incredibly original and concur with Discar.
It does not matter who I am. What matters is, who will you become? - motto of Omsk Bird
 13 Michael, Fri, 14th Sep '12 5:55:07 AM Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
So that's what this does
I've seen a few shows with candlelit baths taking place and don't remember anyone getting murdered in them.
Balance - the original sixth sense.
For what is supposedly "invariably the point where" something bad happens, there sure are a lot of aversions listed in the page's examples! Something like half of the examples are non-examples where either nothing scary or upsetting happens, or something interrupts the bath, but it's not horrifying or dangerous. I would classify such non-examples as "misuse". (There ARE a few legitimate subversions listed, where we're set up to expect a murder in the tub but it doesn't happen.)

Certainly it's common that something terrible interrupts the bath, because just watching somebody go in for a bath is kind of pointless from a narrative perspective unless it's just for the fanservice, and horror tends to attack people who are in a vulnerable state (and it's hard to get more vulnerable than naked and relaxing). But it's hardly universal.

Here's a breakdown for the examples on the page itself:

Correct Use - Played straight or true subversion

Misuse - The bath is not interrupted, or is interrupted by something mundane

Iffy - I couldn't decide.

  • Glade Wisp Flameless Candles (I can't watch the video while at work)
  • Foxtrot (not sure if this is a real subversion or not; Quincy in the bath is treated as horrific)
  • Poltergeist (nothing bad happens in the bath, but it is used as a device to raise the tension)
  • Sherlock Holmes (I can't recall if anything horrible actually happens in the bath.)
  • Desperate Romantics (I don't think this is a real use of the trope, but I'm not sure.)

So, we have nearly 50% misuse (41%-54% depending on the iffy ones) on the PAGE ITSELF, where it clearly says at the top that this is a horror trope.

I think there's enough "aversions" listed on the page alone to justify a rename and steer this away from the omnipresence it claims.

edited 14th Sep '12 7:42:11 AM by Escher

 
 15 Another Duck, Fri, 14th Sep '12 9:09:41 AM from Stockholm Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
[up]Nicely done. I agree with a transplant. There are clearly two tropes in play.

edited 14th Sep '12 9:10:21 AM by AnotherDuck

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There are clearly a lot of candlelit baths that do not signify horror. We have not established multiple tropes.

 17 Another Duck, Fri, 14th Sep '12 9:42:12 AM from Stockholm Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
I think there are two, though one's a subtrope of the other. Then again, that's only if you define "taking a candlelit bath" as a trope in itself.

In a horror story, if someone takes a candlelit bath, doom. It's a fairly classic scene. If you skip the mood lighting, or take a shower, there's only a slightly lower risk of doom. There aren't that many listed examples of that, though, since horror stories tend to be more of the B-Movie kind, and thus more forgettable.

edited 14th Sep '12 9:43:57 AM by AnotherDuck

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Piffy
I think there's probably some sort of "Candlelit Baths Are Relaxing and/or Sensual" sort of trope to be had here, which is what the horror trope derives its punch from, but can, as the 50% misuse suggests, still occur without the horror trope.

ETA: Should we start a crowner? There seems to be multiple issues at hand here. First being "do we rename?", and second being "is there a Missing Supertrope?".

edited 14th Sep '12 4:27:21 PM by Pig_catapult

Because underscores break everything: Working link to my Troper page
 19 Blue Guy, Mon, 17th Sep '12 5:48:29 PM from Bella Vista, Arkansas Relationship Status: Holding out for a hero
zzz...
[up] Yeah, a Page Action crowner would do wonders.
I don't think it's a missing supertrope as much as a series of related tropes.

Bathtub Scene is the supertrope. Subtropes include:

Candlelit Bath: A romantic bath setting with candlelight, bubbles, rose petals, or other such accoutrements, which can be a setup for almost any other bathing trope, but almost always either romantic or horrific. Deadly Bath endings are common because the extensive calm setup makes the suddenly violent end more shocking.

Deadly Bath: A bathing scene ends with the bather getting killed (or, rarely, something otherwise awful happening to them). This is commonly because of an Electrified Bathtub, Bath Suicide, or "Psycho" Shower Murder Parody. May lead to a Blood Bath.

edited 18th Sep '12 8:09:16 AM by Escher

 
 21 Spark 9, Tue, 18th Sep '12 8:21:03 AM from Castle Wulfenbach Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Gentleman Troper!
[up] Well said.
Special trousers. Very heroic.
Welcome, traveller, welcome to Omsk
[up][up]I agree with this summary.
It does not matter who I am. What matters is, who will you become? - motto of Omsk Bird
[up][up][up]yes

 24 Another Duck, Wed, 19th Sep '12 7:16:39 AM from Stockholm Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
[up][up][up][up]That pretty much matches what I was thinking. Didn't know Bathtub Scene was a specific trope, though.
Check out my fanfiction!
Piffy
[up][up][up][up][up]Sixthing.
Because underscores break everything: Working link to my Troper page

Page Action: Candlelit Bath
30th Sep '12 12:35:22 PM
What would be the best way to fix the page?
At issue:
Total posts: 60
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