Old Complete Monster cleanup thread
Welcome to the new Complete Monster (CM) cleanup thread! This thread is where we clean up or cut already-existing entries.
If you're looking to add new entries, please see the approval thread.
IMPORTANT: Before you begin any discussions on this thread, please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List. Here, you'll find explanations of the criteria for the trope as well as our rules/procedures for approving and cutting candidates.
What goes through this thread?
- Cut requests. If you believe a CM has been approved and they do not count, this thread is where you propose their removal. To know how to go about this, please see the FAQ folder on the Administrivia page, where the process is explained in detail.
- If we ever need to consider cutting multiple examples without individually reviewing them (e.g. if we discover widespread plagiarism with a particular troper's CMs), the initial discussion will be on this thread and we'll then escalate to the mod team (as described here) to get a formal consensus if we decide to recommend a mass cut.
- If an entry was put on the wrong subpage/YMMV page, you may propose where they should be moved to.
- Full rewrites of existing entries, including expansions, trims, and ground-up rewrites. If your rewrite is approved by the thread, feel free to add it to the drafts page so that other users can check grammar and the like before it is included with the rest of the weekly swaps.
- If an entry on a work's YMMV page doesn't match the entry on the media subpage, you can bring it here to discuss which entry works better.
What does not go through this thread?
- New candidate proposals - as stated before, those are done on this thread.
- Unapproved wicks - if a Troper encounters either of these kinds of wicks, they can be cut with no approval.
- Any CM link on a non-YMMV page - as a YMMV trope, it should not be linked on those pages regardless of any cleanup effort. The only exception is if the wick is being used within the definition of another trope.
- If an CM link on a YMMV page refers to an unapproved character. If it refers to an approved character on any such page, the wick can stay. On the other hand, if the unapproved character being linked to sounds like they might have promise (and you don't feel like checking it out for yourself), feel free to mention it on the approval thread - someone may already know why they don't count, or it could invite a brand new discussion!
- Proposals for images, quotes, and videos of already-approved CMs - quotes and images are proposed on the approval thread, while videos can be uploaded normally as they are screened for approval by the moderation.
- Crosswicking examples to YMMV pages - if an example has already been approved and added to the main page, you do not require any special permission to add the example to a work's YMMV page (assuming the work has a page already). If a YMMV page doesn't exist yet, then you can make it yourself, but either way, feel free to just add the example without asking.
- Small changes to existing entries - these can simply be done on a Troper's own prerogative with no approval.
- Spelling and grammar fixes.
- Pothole changes.
- Minor rewordings.
- Spoiler tags.
While these changes do not require any kind of approval, it is requested that should you make any of these changes, you do one of the following:
- Make the same changes on the relevant Sandbox page, then add the Sandbox to the list at the bottom of the drafts page. This will add the Sandbox to the weekly swaps and ensure that the edits end up on the relevant locked page. If the Sandbox is already listed, then once you make the edits, your job is already done!
- If you don't know how the Sandboxes work or simply don't have the time to find it, then you can simply post on the thread about the changes you made. Someone else can then make the edit on the relevant Sandbox and add it to the weekly swaps.
- Alternatively, you can simply request that the change be made directly to the locked page on the Locked Pages thread. Members of this thread keep track of that one, so we will ensure that the changes are made in the Sandbox so that it doesn't get deleted during the next swap.
Again, these changes don't require any approval, but we prefer to keep the entries on the YMMV pages and the locked pages the same in order to avoid any miscommunication or errors between entries, so if you do make the change, we would greatly appreciate it if you could ensure the change is made on the locked page as well.
As a final note, we do not care what other sites have to say regarding whether or not a character counts. We have our own criteria and they have theirs for their CM equivalents; while they are similar, they are not exactly the same and should not be treated as such. Another site removing a character from their equivalent should not be a reason why a cut is proposed here, and if this is the case, it will likely lead to mod intervention.
Other than this, once again, welcome to the cleanup thread, and we look forward to your contributions!
Edited by Mrph1 on Jan 14th 2024 at 11:30:03 AM
Woagh
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Very much vouch for Lighty to do so. Monroe is awful and what he does to the country is shown in full light. I don't think he's quite there with the scope of other villains, especially Vilain operating in such a similar niche but definitely worth seeing if a flourish puts him back in.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Cut Munroe pending Lighty's viewing.
Honestly, I wouldn't oppose cutting Vilain, considering the villains in 4 try to start WW3.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Classy, Refined, Unstable
4's guys clear by scale, Vilain has a nasty dash of personal villainy and the slave shtick (with the village raids and shit) despite his goal not delving into it's consequences.
Oh, Mr. Kennedy, you entertain me. To show my appreciation, I will help you awaken from your world of clichés.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Eh, that's fair. I'm fine either way. And the slavery IS unique.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Not the Eye
Cut Munroe
The Draftsman of Doom
Harbinger of Cringe
Alright, so I recently gave "THE FINE PRINT" (great song btw) a rewatch and upon doing so, I am honestly beginning to doubt this guy.
- The Bureaucrat is the greeter of Halcyon, being responsible for perpetuating the oppression of the citizens in the community. A callous and smug individual, the Bureaucrat inducted the people into Halcyon after waking them up from deep sleep, and is shown to mock and taunt them over their predicament, blaming them for not reading through their contract while bragging about how the spirits of the citizens have been broken and how they are complacent.
- The architect tells them. The secret to heaven is simply consuming whatever we sell them!
So that just kinda goes to reinforce things. So to summarize, all he does is sign people up to Halycon, which sounds kinda bad out of context, but he isn't even the reason people decided to give it a go, meaning he really can't be blamed for the indoctrination of all these people. And even if he was, that's all he does, he just sort of enables things, no real flourishes, nothing like that, he's just signing you up, and then gloating about how dumb you were.
Overall, I am leaning cut on this guy personally.
My mere presence makes everyone's day worse.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Sky: I think there's only one current example with that pothole.
I'm gonna cut Dalby for now.
Also, what did we decide with that Sonic example.
ALSO also, I'm gonna need help with the MK page when the writeups come.
Edited by ACW on Oct 6th 2023 at 10:55:39 AM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Cut Munroe and the Bureaucrat. The latter always seemed like just a cog in a greater machine to me.
The Yggdrasil Cretin
Caesar Clown from One Piece is still CM, even if not only has he had scenes of heavily implied care for the Straw Hats (i.e. helping Chopper hon his abilities without asking for anything in return) but he is Very comical.
Here is a whole video of detracting comedy https://youtu.be/ZaCJhUDp8Hc?si=4JV4-VPCs0JP7cFD
I don’t think he counts personally but he has been brought up MULTIPLE times now
Everyone agrees he is in thin ice but we agreed to keep him until further notice
So can we please not bring this up again?
Also you would need a better argument then just an out of context comedy clip to prove he isn’t CM
Because by that logic we would have to cut alot of characters
Also
Implied care for the Straw Hats?
What is this blasphemy? He only improved Choppers transformation due to his ego
He has made it very clear he hates all the Straw Hats
Edited by YorkobeShounen on Oct 6th 2023 at 10:17:35 AM
I don't recall potential care for the Straw Hats being used before and we did wind up cutting Akainu even if there's some ambiguity so I wouldn't mind talking about it. He's on thin ice anyways.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Ah, keep if that's the case!
Edited by 43110 on Oct 6th 2023 at 1:18:51 PM
Here is the “care”
I don’t know about you guys but this seems just like him trying to show off
Edited by YorkobeShounen on Oct 6th 2023 at 10:22:44 AM
I personally never felt comfortable with Caesar. IMHO it has turned into a complete joke. Personally, I'm honestly in favor of cutting it out. This is just my opinion and that's all. But yes, as has already been clearly stated here, it has been discussed a lot of times and so far, in general, the majority agree that it is still suitable. I feel that he will be cut anyway, but let’s wait for now, it will become clear.
Moreover, Akainu was also discussed a lot of times and in the end he was cut out.Very good point, it really does look like he's showing off.
Keep Metallix.Ravok and 43110. Thanks for the good arguments. Yorkobe Shounen, 43110 and Ravok. Dzheltementy, thank you very much for the pleasant and cultural discussion!
Cut out Munro (always seemed like he had a CM personality, but his actions weren't explored enough) and Bureaucrat. Good job, Splonk.
Any thoughts on Dark Koutei and K'Vat? Personally, I'll stay away from K'Vat for now. Need to think.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=16706336400A42573900&page=386#comment-9630
Here are the arguments against from Emperor Geode. Thanks for your support Forgo, Geode!
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=16706336400A42573900&page=386#comment-9643
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=16706336400A42573900&page=387#comment-9669
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Yes, I mean that too. It became calmer when I was not the only one who openly voted for its cutting. Thank you very much Lore.
Edited by Ghal-Sur on Oct 6th 2023 at 11:24:59 AM
Honestly, I think I'm ready to rip off the band aid on this one and say cut Caesar. He's just such a pathetic joke at this point. His latest appearance in a cover story left him pitifully begging Sanji's family to help him escape Totto Land and at least somewhat reconciles with Vinsmoke Judge to focus their mutual hatred towards Vegapunk.
He's been brought up so much but I don't feel comfortable at all bringing him up on the never again list at this juncture.
Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
Barb / Temporary Kylo
I am gonna say keep personally. That does not look like real care to me personally.
The First man
Lizzid people!
Ultimately, will just say wait on see on Caesar.
We already decided to wait
I see no reason to change it at this point.
If there was new information that that would warrant a discussion like with Akainu. But as of now most people(not me) think he should stay for now until further notice
I thunk we should respect that
The Yggdrasil Cretin
Didn't know he was discussed various times, my bad on that one.
My final opinion is that honestly we don't need to wait and see, since the guy has a pretty established character trajectory now if you ask me. He got progressively more and more laughable and is no longer even acknowledged by the heroes. So it can be guessed that Oda doesn't plan for him to be 100% a threat anymore. Even if he came back as an actual antagonist in a potential future, his transformation into a joke has been set and very consistent.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
So what do we wanna do for the MK page? Split by character or by timeline?
If the latter, what order should they go for the Netherrealm timeline? Keep it Shang, Shao, Quan, Shinnok?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
I say by timeline, but I don't know what the order should be.
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I'm fine keeping it in the same order. With the Big 4, it's probably doesn't matter too much which order they go in.
For the second timeline, I'll have the Big 4, then Sektor, then Kronika, then Frost.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Cut. Might check this little EE tho