Never Live It Down Cleanup

I don't think it counts either, partly because I don't think a character's entire characterization can fall under Never Live It Down since it seems to just involve one action. I'd take it to Locked Pages: Lock, UnLock and Edit requests.

Found this on YMMV.The Legend Of Heroes Kuro No Kiseki

• Never Live It Down: Fans of the franchise will never live Kuro II down for the sole reason that Death Is Cheap is in full effect for the entire cast.

Not only is this a borderline ZCE, Is this really a reaction that fans have? Because to me, it feels complain-y.

Even if it's a legit reaction, it's misuse of NLID, which is about fans flanderizing characters.

Removed and cited this thread. Thanks!

I have some potential entries for https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/NeverLiveItDown/AnimeAndManga under the Pokemon Section: let me know if they fit the trope definition or if they need to be cut down.

• Detractors of Misty will often cite her violent outbursts and assaults on Ash and Brock as reasons to dislike her. This ignores the fact the first half of Kanto as a whole was more violent than anything else on the show, with one-shot characters and Team Rocket also making use of Family-Unfriendly Violence, the likes of which would cease by the time of the Orange Islands arc. Misty, in turn, had mellowed out significantly by then.
• Max is forever remembered for the time he tried to steal Ash's Balance Badge. This was only done in heat of the moment because he couldn't accept his father losing a battle. Max quickly returned the badge and apologized, yet the way fans talk about Max you'd think he was a habitual badge thief.
• Paul will forever be remembered for his verbal and physical abuse of Chimchar. While such a thing is abhorrent, it was demonstrated throughout the show Paul will simply release Pokémon if they don't meet his standards immediately and treats the Pokémon he keeps exceptionally well. Despite Chimchar being the exception to the rule, fans will paint Paul as somebody who abuses all of his Pokémon.
• Even after finding her own goal and parting ways with Ash, Serena will be forever remembered by her detractors as a girl who stalked Ash over a childhood crush. This ignores the fact it's heavily implied that Serena never even thought of Ash again until she saw him on the news, and was only using returning his handkerchief as an excuse to get out of Ryhorn Racing and see the world. Even after Serena reunited with Ash she was planning to go on her own way, until Bonnie and Ash invited her to travel with them.

Edited by Mariofan99 on Mar 19th 2023 at 9:12:59 AM

I'm inclined to say no to all of those. The Misty and Serena ones are just complaining about the characters. Paul abusing Chimchar is not a one-time thing and thus doesn't count either. Max taking the Balance Badge isn't infamous enough because his detractors generally just dunk on him for being a Tagalong Kid rather than for anything specific he did.

But in the case of Misty and Serena I pointed out why those criticisms are unfair/exaggerated, which I thought was the entire point of the trope. I wouldn't call that "just complaining"

Edited by Mariofan99 on Mar 19th 2023 at 12:47:02 PM

Okay, maybe I was a little harsh on that front. But do keep in mind that NLID is, as the trope description says, about one action or event, which neither of the girls' entries are.

I gotcha. As for Paul while he did call Chimchar "pathetic" on multiple occasions I believe it only reached physical abuse during the Tag Battle Tournament arc (specifically "Glory Blaze"). Unless sending Chimchar in on a Stealth Rock, or against opponents with a type-advantage would count as abuse.

And I'm not saying this as a fan of Paul (I'm not), I just want us to be sure he doesn't qualify

Edited by Mariofan99 on Mar 19th 2023 at 12:51:19 PM

I think Paul abusing Chimchar fits the spirit if not the letter — only physically abused one Pokemon on rare occasions, is written as a habitual Pokemon abuser.

Sounds about right. I've changed my mind on Paul not counting, but I still maintain my opinions on the other three.

I get now Misty and Max not qualifying but I feel Serena could still fit given her detractors focus on how and why she met Ash. Maybe if it was written like this?

• Serena is forever remembered by her detractors for starting her journey because of her crush on Ash, a guy she hadn't seen in years. This ignores the fact it's implied Serena had been looking for any excuse to get out of Ryhorn Racing and was only using returning Ash's handkerchief to have an excuse to leave home. Furthermore, Serena wasn't planning to travel with Ash, Ash and Bonnie invited Serena to join their group.

Seems good to me, though we should get a second opinion.

It should mention that people use it to characterize her as a stalker as the previous attempt suggested, so we get an idea of how the fandom misinterprets her.

I did in the old entry guess I need to combine them

Found this on YMMV.Akebis Sailor Uniform

• Never Live It Down: The scene in the first episode where Erika is introduced while clipping her toenails with a great deal of focus on her feet as she does so, especially when she sniffs her nail clipper mid-pedicure. This put off many viewers who, up until that point, were expecting a more innocent series. It was immediately pegged as "Feet: The Anime" as a result, and it doesn't help that the anime never completely shakes off this vibe due to its frequent usage of foot motifs. Ironically, the anime is partially to blame for having only amped up this element from the manga, as it features a lot of focus on the characters' feet in the opening credits and even emphasizes feet in scenes where those were originally drawn simpler in the manga.

This is basically "a piece of media is infamous for something" type of misuse. Safe to cut?

I'd say yes.

I believe so.

Found this on YMMV.The Legend Of Heroes Trails Into Reverie

• Never Live It Down: Fans will never live down the fact that Lloyd gets dropped after he charges up to attack Simulacrum Rufus with his former S-Craft, Tiger Charge, only for Simulacrum Rufus to barely move from his spot and defeat him in one hit.

I never heard of this until I read it and during my time in the fandom, I never once heard someone talk about this scene. Any other thoughts?

Thomas And Friends S 15 E 17 Wonky Whistle has this:

• Never Live It Down: Thomas leaving the steamworks without his whistle properly fixed as well as nearly injuring the workmen who were working on it.

I think it's safe to say that Thomas is not most known for this incident, it's not really a never live it down moment for him.

That one's an obvious cut.

This was originally on the page for She-Hulk: Attorney at Law but got turned into an entry for Unintentionally Unsympathetic because it was a "justified complaint". However, the UU entry was soon taken down as that forum already decided Jen's attitude was intentional, with said forum feeling it fit better as an NLID entry. What do you guys think? Can I re-add it? https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=15194292110A03429900&page=82#comment-2046

• Never Live It Down: Jen's retort to Bruce in Episode 1 where she lists the various problems she has to deal with in her everyday life, concluding her speech by saying that she has to control her anger far more than Bruce has to, has become the most cited scene among detractors of the character and show. While this moment is meant to be a set-up for Jen being overconfident in her abilities to handle She-Hulk, as demonstrated later in the show, detractors feel that the Misery Poker on display that downplays Bruce's trauma (Bruce is distrusted by several allies for his powers, spent years as a government fugitive, lost both of his chances at love and so on...) killed any chance of them sympathizing with Jen and her (comparatively) lesser struggles.

Edited by Mariofan99 on Nov 8th 2023 at 8:35:43 AM

It works . Just fix the "shoe, show" typo.

I think it needs to better explain why the fan reaction is disproportionate, i.e. contextualize how the rest of the show doesn't depict her as this selfish.

I think an important detail is that immediately after the cited event, she straight up says she doesn't want to become a superhero because how it traumatized Bruce.