During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Abstain on the Keiichi Asamiya image.
![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
to Zobek.
Edited by DrUnknown on Jul 14th 2020 at 5:55:18 AM
The Dragon
Well I pretty much figured that he wouldn't cut it.
Still, I don't regret doing the EP.
Has anyone suggested Nate Haskell from CSI? I've thought about writing on him for ages but can't remember much since I haven't watched the episodes in years and I don't remember all the episodes he appears in.
Goku Black
zobek
Didn't Haskell have a pretty bad fe from what I remember.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
"I'm wondering if there are other Artix Entertainment qualifiers we haven't looked over apart from the 3(?) we have right now."
Four actually. There may be more.
Though about that actually, there's one I'm not so sure counts anymore.
Goku Black
Which one of The four ?
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
This guy:
- Chaos Dragonlord Vath not only enslaved the dwarves, but also his own dragon. He doesn't care how much pain and suffering he's causing the dwarves in the slightest and doesn't even care if they starve to death, as long as they can forge enough Chaos Gemeralds to keep him happy. Worse yet, Vath even threatens to enslave the rest of Lore and will throw the bodies of anyone who tries to foil his plans down to the dwarves as a demonstration of what happens to those who oppose his might.
I'd like to bring up he has two glaring mitigating factors.
Firstly, a later event revealed he has a daughter who considers him to be a loving father, meaning Even Evil Has Loved Ones is in play.
Second of all, he honestly wasn't that bad even in his debut. At one point he was merciful enough to let the player catch their breath after an exhausting climb.
Edited by Snowy66 on Jul 14th 2020 at 6:37:05 AM
Aight. I'll just delete it from the YMMV page myself?
The writeup sounds kind of lackluster too. Was he really upvoted?
Goku Black
I think him and Chaos Lord Krellenos we're grandfathered in.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
cut Vath
Also, would somebody be willing to rewrite the Krellenos entry (I've never played the games)
Edited by nwotyzal on Jul 14th 2020 at 6:38:48 AM
I never played up to Krellenos so it would be hard for me.
Goku Black
Cut Vath.
Honestly he doesn't sound like much anyway.
Edited by miraculous on Jul 14th 2020 at 6:42:00 AM
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Cut Vath. He doesn't even really sound that heinous to begin with.
Edited by Bullman on Jul 14th 2020 at 8:44:42 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Okay deleted him.
The Draftsman of Doom
@Miraculous I think it was a case of Freudian Excuse Is No Excuse, as his dad beat him (and was thus his first victim) but I remember it wasn't really intended to make him sympathetic and one of the characters even says something like "His dad was the one person he killed who actually deserved it." Where as all the others didn't
to Chaos Dragonlord Vath.
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Sek, Lucius, Masale and Talleyrand
Zobek and Vath
As for Trout, how many bears would have died in that fire vs. People on that bridge that one guy tried to blow up?
Another quote:
Edited by DemonDuckofDoom on Jul 14th 2020 at 7:41:05 AM
- USSA: Frank Nitti is the wicked enforcer of Secretary Al Capone. A sadist who loves his work, Nitti oversees labor camps to find Tom Joad, having many innocents tortured in the process. Upon assembling a family to ask questions, Nitti has them gunned down with relish even after seeing they likely know nothing. When Eliot Ness sneaks into his hotel, he sees Nitti is also a rapist who likes to abduct and violate young women after torturing them.
- Thieves of the Wood: Jean-Joseph Coffijn is the mayor of Flanders. a corrupt autocrat who taxes and mistreats the people, Coffijn has no compunction having them tortured or executed to get closer to capturing Jan der Lichte. Plotting to use outlaws as slaves who will be executed should they resist, Coffijn's worst deed is his 'Fawn Hunt,' when young women are abducted and chased into the forest to be raped by him and any other participating noble.
- Doom Patrol: Red Jack is an interdimensional being who feeds on suffering. First encountered by Caulder as Jack the Ripper, Red Jack has been many serial killers since, including the Monster of Florence. Kidnapping Mr. Negative and torturing him while using his radiation to torture others, Red Jack tries to sway Caulder to be his apprentice, deciding to torture him and his allies eternally as one of his collection: rows and rows of people turned into butterflies and kept in horrific agony so he may feed on them for all time.
- Kane
- Sitilvon Vareishei is the worst of her wicked clan and brothers. Having helped to murder her father, Sitilvon helps tor un the Vareishei lands as a place of horror where any 'trespassers' are tortured and murdered, or taken hostage to be sacrificed. A poisoner in her spare time, Sitilvon subjects countless to horrific poisons for fun, including forty children in one batch, simply to study their agony.
- King Masale of Westvin attempted to conquer Lynotris in his dream of empire. Wiping out all villages and towns in the vicinity, Masale subjected the city to a years-long siege where countless people died, with Masale even using poison gas on the city. Throwing his own men in as cannon fodder, Masale later boasted he left not a living soul, taking only the ruler's daughter Princess Reallis as a tortured concubine. Later returning to claim Reallis's supposedly lost treasure from his and Reallis's daughter Sesi, Masale attempts to have Sesi tortured to gain the gold, intending to kill her after.
- Dead at 1000
- Lucius Mordecai was a bored noble practicing human sacrifice. Learning how to raise the dead, Lucius sacrificed 13 virgins to do so and fed his apprentices to them, unleashing his zombies on Paris. Building a zombie army by killing all in his way, Lucius sets them on all of Europe, intending to conquer the world by killing as many of the living as possible.
- The Piper was a former student of Lucius and the only one to escape the massacre of his students. Taking advantage of the zombies, the Piper lures them to towns to ravage them before showing up to lead them off for a fee. Unleashing them on Hamlin, the Piper is then stiffed of his fee by the greedy mayor. Ina rage, the Piper decides to have the dead wipe Hamlin out before stealing its children, plotting to use them as sacrifices or sell them into slavery to recoup his losses.
@Demon Duck: There were dozens of bears all of which displayed varying degrees of sapience in that fire that Trout tried to have them killed in.
The guy that tried to knock down the bridge was Ralph he is a sapient Yeti. He tried to knock it down and send the 5 humans that were on it to their death since he thought that it would be funny.
Cut Vath.
No to Zobek.