Five-Man Band has been receiving a lot of misuse. As was concluded in this TRS thread
, it needs a massive cleanup. There are over 30 subpages and almost 3500 wicks to be gone through. This thread is for organizing the cleanup effort and discussing any and all examples to be added and cut.
What is correct use of the trope?
- The characters must be part of a team, that is, a team dynamic must exist between members of the band.
- There must be exactly 5 team members
Format for examples
In an effort to cut down on misuse as well as get rid of all the Zero Context Examples, we are trying to shift all examples to the following format. If you are familiar with a current work and can do a writeup for it, please do so and post it here.
The sandbox for sorting examples is here.
Completed
Subpages:
- Other (Moved and redirected to a Just for Fun page, as that is what is was acting as.)
Still needs work
Wicks (Related To page):
- B-V
I will keep this post updated with the progress made, and any other needed information.
Edited by MacronNotes on May 19th 2022 at 8:59:40 AM
The wifi here sucks
Ok I looked it up and nothing on The Other Wiki talks about Voryn Dagoth fitting The Big Guy role but the wiki didn't delve into the war itself and only talks about the First Council, the page on the war itself doesn't mention him much except saying that he was at the Battle of Red Mountain. I'd say take it off as there isn't enough information to say weather or not he fits that role.
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The wifi here sucks
I'd like to bring up a discussion that was never resolved, Should The Dark Chick be exclusively female in a Five Bad Band and should Five Bad Band be edit locked to avoid misuse.
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In my opinion, Dark Chick should be exclusively female. The only way I'd say otherwise is if it were renamed.
I'd like to see Five Bad Band edit locked so bad examples stop getting in.
edited 24th Nov '17 12:25:04 PM by ChaoticNovelist
agree on Dark Chick being female, since those are the only ones that usually even fit the Dark Chick description.
all the male examples are more like The Wacky Guy or Bunny-Ears Lawyer, which we could make like an Oddball Villain TLP for.
edited 24th Nov '17 1:18:31 PM by acrobox
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I'm with you guys on this one though some examples of The Dark Chick just shoehorn a character that doesn't fit the other role into it without being The Wacky Guy or Bunny-Ears Lawyer.
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those should probably be cut outright as misuse
Blapper of Water
I just found Semiautomagic Inc. and there's a Five-Man Band example that I'm not sure about because the roles are "simultaneously played straight and subverted." Of note is The Chick which seems to be "suberted" simply because the character is a girl but not The Chick...? It's a little confusing, honestly.
- Five-Man Band: Almost all of them simultaneously played straight and subverted.
- The Leader: Solomon is nominally in charge of the task force and has the best access to resources and intel through the WC, but is easily flustered and hilariously bad under pressure.
- The Lancer: Rowan consistently casts his vote against what the party decides and questions Solomon's orders and fitness to lead, but only because he actually has a huge amount of respect for him, is super emotional and reads way too far into things and their implications for his and Solmon's friendship, which he deeply values.
- The Smart Guy: Piroa plays this fairly straight and will Science at most things, but is also perfectly willing to 'fuck up a middle school' and accept that sometimes the answer is just magic.
- The Big Guy: Wake is definitely big, definitely punching you at this moment, but also very intelligent, eager to learn and deeply emotional, problems surrounding which become a minor character theme late in the first season.
- The Chick: Subverted hardest of all, as Fiona is certainly a girl, but eschews nearly every traditional The Girl trait such as gentleness, preferring words over conflict, providing the team a sense of comfort and emotional nurturing, and serving as a love interest for one of the guys by instead having Piroa serve as one for her.
Edit: I forgot to mention but, for whatever reason, The Smart Guy was potholed in "The Science," and I think that actually is important to the question at hand for this example because it seems that he isn't The Smart Guy (given the context here) but is rather a "science-affiliated character" or something along those lines. This is also why the entry says that he "will Science." It might just be a joke in the work.
edited 5th Dec '17 11:54:28 AM by WaterBlap
Look at all that shiny stuff ain't they pretty
World's Toughest Milkman
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Sounds like someone spotted a superficial resemblance to FMB, and pulled out their shoehorn. Granted, it does sound closer than most shoehorns we see, but I'm still pretty dubious. Especially, as you say, about The Chick.
No firm vote either way, yet, but....
Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.
Something can't be "simultaneously played straight and subverted". The Chick is just incorrect and so the whole things falls apart. The Smart Guy is also dubious.
World's Toughest Milkman
Agreed, but half the people on this wiki don't seem to know what "subverted" means in the first place. People often use that combination to describe a parodied trope...
...But in the absence of any actual evidence to support that idea, we should probably cut.
Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.
Blapper of Water
Actually the entry for The Chick seems to be saying "She isn't the chick because The Smart Guy is also the chick." I have an axe here with which to cut if that''s okay here...
Look at all that shiny stuff ain't they pretty
The first four actually seem fine to me. They aren't subverted, they take the archetypes on the surface but are well rounded characters that have some additional flaws or interests.
The Leader could be under a lot of pressure
The Lancer can have a lot of respect for the leader.
The Smart Guy can have a Let's Get Dangerous! moment.
The Big Guy could be a Genius Bruiser or a Gentle Giant at heart.
The only one that's weird is The Chick because it spends the whole time listing things she isn't, instead of explaining who she is. But she still gets Ship Tease with The Leader.
edited 5th Dec '17 7:25:00 PM by acrobox
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I think we should either cut it or contact hoteltheotokos as they were the one to put that trope in.
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The wifi here sucks
I think we should put a link to Overly Sarcastic Productions on the page image of Five-Man Band as that's where it comes from. Also in regards to the Five Bad Band discussions I've ben bringing up should Five Bad Band have the same Male to female restrictions (Token Girl or Two Girls to a Team) as Five-Man Band?
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I'd really rather see it changed to including a Bunny-Ears Lawyer type since that's what the trope has evolved into over time.
But I guess we could do a crowner?
And yes please credit where credit it due for trope images.
What trope has evolved into Bunny-Ears Lawyer?
Also, we can't just change an ensemble trope because something "evolved". That would make everything else incorrect.
Tyrannoraptoran Reptiliomorph
It's also on the wrong Image Source page. Where should it go instead? Nevermind, I fixed it.
Are we allowed to discuss removing the gender restrictions on Five-Man Band, or is the trope locked the way it is permanently? (I'd guess the latter, but I still think it's worthy of discussion).
edited 6th Jan '18 8:12:14 AM by Lymantria
Join the Five-Man Band cleanup project!
The wifi here sucks
If you want to discuss the gender restrictions in a Five-Man Band talk to Fast Eddie that's what it says at the beginning of this discussion thread, I believe talking about it in Five Bad Band is allowed here.
edited 6th Jan '18 4:27:22 PM by papyru30
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Tyrannoraptoran Reptiliomorph
How do I contact him? I though he didn't own the site anymore.
edited 6th Jan '18 4:26:15 PM by Lymantria
Join the Five-Man Band cleanup project!
The wifi here sucks
If that's true and there's no way to contact him (I need a second person's help with this) then we should probably contact an Admin or mod but don't do that until someone else can confirm that we can't contact him.
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The Unknown
You can (I think he's still a mod under a different handle), but it won't do much since he lacks the fiat he used to have.
Also, while I can't speak for anybody else, I'm totally not down with changing the allowed gender ratio. The trope is largely archaic and based on a very specific setup, plus it's already misused a fuckton.
edited 6th Jan '18 6:08:05 PM by Karxrida
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Tyrannoraptoran Reptiliomorph
"Lacks the fiat"? Who should I contact, then?
Join the Five-Man Band cleanup project!
Coolant Jammer Beta, Model 42
I have a suggestion which may help alleviate some complaints on the gender without changing what the trope is. I agree that the gender roles are a necessary part of this trope, being a holdover from when it was common. I may eventually support a new page for Red Oni, Blue Oni, and a Freudian Trio, but for now it seems to me that people mostly agree this trope is not used anymore, and if it were, it would be considered sexist. However, there is absolutely nothing in the article to indicate this. Rather, by my reading it suggests it is still very commonly used a storytelling tool. I would recommend adding a couple of sentences to the end of the description labelling the trope as discredited, maybe throwing in a pothole to Values Dissonance for good measure.
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Blapper of Water
But Five-Man Band isn't discredited. Were The Chick the only woman in the band (inherently in the trope), then maybe. But there's nothing stopping a creator from having The Smart Guy or The Big Guy also be women, and The Leader isn't required to be a particular gender either. Same with The Lancer. There's nothing in the trope disqualifying an all-female team.
Unless you're saying the fact that there can't be an all-male team is sexist. But even then I wouldn't say "this is a discredited trope because it can't be five dudes."
Concerning the requirement on The Chick to be a woman, I'd say that having a particular type of female character as The Heart would differentiate itself from having just "is female + The Heart". I'm pretty sure that's already the case, though the article for The Chick implies the chick is just The Heart but female.
If it comes down to changing Five-Man Band or The Chick, I think it would make more sense to change The Chick relative to The Heart.
Look at all that shiny stuff ain't they pretty
I'd say comment it out and read up on the characters on The Other Wiki to figure out if they fit or not.
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