During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
Scarlett after Scraggle's counter.
No to Scarlett.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I'll abstain on Scarlett.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
@Scraggle. I never said vaguely. there was no one but Chris and Chef in the helicopter so obviously interns were on the island unless they didn't go to work that day.
I would have to say to Scarlett if you compare her to Chris (he sank an island, has many interns die under his care, has brought many contestants to the brink of death, and has warped people to the brink of insanity) and that the latter still has redeeming qualities (he has cared for a few people and has shown disgust towards some of the contestants) Scarlett kinda of falls flat of the heinous standard. Before you say anything this is just my opinion.
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
While Chris didn't cause the island Wawanaka to blow up on purpose, his careless drilling caused the island to sink.
edited 15th Apr '16 2:05:16 PM by G-Editor
RIP Toriyama
to Scarlett.
She may be a Knight of Cerebus, but really, she doesn't even sound that heinous. Ok, she tried to blow up an island filled with, at the least, half a dozen people. That's bad, definitely a MEH, but not only do you often need more than one big crime to be a CM, but, even the CMs that somehow count because of one, big, bad, action, it's only because the act is immensely bad. Like, Cold-Blooded Torture or mass murder (In the dozens).
edited 15th Apr '16 11:28:45 AM by Ravok
Tonight I dine on monkey soup.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Chris has never blown up an island. Anyway, like I said I wouldn't really compare Chris with Scarlett due to the resource factor.
Queen of Good Things, Honest
If we used the "throne of human agony" Bill quote, I'd want to shorten it. I think,
gets the point across without needing the part about spreading his minions across the Earth. But the children into corpses lines are even shorter and also get the point across. Between the two,
is a bit better than
because while both communicate that Bill intends to murder children, the "kill one of them" line emphasizes that he's doing it for lulz and also comes off a bit more serious. Making children into corpses could be stated hyperbolically; a father frustrated with his daughter might say, "Excuse me, I have to go murder my kid," but has no intention of literally doing it.
Killing one for the heck of it is unambiguously literal and explicitly communicates a complete lack of mitigating factors.
edited 15th Apr '16 12:00:44 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently liveblogging Haruhi Suzumiya and revisiting Danganronpa V3.
Wild Child
Scarlett.
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Funatsu (I really don't want to know how young Tsubaki was during the gang-raping).
to Scarlett (can't honestly buy anyone from Total Drama being a contender).
A total has-been.
Well, Scarlett came up out of nowhere. Anyway, she's still a for me too.
Given Scraggle's arguments, I'm gonna Scarlett.
How does heinousness work in songs? I'm wanting to propose a character from a Nick Cave song, and want to know if Lottie messes with the standards
edited 15th Apr '16 1:56:40 PM by DemonDuckofDoom
I think, unless it's clearly defined multiple songs all share a universe (think The Emerald Sword Saga) each song is basically its own work. Heinousness shouldn't really be an issue there.
With only a few exceptions, songs have little enough narrative substance that I feel kind of uncertain about including characters from them.
Well, in Toriko...Joie is very likely on her last fight, so I'll post her after that.
However, the main villain is Acacia, the man thought to be the world's savior...in truth, Acacia was a manipulative, selfish monster who used everyone around him as pawns. In the recent chapters, he's mocked the death of his eldest adopted son Ichiryu, killed his second adopted son Jiro and revealed his sorrow for his dead lover/partner Froese was entirely fake. He's obsessed with his own appetite and nothing more.
Also, Ghandalf, you mind discussing Balendin with me and how to expand?
Now...
- Schwarzesmarken: Heinz Axman, one of the highest figures in the Stasi of East Berlin is a selfish, sadistic officer who keeps a hold on Berlin with an iron fist. Any hint of dissent is ruthlessly quelled with Axman ordering purges of entire families. The hero of the story, Theodor, was tortured by the Stasi with his family murdered, except his sister Lise. The young women Axman has raped, tortured and broken to make them into agents who use their bodies to seduce targets and murder them. During Lise's training, Axman even had her execute civilians, before forcing her to murder the last children with a rock to 'save bullets.' Throughout the series, Axman is willing to slaughter whoever he has to in order to keep his grip on Berlin and rule it through the Stai, caring nothing for the state of the country he wants to rule.
- The Moon That Embraces The Sun'': Minister Yoon Dae-Hyung is seen murdering a royal prince in his conspiracy with the queen mother. When a fortune teller spies him in the act, Yoon has her tortured and ripped apart by horses when she calls him out. Yoon consolidates his grip on the royal court, marrying his daughter to the new young king and treating her as a pawn, while having the king's true beloved violently tortured and attempting to murder those in his way. Deciding to overthrow the king by manipulating his half-brother, Yoon dismisses his daughter's fall from grace in this plan by coldly stating he can have another. He has the queen mother fatally poisoned and proceeds to try to kill the King and all of his allies, aiming to seize ultimate power in Korea.
edited 15th Apr '16 6:02:47 PM by Lightysnake
Found this on Ratchet & Clank (2016):
- Complete Monster: Dr. Nefarious, who planed on using the Deplanetizer to detonate Umbris's volatile core to do catastrophic damage to the nearby planets, just to get revenge on the Rangers. It is implied that if Drek knew the full extent of Nefarious's plans, he would be horrified.
The game came out on the 12th, so we need to wait another week and a half before discussing Nefarious.
Well....that didn't go well. At least a got that off my chest, I promise I won't bring Scarlett up again (unless she returns and gets new actions).
Skimming through the fanfics page again; through the many entries that still need to be looked at and likely cut, I've found this in particular at the bottom of the page:
- In Paul Robinson's The Locust, the character creates a mind control device, finds a businessman, then uses his device to get the businessman to borrow several million dollars and take out $200,000 in cash. While they're waiting, the man's beautiful 15-year-old daughter comes home from school. The character takes her upstairs and convinces her she's in love with him. Then he has sex with her. When the cash arrives, the character takes it and the businessman's wife and daughter with him and tells the businessman to wait for a phone call. The character uses his device to convince them to leave, then takes the wife and daughter to a hotel suite (which the wife charges to the businessman's credit card), calls the businessman, and starts having sex with his daughter again while the businessman has to listen to it. As he's about to climax, the character gives the special command over the phone that causes the buisnessman to believe life is worthless and he wants to die and puts a gun to his head and shoots himself. The gun goes off over the phone at the exact moment the character climaxes. Then later, he collects the assets from the family and pimps out the mother and daughter as well as lots of underage girls.
Alright. Few problems with this entry. Firstly, the entry's horrible. I have absolutely no idea what the hell it's trying to say and it seems more like it's trying to recap the plot of the work rather than actually tell us why this character is heinous. Secondly, it's the only one of its kind on the page, as it's listed under "Others" and has no original source that it's a fanfiction of. Thirdly, I did a little search out of curiosity. A quick search through Google yields literally nothing on the fanfic nor the author, and I can find no existing records of whether or not this character was discussed or not in the forum. It doesn't have a work page. The character described doesn't even have a name.
I'm a little concerned about this entry, is what I'm saying. Is there any clarification on what this writeup is or can we just cut it?
edited 15th Apr '16 9:01:04 PM by Scraggle
...huh!? I say just axe it.
Wild Child
I'd say cut that entry.
Also, I'm going to be proposing any candidates from Film.The Jungle Book 2016 two weeks from now. I won't go any further than that.
Why so serious?
to Funatsu. to Scarlett.
Alright, update on that entry... Looked through the history of Fan Works. That was an unapproved entry that was added years ago by the creator of the story - which apparently never went through any sort of publishing. Apparently it just slipped through our radar.
Cut and burn?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Yes,
Lighty, your opinion on keeping or cutting Tommyrod?
I know it's early to talk about it, but I don't think the 2016 version of chairmen Drek is gonna count, not gonna say anything but if you've played the game and finished it im sure you know what I mean.
edited 16th Apr '16 3:20:21 AM by Mediawatcher
Lizzid people!
Scarlett.
