Discussion Characters / PokemonGenerationIXFamilies

I'd wait until the Tinkatink to Miraidon page gives a too-long warning before potentially moving the folders over to whatever we split them into.

Fair enough.

Well it has been long enough and both dlc are out and eventually third one. So is change possible now?

I still feel the same as in ^^^.

I think the dlc-introduced pokemon should be in their own page.

Its what we did for the DLC Pokemon for sword and shield. its not so different for these.

• Pecharunt appears to have an Et Tu, Brute? moment if you send out a member of the Loyal Three against it.
• Ogerpon will seemingly recognize Pecharunt as the Loyal Three's master if sent out against it, and her cries indicate she's pissed off.
• Nemona appears to be able to resist Pecharunt's control to a degree- she only battles you because she wants to anyway, and she wanders off all over the place before ending up at Loyalty Plaza.

It's nice we have these bits, given the story text itself never explains the link between them as far as I know.

Worthy tropes to add onto Pecharunt section.

Don't forget Love Makes You Evil! After all, the only reason Pecharunt started doing the messed-up things it did was because it wanted the old couple to dote on it a lot!

It acted like a spoiled child who had no idea what actions it was causing or the fate Ogerpon would do to it.

Moreover it was not even aware there had been a violent encounter between the Loyal Three and Ogerpon's trainer.

That too

It's still clearly evil and childish, and there are a lot of indications that it understands it's actions are cruel such as when it laughs at Kieran and the player before setting Nemona against them.

In addition, all it's actions in the DLC are far too calculated such as tricking the husband into eating Mochi by controlling his wife. From this we can summarize that it understands it's actions are cruel.

To quote a youtube comment that sums my thoughts on Pecharunt's alignment quite well:

No Pecharunt was 100% acting with ill intent. Pecharunt is representing "unchecked greed". It had a good and happy life with its owners, but it cared more about getting "more love and attention". Thus it bewitched them, which in turn made them also become greedy.

Pecharunt came to Kitikami to get the masks not because it wanted to make its masters happy, no it came to get them cause when they got what they wanted, they gave Pecharunt what IT wanted.

Excessive greed is malicious in nature, even if the person is greedy for something "positive" like affection.

Pecharunts greed for "more love than it already had" led to Ogerpon, a creature who was "happy with what she had" to lose everything.

Pecharunts goals were entirely self-serving meaning its actions are inherently malicious

Certainly selfish, but it seems ambiguous how malicious it was. The story told from Pecharunt's perspective makes it unclear if it even understands it is subjugating others instead of befriending or recruiting them. After all, if it did understand then why not just make the couple lavish it with more affection?

Perenite is correct, its is ambiguous on how Pecharunt truly is and Intention.

They did lavish it with more affection.

The greed that Pecharunt corrupted them with just gave them a bit more autonomy. The narration makes it clear that it KNOWS it enslaved them to it's will, and just goes along with the requests to get more affection and to have fun. It's entirely possible that Pecharunt's affection for the couple gave them a bit more autonomy despite the spell.

And it's clearly malicious in Mochi Mayhem since again, it laughs at Kieran and the player while also knowingly enslaving the entire village to get revenge.

It laughs certainly, but how do we know it was malicious instead of simply playing or happy it had gotten such a powerful new "companion"? It's not like it was making Nemona behave maliciously, she was friendly and simply demanding a pokemon battle rather than attacking.

It’s laughing at their reaction tho. The one with fear. And it’s clearly treating Nemona as a pawn to attack the player with.

Don’t forget how it also used Kieran’s grandma to trick her husband into eating the mochi.

Anyways, I’ll discuss this later, I’m going to sleep.

Were Kieran and our character afraid? I mean Kieran outright said "I shoulda figured" when seeing Nemona was possessed. He wasn't exactly panicking at the time.

And certainly Pecharunt knows its mochi has some effect on people and pokemon and seeks to have them eat it if it wants something from them. But given how the story refers to it in its view simply "taming" the Loyal Three, making them its companions, etc. it's possible its childish mind sees the mochi as being so good that people who eat it will want to follow it and care for it.

I dunno, the narration does have a sympathetic POV for Pecharunt, but even then it makes it clear Pecharunt did enslave the couple out of it's own greed for affection. Even Pecharunt is glaring ominously at the camera as the couple eat the mochi implying that it knows.

And the narration does explain Pecharunt's emotions and feelings like how it sees the Loyal Three as friends, but doesn't really imply it doesn't know Pecharunt is unaware of it's own power. The video even says that it tamed and made the Loyal Three it's retainers rather than befriending them.

That said, I do believe that Pecharunt is genuine friends with the Loyal Three in spite of the shady nature of their relationship, and while the video does give more evidence that the Loyal Three and Pecharunt killed Ogerpon's friend, I'll cut some slack on Pecharunt since the video does indicate it doesn't know what the Loyal Three did, and the Loyal Three are portrayed as acting in self defense despite still clearly being in the wrong.

Ogerpon still did nothing wrong.

What I think is that Pecharunt is meant to be a Troubled Abuser. It wants affection and love, not out of malice, but seemingly out of fear it will lose the love of their caretakers. It fed them the mochi simply to reciprocate their love because it believed doing that would make their bond stronger. But it backfired, and being enthralled by Pecharunt made them start making demands, demands that Pecharunt fulfilled because it was scared they wouldn't love it anymore.

I like that is makes sense.

The story impiled in english seems to hint he may have died given the story ends with Ogerpon retruning alone. and he is not mentioned again.

If all we can say is it hints at it then it may be best to tone down the mentions of the trio being evil killers.

Was going to post this, but yes, it's never even stated that they're killers unlike the second Raidon. People in the other side just speculated he's dead.

Corrected BTW.

I gotta echo this sentiment, as it is the entry makes too many assumptions claiming Terapagos is the Unknown Pokemon, when nothing official has been said and what can be gleaned from its appearance is simply that it is related in some way to the Unknown Pokemon.

If anything is the the two paradox Pokémon from book along with Walking Wake and Iron Leaves.

I'd suggest adding them all to the Tinkatink-Miraidon half and renaming it to mention one of the newbies - probably Terapagos since it'll debut in the second part and therefore likely come after the rest in the dex.

While Terapagos almost definitely is that mysterious Pokémon from the sketch, we should probably leave those tropes there until Indigo Disk comes out.

Since we don't have Dex Numbers yet I'd leave them on the main page here and move them once we have them.

That way once dex entry arrives, we can then move them in

give paradox pokemon their own page

And split the rest in either two or three pages.

Discussing it here

Maybe we should wait until we get some/any actual lore on them, since they don't have dex entries and the sketches actually look very different from the actual pokemon?

Given the strong evidence that they have no true relation to their modern counterparts (as I've heard it, the supposed "time machine" in the game is drawing from pasts/futures that don't actually exist but have simply been imagined, and the professor is not aware of this), I'd say they should get their own page, at least once the current page is big enough to warrant separation.

I'd give them their own page since they're like Ultra Beasts in that they're very distinct from other Pokemon.

Bringing this topic back up since we're hitting the word limit. An easy way to fix this is to separate the Paradox Pokémon into their own page, since that alone eats up a lot of the words.

I believe from a guide, but I kinda wish people would wait until actually clean ones came out because there's many that look like ass because they were poorly scanned.

ye they do look rather crusty and in some cases having japanese symbols over them like meowscarada and dachbun

Was just about to ask this same question myself, lol It's cool that we did get official artwork of the Paldean Pokémon, but it is kind of iffy that a lot of the scans are not the best quality so far.

sadly won't stop people from adding them regardless.

Well we've got proper art for the starter evos, Gholdengo, and the Paradox mons now.

And now we've got official artwork for the whole Dex.

I'm the one who added most of them in. Either way, they were going to get replaced, so might as well give people something in the meantime to leave the pages less barren-looking. Besides, Bulbapedia uploaded some of the art first, like Dachsbun, so I figured it would be fair game.

But now that we've got official art of every Pokémon now, we're definitely going to do a clean-up. Anything that's in this list needs their images replaced/added as soon as the renders officially get released:

• Starter Evos (the images are mostly fine, we just need ones without the outline)

• Both Oinkologne Forms (we're gonna need ones with transparent backgrounds and no artifacts)

• Tarountula, Nymble, Tandemaus, Nacli, Maschiff, Bramblin, Toedscool, Capsakid, Rellor, Flittle, Tinkatink, Finizen, Varoom, Glimmet, and Frigibax lines

• Pawmo & Pawmot (we need to upload Pawmot)

• Dachsbun

• Dolliv & Arboliva

• Squawkabilly

• Charcadet

• Tadbulb

• Shroodle

• Wugtrio

• Bombirdier

• Orthworm

• Houndstone

• Flamigo

• Cetoddle

• Veluza

• Dondozo

• Tatsugiri (we need to upload the Stretchy and Droopy forms as well)

• All Paradox Pokémon (sans the Raidons. I know a couple of them have official art released on the official site, but see the Starter Evos)

• Gholdengo (same deal as Starter Evos)

• Treasures of Ruin

Make sure to forward this to the other pages that have Paldea/Paldean stuff, Clodsire, Dudunsparce, Annihilape, the Paldean Tauroses, and Kingambit fall into the same deal.

We have official artwork for all gen 9 pokemon now https://zukan.pokemon.co.jp/?area%5B%5D=10&no_min=1&no_max=1008

I'd say possibly? There are more than enough pages, but the pages themselves are rather lacking in content. I'd say wait until we get more stuff added to them. Course, I'm not the sole judge here.

Official art of the Pokemon will release eventually, and if not, maybe the in game sprites? Since party menu sprites are getting more and more detailed than ever.

The policy's to stick to the official art since unlike that other stuff it'll be the same forever.

For Iron Valiant, it's in the professor's abandoned lab by the lighthouse that you enter before starting the final storyline. It describes Iron Valiant as a science experiment to make the ultimate Psychic type by combining Gallade and Gardevoir, which becomes ironic considering it gets both of their types except Psychic. It also talks about Iron Hands a sort of We Can Rebuild Him of some athlete or something. That's all I've seen from playing through Violet at least. Presumably in Scarlet the Occulture magazines would talk about Roaring Moon and another ancient Paradox Pokemon but I don't have the game so I'm not too certain.

I think its a stretch to me. Quite a few Pokémon are mechanically similar to each other. I feel like in order to count it has to fulfill the same role narratively so to speak.