Shout Out Cleanup

Coppelia is a preexisting ballet, I'd argue it's more likely both Trails and Coppellion are referencing that

What about the other examples?

bumping

Sadly I can't say much there since I'm not familiar with the work itself or what it may/may not be referencing.

Meanwhile here's my example I'm not sure about, from ReferencedBy.Gravity Falls:

• Ash vs. Evil Dead: Ash constantly mispronounces the name of the manipulative demon who wants to throw the world into an age of chaos and darkness and who wants to get his hands on a Tome of Eldritch Lore as Bill.

It's not 100% out of the question, but the way it has to describe the show's elements to suggest there's a reference (the character this is referencing looks nothing like Bill Cipher) makes it sound shoehorned.

Yeah, that’s likely a shoehorn. Mispronouncing a character’s name is a common gag; just because it happens with another demon of chaos who wants to make the world descend into chaos (can’t believe a chaos demon would want to do that!) and seeks a Tome of Eldritch Lore doesn’t make it any more meaningful.

That indeed sounds like a shoehorn.

I moved this example on ShoutOut.Steven Universe to Surprisingly Similar Characters per this very thread when it first started.

• A half-human hybrid that, while less violent than full members of their alien ancestry, proves to be stronger than either parent race when pushed too far by a self-proclaimed Ultimate Lifeform. Steven Universe or Son Gohan?

However, Phoenixprominence added it back over two years later, claiming "As the page quote says, it's almost certainly a direct shoutout, not a coincidental similarity." That page quote being:

I still think it's a shoehorn.

Edited by rjd1922 on Feb 19th 2024 at 11:13:53 AM

Shout-Out is an internal reference or acknowledgement of another work. Dragon Ball is referenced in the show (Connie wears his clothes in one episode), but the titular character having a similarity or being influenced by another character is not the trope.

I cut similar instances of Expy shoehorns. Just because the Sonic series has a homage to the Dragon Balls doesn't mean Sonic is a Goku clone; and just because Steven has some similarities with Gohan doesn't make him a Gohan expy or reference.

I removed it again, linking to this post in the edit reason.

So, Mobile Suit Gundam SEED had an entry for its resident Char Clone as an Expy of The Phantom of the Opera, which was eventually removed following discussion calling it out.

Part of it still lives on as a Shout-Out entry for another character:

• Shout-Out: The specificity that her distant and eventually-dead father is from the "Kingdom of Scandinavia" to go with her engagement, professional singing career, and an ambiguous relationship dealing with a ruthless man in a mask all seem to be these to Christine Daäe of The Phantom of the Opera.

Like the original Expy argument, I don't know Phantom's cultural relevance in Japan but I do know that searching "Phantom of the Opera" and "Gundam SEED" turns up pretty much nothing in google other than our own page, a lot of that entry is either very vague or very obscure (having seen both Phantom and the Gundam series, I wouldn't have been able to tell you that either character is Scandanavian), and the fact that Foe Romance Subtext was deemed misuse on another page (and added by the same user), I think that entry could be cut.

So after cross-posting that to a Gundam thread, that's since been removed. But there's another questionable set of shout-outs on the same pages, specifically some shout outs to Jem. On their own, the entries are compelling enough, but if I had my doubts on the pop-culture impact of The Phantom of the Opera in Japan, I really have my doubts on the impact of Jem.

Lacus Clyne:

• Shout-Out: Visually, her main black/sleeveless with arm gloves/ponytail outfit in SEED Destiny was taken from an episode of Jem, "Old Meets New", and makes a quick appearance in that show's second opening.
  • I believe this is the outfit being referenced, normally worn like this. To me, it's an evolution of her outfit from the first series, just in black since she's now in an antagonistic role to the apparent main character. Calling it a Shout-Out to a one-off outfit from a decades old foreign cartoon when the similarities are mostly the color scheme kinda rings hollow.

Meer Campbell (Lacus' body double from the sequel series)

• She's also this to the heroine of the eponymous 80's cartoon Jem, given that she's a highly-talented accessory-wearing pink-haired popstar who exists for reasons of necessity and her identity is incredibly popular, but not real^note  the twist being that Jem was one person, two identities; where in SEED Destiny, is two people, one identity. Meer's slightly-elongated star hairclip can be seen in the Jem logo.
  • This is definitely more compelling, and the hairclip thing would be proof positive if "elongated star" wasn't such a fairly generic cutesy image. The rest of the writeup just feels... twisted, like more of a forum game where someone's trying to draw (potentially tortured) comparisons to characters ("exists for reasons of necessity"?!?). And she's a pink-haired pop-star because Lacus is a pink-haired pop star. Which is why she wears accessories. That's what pop stars do.

Searching "Gundam" or "Gundam SEED" and "Jem" comes up with absolutely nothing but our pages again.

EDIT: Per discussion in the Gundam thread, cut these and a bunch of other shout outs I brought up that are probably reaches.

Edited by Larkmarn on Apr 29th 2024 at 10:20:25 AM