Final Fantasy general

my issue is that you could still have her provide fanservice but with a less ridiculous outfit. the cleavage window is one thing, but when you throw in a thong i think you go a bit too far.

You should read the translations of the interview when the trailer came out, they were bending over backwards to say that she was designed by a male artist and such.

Very clearly over compensating over the Fujoshi pandering accusations in completely the wrong way.

edited 21st Mar '15 6:22:44 PM by Memers

I personally think a full yellow jumpsuit would be fairly attractive and practical, although that's just my opinion, and I suppose I could be wrong about the practical angle.

I mean, if they actually decided to have a male same-sex relationship, that could work, but I still would like some women in the party (and I don't think they'll be going down that route anyway).

Also, I've seen a few things about sexism in Lighting Returns, but they didn't really go into detail with it. Any idea what they were referring to?

edited 21st Mar '15 6:20:42 PM by KarkatTheDalek

i wish cidney just had a better design and was a more significant character. i really like the idea of a female cid (and yes i know her dad is literally cid, but given her japanese name we might as well just say there are two cids in the game) and her role as a mechanic for the team, but unfortunately her design is a bit silly and she's basically just fanservice station attendant.

There has been a Ms. Fanservice every Final Fantasy game since II so it was in the cards that there would a scantily clad lady somewhere in XV

Yes, and I suppose whether you think that's a good thing is a matter of taste, but is a mechanic really the best choice for such a character?

edited 21st Mar '15 11:24:46 PM by KarkatTheDalek

it would be fine if her outfit was less silly, but we're having this conversation right now so...

There is, IMO, nothing inherently wrong with the existance of fanservice. The problem is when female characters are limited to the sole purpose of fanservice (or fridge stuffing, for that matter). That is to say, they are a sexualized object, instead of a person who simply chooses to dress in a revealing manner. And with Cidney its just fucking stupid because she's a goddamn mechanic and could very easily seriously injure herself with that attire. Her design is like a mechanic version of Chainmail Bikini.

Just jumping in real quick, Cindy could still be a Miss Fanservice type character even with a more functional outfit. You could still use this◊, give her a bikini, and she could easily zip in up when actually working on cars. The thong could even be worked in with her pulling the top down at certain intervals and still showing it off with out it looking out of place.

x4 x2 Fran was probably a worse choice for an armored teddy with all the protective bits cut out. And Maria with her metal bra cup and painted on pants. And Lulu with that much black leather, fur and belts on a tropical island. And Tifa's streetwalker combat gear. Or Ultimecia's gown that pulls off an impossibly low neck and impossibly high thigh slit. And whatever the hell Shalua was wearing was definitely not smart for a cycloptic one armed scientist slash gunwoman. Or what Yuna, Riku and Pain wear for fighting in X-2.

Not that Cindy's fanservicey outfit is better by comparison but this series has a very long tradition of practicality taking a back seat to Rule of Cool, Rule of Sexy, Rule of Fun and glamour for outfits for characters of both genders.

edited 22nd Mar '15 12:20:40 AM by lycropath

X-2's outfits were quite varied actually from the nearly naked Thief to heavily armored Dark Knight. Had they made it so it changed in the over world then things would have been quite different.

Also I am not opposed at all to Fanservice, quite the opposite actually. Just they should be more than just eye candy.

What I mean is, no one in Final Fantasy is EVER going to dress appropriately for their job. Its a collection of universes where people wade into battle in Pimped Out Dresses, Chainmail Bikinis, Scary Impractical Armor, Kuja's Underwear of Power and leather pants so tight that must have cost Balthier his sperm count. Whats practical and what makes sense was NEVER a factor. What is fun, sexy, cool, glamorous or just plain weird is what will happen without fail.

edited 22nd Mar '15 12:21:58 AM by lycropath

Some people have noted in the comments of the article that FF 2 Cid's outfit was also revealing and rather fanservicey, yet the fashion people still took their time in giving a critique on it. And yet Cidney's outfit isn't even worth much critique. What say you?

FFII was a sprite, you can't see crap.

I personally have never seen the Amano artwork of it though.

edited 22nd Mar '15 12:16:15 AM by Memers

I think that criticizing Cidney's outfit on the merits of being needlessly fanservicey is valid, but on concerns of practicality it really isn't, considering the series we're dealing with here.

Well they where obviously judging the artwork

edited 22nd Mar '15 12:12:26 AM by lycropath

x14 The main Big Bad wants to turn Lightning into a puppet and his queen to serve him in all the meanings of the word(his battle quotes are pretty revealing). It's really turned down in the english version(which has a different plan for the villain, different reason for the Bonus Boss existing, changed a VA that made the third act actually work(Bhunivelze is voiced by Hope's VA in the japanese version due to Bhunivelze absorbing his heart) and removed pretty much everything concerning romance, love and lust from the game)to the point that one of the tracks is just called Divine Love instead of Consider His Love An Honor where "His" is Hope, the only human that Bhunivelze thought worthy of holding his power due to his feeling for Lightning.

I say fuck Amano's art style for making it difficult to tell what's what and how something actually looks.

And also that there's kinda a difference in the sheer blatantness of it.

Also, most of the clothes in XV are from actual fashion brands. Because product placement.

edited 22nd Mar '15 4:33:11 AM by unnoun

Cid's clearly wearing a unitard and blatantly showing off his meaty bare thighs It was the 80s after all.

I find it silly to say that stupid outfits are just a case of "it can't be helped, this is Final Fantasy."

In a series that tends to change things up a fair bit between installments as a matter of course, is that really what we think the FF brand is? Moogles and stupid outfits? Because that seems really silly to me, when the quality of outfits is as subject to variation (even among characters in the same game) as anything.

I just think that it's a dumb idea - and justification - to write off Cidney's outfit criticisms with "this series has always had an issue with these costumes, in artwork and such - this is more of the same". to begin with, because it's a well-established part of the series doesn't mean it has to stick around - especially not in this capacity. I just googled her, and half of her boobs are just hanging out. Jesus Christ, talk about an impractical outfit.

And I don't think anything so far has tried to make the fanservice look so... normal. Like X-2 had the girls dressed up like flamingos half of the time, so the ridiculous level of fanservice is at least obviously overdone and ridiculous. Cidney just has a Bare Your Midriff leather jacket, with her tits hanging out. With oil on her face and scruffy hair. She's obviously a mechanic, she's done up in materials associated with work-safe clothing (leather jacket, trucker cap to keep her hair out of the way), but her rack and midriff are just hanging out like it's the most normal thing in the world. It's ridiculous.

edited 22nd Mar '15 6:16:33 AM by MrMallard

When I think Final Fantasy character design I certainly think of characters having a style over substance design. Whether its Rule of Cool, sexy, cute or fun Final Fantasy has always been very visually forward leaning to garish and impractical no matter the character designer.

That is true - characters who handle swords without armor, like Tidus, Auron, Squall, Zidane etc. and characters with ridiculously lavish outfits like the X-2 fanservice and Lulu's belt-skirt.

But aside from maybe Tifa's outfit in 7 (as a rebel fighter covering as a bartender), I don't think I've seen a character who's more or less a service worker in over-stylish clothes. IV's Cid had your standard mechanic garb in the artstyle of IV, and V's Cid was more or less an old man scholar/tinkerer. X's Cid, and the rest of the Al Bhed (sans Rikku after she joins your party) are dressed in coveralls and stylish but mostly effective work clothes. Rikku might have shown more skin, but even then she at least had some sort of top until that was abolished in X-2 for a bikini, ruffled shirt and miniskirt.

Cidney is a mechanic who fits XV's more realistic art style - despite still being stylized in FF fashion, of course - but who dresses in what amounts to a sexy Halloween costume while the guys dress in more realistic garb. It's just really dumb seeing a service worker who visibly look like they work on cars in such a stupidly impractical outfit - there's no excuse.

On a completely different topic - how unreasonable are some of the Celestial Weapons from FFX? Butterfly Race? Dodging 200 lightning bolts in a row? Ugh.

Those and the Chocobo race are the worst ones. Well, unless you suck at Blitzball then count that one up with the others.