During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Yes to Lucifer. Good job with the relitigation there, Beast.
Yes to Lucifer, whose... ehm, detailed junk is like, one of the few things I even remember about that game, lol.
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Lucifer
Is the game good?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I'll give a yes to Lucifer.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Oh, and:
- Yokai Monsters: Spook Warfare: Daimon is a vampiric Babylonian monster who promptly murders the treasure hunters who free him. Heading to Japan, Daimon drains the Samurai Isobe and replaces him, beginning to prey on and murder Isobe's servants and those around him, while torturing a Kappa who catches him in the act. Daimon then desires 'fresher' blood and begins to stalk to attempt to murder children, killing several parents who get in his way. Murdering and replacing a magistrate to accuse his human enemies of crimes to execute them, Daimon proceeds to attempt to wipe out the Yokai and humans who try to stop him after.
Sure to the Lucifer from the Grim Derp adaptation from the classic poem.
Seriously, Beatrice goes from being a guiding spirit to a damsel in distress.
This game gives less agency to its female lead than a centuries old poem. Though they also hilariously give St Lucia her own ridiculous Adaptational Badass nonsense in the DLC, which like with Dante is so bad it's good, so that's something.
Lucifer was featured in Projared's top ten DYICKS in gaming, and well deserved too.
But the game is serviceable, but man does it drop off in quality further and further as you go on, which is so sad because it has some real cool stuff, even if it is often the Shadow The Hedgehog game level of try hard.
There was an artist who worked on it, I forget his name, but he had this huge epic of Hell and how it works and is really cool and twisted - his designs were often toned down in the game because they were TOO MUCH, like, Cerberus in the game is probably one of the least toned down things featured - anyway, my point is, has his work ever been discussed here? I'll try and find his name.
...and found him. Wayne Barlowe.
Edited by PolarPhantom on Feb 23rd 2019 at 10:08:37 AM
Seriously, though, there is an amazingly funny LP of this one where they rib endlessly on Dante, especially with the Gluttony and greed sins. "Like, the others are 'remember when you slept with the slave girl, Dante?' Or "remember when you killed those people, Dante?" This one is all "remember when you threw that crazy party, Dante?!""
Or Lucifer going all "We can rule together!" by the end.
Definite to Lucifer.
I give the game seven out of ten. It feels like it's trying to much to be a God of War clone and some of the dialogue is a little over the top. Just watch this cutscene of Lucifer's gloating to Dante. (And remember, his horns are on his head - so try keep your eyes from wandering).
I'd go 6/10 myself. And I'm being generous with how laaaaame the arena fights are.
Who did the LP Lighty? Might be good listening for when I'm farming in Warframe or something.
Also, in case one missed it, have we ever discussed the works of Wayne Barlowe? I'm mostly curious but I haven't read him myself, but damn is his art wonderfully horrifying. And I mean it's scary, not bad.
@Papyru30: so now that read the Majora’s Mask Manga and there might be a chance for him to count, do you plan to EP nim (it doesn’t hurt to try)
to Lucifer
Polar Phantom: Hey, speaking of Warframe... has that game ever been discussed around these parts? I've planned on getting into the game at some point and seeing if anyone could count. Cursory looks at the lore and video clips I've watched made me think that at the very least the Grineer Queens could be worth a look, but does anyone (Mainly you) more familiar with the game have any thoughts on the matter?
to Lucifer.
Thanks Lighty.
As for Warthog, I'm not far enough into the game to really make a good comment. I'm very slow and it's rather grindy being a free to play game, but the Grineer Queens are likely worth a look and the bad guy in Fortuna might count but I haven't finished that quest line. In fact, I've barely started it.
Warframe is huge. And it's Free to Play. And has succeeded and I love that.
Basically, I just gotta buckle down and really make an effort to do some story quests
but I also promised Lighty to play DS 1 and Nioh before 2019 ends. And DMC 5 is less than a fortnight away.
Video games are hard.
So does everyone reckon Ranon Xinon/Clark P. Ganes should be classifed as a Complete Monster?
Dante’s Inferno looks decent, but compared to games like God of War, in which the 2018 ps4 game is one of my all time favorite video games, Dante’s Inferno is nothing really special. If i’m being honest, Lucifer himself was really the most, and probably only interesting thing in the game.
Messenger from another dimension.
Yes to Lucifer. I personally really like the game. There was also an Anime based on the game were Lucifer does exactly same things. Should we also provide entry on Anime page?
Welcome to the world of greatest media!
Lucifer
@Demon: Yeah, he's got plenty of upvotes.
So what do I do now?
Question about some of the SCPs] on the SCP Foundation page:
- SCP-106 has Even Evil Has Loved Ones in his character profile. Doesn't that contradict this trope, or should there be an addendum to that
- SCP-953 belong to an Always Chaotic Evil race, doesn't that affect her agency?
- If it was decided SCP-4666 is a CM, shouldn't that mean he disqualifies for Ambiguously Evil?
Another comparison of Dantes Inferno and God of War is how in the animated adaptation, Lucifer was voiced by Steve Blume - as in Ares.
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Gentle Laborer
Lucifer.
@Ultimate, now it's time for you to do the writeups for your approved candidates.
Edit: Oops double posted. By accident.
Edited by Bullman on Feb 23rd 2019 at 3:57:37 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread