During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Both Baal and Isaacs, I feel, are a yes.
Since it's been over two weeks since the last Steven Bomb I would just like to give my opinion that neither of the Diamonds we have seen thus far count. Both Blue and Yellow Diamond have VERY visible redeeming qualities in that both of them are still deeply hurt by Pink's death despite it having been thousands of years. Blue can't stop crying and mourning her death, and Yellow's desire to destroy Earth is revealed to be more out of pain and guilt rather than pettiness, she also nearly breaks down during her Villain Song.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Yeah, now that the episodes have officially premiered, both Yellow and Blue are out for the count. Yellow's at least trying to move on but Pink's death clearly still affects her and she shows open care and affection - however subdued - for Blue. The only character with any sort of potential left in qualifying for this trope is White, and I'm not optimistic about her chances.
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Isaacs and Baal
I'm going to have to vote down on Alduin because I still have concerns regarding his moral agency given.
Wild Child
Isaacs and Baal.
So I was wondering, has Wade from River Wild been discussed? If yes, and he isn't considered as such, I will not bring him up.
I'm still keeping an eye on Yellow, since her grief doesn't strike me as genuine in the slightest.
How do you explain her breaking down in mid song then?
Baal and Isaac. What about Wesker from the film series ? Is he heinous like his videogame counterpart ?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
My guess is, probably out-heinoused.
username: It came off to me as overdramatic theatrics. Her whole song was basically disguising her attempts at shaming Blue into acting more Diamond-like as stern yet loving criticism. Either way, it really came off as... phony to me.
edited 18th Feb '17 2:06:12 PM by FriedWarthog
That, for now, is speculation. We have no evidence on-screen to believe that what we see now isn't genuine.
Word of God confirms her grief is abundantly real. Her attempts to deal with it are...unhealthy (trying to convince herself she doesn't care, destroy earth as it reminds her of her pain).
But her breaking down in the song is pretty genuine.
All I'm saying is that until her arc is over, it's too early to truly consider her a closed case.
Anyone gonna answer my question bout Wade?
Lizzid people!
I agree somewhat on YD.
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
I don't think he was discussed before. If he was I might've missed the EP.
Baal.
to Alexander Isaacs and Baal.
Baal and Isaacs are a
Caesar
I'll give a Yes to Alduin. Baal and Isaacs are easy Keeps, as well. Baal is handily one of McCammon's worst. And THAT'S saying something.
Huh. Ever had one of those times where you realize you completely forgot to EP a candidate from a work you viewed MONTHS ago? Cause I've just experienced that. ![[lol]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/lol2v12_4863.png "[lol]"){kind=small}
Ergo, expect a Keeper from me later tonight.
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Oh, I've done that plenty of times. My thing is that I was literally making an EP for this villain months ago, then got distracted by other stuff, and, along with losing the EP, completely forgot about him until yesterday. XD
edited 18th Feb '17 4:02:32 PM by Ravok
WHAT A WONDERFUL DAY!
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Hey, I effortposted Caesar like a DECADE after I'd read it . ![[nja]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/user_ninja_2074.png "[nja]"){kind=small}
Okay, THAT'S never happened . I hadn't actually thought of Caesar until Killian got me thinking. The other's I've done pretty much right away (when not procrastinating 
).
I've gotten a dozen candidates approved so far; I wonder who the 13th will be.
edited 18th Feb '17 4:05:41 PM by ACW
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Lost count of how many candidates I've gotten approved. Intending to do a tally soon.
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]")
Baal. There IS the whole revenge thing...though it seems as if he were a dick beforehand (incidentally, while reading the effortpost, was I the only one who thought of Damien?).
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts