90th Academy Awards (Oscars)

I liked winner The King’s Speech. Some say The Social Network deserved to win, but in retrospect it doesn’t quite grasp what makes Facebook and Zuckerberg so dangerous as we’ve had to discover in these past few years.

I'll defend Moonlight to the day I die. Call it Oscar Bait if you want, it's an amazing film.

The term Oscar Bait is so overused as to become meaningless.

I liked Manchester by the Sea better but still great pick.

Ehhh. The King’s speech is fine, but I find it a bit... dull? It’s an overlap of three overdone genres, WWII period piece + British aristocracy + inspiring disability. I don’t really like any of the 2010 nominees except Toy Story 3; Inception was fine but it didn’t blow my mind. Other than TS 3 and King’s Speech, it was a really grim/bleak year of nominees. Black Swan, Winter’s Bone, The Fighter, True Grit... all washed out lighting and depressing. Sad is not always better/deeper, dangit.

But then I went and looked at 2010 films; it was overall a crappy year. Lots of middle range garbage (Valentine’s Day- the mediocre American Love Actually ripoff we all needed!) and bad blockbusters that shouldn’t have been made (Russell Crowe is Robin Hood! Jake Gyllenhaal is the Prince of Persia! Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhghh).

Ditto. I freaking loved it. Only movie I’ve watched at home in years where I didn’t touch my phone or say a word for the entire run time. You can feel the care that went into it, the delicate characterization and deft cinematography; the personal experiences of the writer and director infuse the film with a depth that is staggering. And I don’t generally like quiet character piece movies.

Edited by wisewillow on Aug 10th 2018 at 10:35:16 AM

The King's Speech was an awful pick. At least three other nominees—Inception, Toy Story 3, and The Social Network—were all better.

I didn’t see The Social Network. I actually really liked Inception initially, but it’s soured on me. It’s... not as clever as it thinks? It’s an issue I have with Nolan in general. The concept is neat but it falls apart the longer you think about it.

Plus I’m so, so sick of the tragic dead wife trope, and the tragic mentally ill wife trope, and the tragic evil sexy ex trope. Marion Cotilliard’s character is all three, and yet she doesn’t feel like an actual character so much as a puppet of the story. And Ellen Page is underused.

The movie has some fantastic moments, and some great action scenes, I love Arthur and Eames, but.... it just doesn’t work for me.

Edited by wisewillow on Aug 10th 2018 at 11:15:03 AM

Inception's a neat action movie, and that’s about it. I think I find more interesting as a metaphor for filmmaking, since it’s one of the few themes Nolan didn’t go far out of his way to preach about it obviously to the audience. Its predecessor Paprika is cooler in terms of surrealist imagery and setting, though it has its own issues with sexism and a villain that makes no sense.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Aug 10th 2018 at 8:10:10 AM

That's because Marion isn't a character. The Marion we see is just a manifestation of self loathing.

Yeah. It’s a bummer for one of two female roles to be a figment of a man’s imagination with no characterization or agency.

Edited by wisewillow on Aug 10th 2018 at 3:49:47 PM

I really liked The Departed, but I do not think it deserved to win over Letters from Iwo Jima. In any case, while it is slick and streamlined, I actually prefer the original story in Infernal Affairs.

I am not so sure on Inception either, but I certainly think that both Inception and The King's Speech are better than the Social Network. Frankly, to me it was the Social Network which was overly long and boring while I found The King's Speech really engaging.

I agree that Paprika is way more interesting than Inception.

Edited by Swanpride on Aug 10th 2018 at 12:45:54 PM

Both Black Panther and Infinity War were fine films, but I don't think either one is worthy of an Oscar (well, in the case of B.P., maybe a Best Supporting Actor nomination for Michael B. Jordan, as I thought he was great in it).

They're both enjoyable Marvel Superhero films, but I don't think think they are great films.

BP seemed like it was more about establishing Wakanda and introducing the film's supporting cast, with little focus on T'Challa (he gets put into a coma half-way through, and doesn't come out of it until the third act). I mean to me that'd be like doing an Avengers sequel, but have most of the Avengers character on the sidelines, and put most of the focus on Tony Stark.... oh, wait....

Infinity War, as mentioned several posts back, doesn't have a 3-act structure, and does have kind of a clunky storyline. It's sort of like Caddyshack there there's like 3 or 4 plots going on, and you're forced to follow every one. I'm not saying IW (or Caddyshack for that matter) did a bad job handling the storylines, I'm, just saying that's kind of poor writing. The film is still leagues better than Age of Ultron, and even the first '"Avengers'' movie to a degree, in that it does a better job of keeping focus on such a large cast (with the exception of Sam/Falcon who I thought was kinda sidelined in IW, and was only there fore generic lines like, "Here we go", or "Okay.")

Personally, I'm still a little unnerved that Wonder Woman got no Oscar nominations, but Guardians of the Galaxy DID. Like, really?

For me both are enjoyable, seminal films but there was too much mediocrity in scripting, cinematography and even directing to really be considered award worthy (note I am not saying the "directors" are bad, but these are studio films where a lot of decisions were outside their control). Infinity War may be a lock for a Best Special Effects nomination, same with Black Panther for Costume Design / Hair and Make-up, but I doubt any best picture, best actor/actress, best screenplay territory. Jordan gave a fine performance in the dramatic moments, but the "I'm from the street" character tics will likely turn off voters.

Infinity War might also get the same deal Lord of the Rings did, where they saved most of the awards for Return of the King as a celebration of the entire thing. IW got all the hype for ringing in the decade, but it’s also just a Part 1 with A4 as the actual climax of the MCU as we know it.

One thing that might make the "popularity Oscar" interesting is if a popular animated gets nominated, it's another chance for an animated film to compete with live action films.

Also, who would the Oscar go to? The director? The screenwriter (s)?

It's one thing to say "(Insert Superhero Blockbuster Here) isn't Oscar worthy" as a general statement. It's another to look at the list of Oscar nominees for a given year, and not have at least a couple that make you go, "Oh, c'mon, (Insert Superhero Blockbuster Here) was better than that."

If Infinity war doesn't get the special effects award is will be a giant injustice. Same if Black Panther doesn't at least get a nod for costuming (most likely it should win, but who knows, there might still be a movie released with truly impressive costumes).

I actually liked the performance for M'Baku better than the performance for Killmonger.

You know, if they want a category for popular movies so to speak, they should do an award for the best action scene. But in general I don't think that the kind of awards are the problem, it is the presentation.

I can honestly say that I never had that reaction…because usually when there is something nominated which I feel shouldn't be on the list, it's not a superhero movie I would replace it with. Granted, I never went to every single nomination round ever. But frankly, I rather have an empty nomination slot instead of having a movie listed which I feel didn't deserve it. And so far the one Superhero movie I felt was completely academy award worthy (still haven't seen Logan, though) was The Winter Soldier. And while I loathed Birdman, that was a really, really strong year for movies overall.

Edited by Swanpride on Aug 11th 2018 at 12:46:16 PM

Reading articles pertaining to the new Oscar category, and it's amusing the reasons people on both sides of the equation don't like this new idea.

Creator s of these "popular" films see it as a consolation pity award, while the ones making the independent artsy films feel thr award too much caters to the "lowest common denominator" audience. Add to the fact that they themselves also don't seem to like blockbuster films winning awards, and would rather the Oscars just be "their thing".

I'd rather they just split Best Picture into two categories (each with five nominees), one for "Best Drama or Comedy" and one for "Best Action or Speculative Fiction". That treats the two categories equally (rather that having "outstanding popular movie" be a sort of consolation prize) and it doesn't set a box-office threshold (which is good, because there's plenty of years that don't have 4-5 excellent high-grossing movies). And it prevents the Academy from giving 7-8 of the current 10 slots to dramas, requiring them to be more selective.

Edited by Galadriel on Aug 11th 2018 at 9:57:02 AM

It's an overreaction. Most of the stuff Marvel barfs up isn't Oscar-worthy. But The Dark Knight was. The Last Jedi got a 90% from critics at Rotten Tomatoes. Logan got great reviews. Those movies could have gotten nominations over, I dunno, stuff like Call Me by Your Name that nobody saw or Oscar Bait like The Post.

Blockbusters aren't getting nominated because they don't deserve to be. Go down the list of the box office champs of 2016. Who should have been nominated? Maybe Deadpool. But go past that and the next film you find that wouldn't have been an embarrassment for an Oscar nomination is La La Land, which got one. The 2015 list, well, Inside Out deserved a nomination. The Martian got one.

It isn't perfect. But most of the movies that deserve Oscar nominations are getting Oscar nominations. Hollywood needs to make better movies. Not turn the Oscars into the People's Choice Awards like they seem to be doing with this terrible idea.

On the whole, I agree. There's no guarantee (or even likelihood) of having 5 high-grossing high-quality movies in a year.

Though I'm unsure of whether all the dramas getting Oscar nominations really deserve them. Some definitively didn't (Crash, The Reader, Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close, The Blind Side).

Answering your question: in 2016, Zootopia deserved a nomination.

Edited by Galadriel on Aug 11th 2018 at 10:15:15 AM

Bleah, Zootopia was OK, but it probably didn't deserve the Animated Feature award, much less a nomination for the big prize.

While I do agree that most blockbusters are simply not nomination worthy, there is no denial that there is a bias against blockbusters (and animated movies) within the academy. If this weren't the case, Fury Road would have won the award instead of Spotlight. Not that I have necessarily an issue with the latter, but if you have one movie which sweeps so many categories and then somehow gets snubbed in the "big ones" and another movie which barely got any other nominations and only one actual win, well, then you have to ask yourself how it can be the best movie…to elaborate, Spotlight was only nominated in six categories, which didn't even involve best actor or actress, they only were nominated for the supporting cast, and the one other win it got was for screenplay (and frankly, Inside Out might have been the more deserving candidate). Fury Road had no less than 10 nominations even though it got completely snubbed in the actor categories (which I truly don't get, Furiosa was an impressive performance, it should have gotten a nomination), and won 6 of them.

I just feel that the idea that a best picture winner doesn't win in at least three other categories is odd.

And with animated movies, well, we all know that the voters don't even botehr to watch all of the entries. They usually get it right with the nominations (no, Lego Movie didn't deserve one), but the winner is always more of a popularity contest...not that I don't think that Zootopia didn't deserve the win, but Brave certainly did not! Between Rise of the Guardians, Wreck-it Ralph and Paranormal there were no less than THREE movies which were better than Brave, but Brave was the political choice.

Oscar has always had a bias against genre films. The Silence of the Lambs, which somehow swept the awards, is the only horror movie to ever even get nominated. Few sci-fi films have ever gotten nominated—Star Wars, The Martian. The Lord of the Rings movies are about the only fantasy films to get nominated. Comedies of any kind are rarely nominated.

It's just that nowadays genre films dominate everything at the box office.

So what movies do you guys think will be part of the Most Popular nominees?

I mean recently we have been getting genre films outside of award season that have been critical darlings like Black Panther, A Quiet Place, Sorry To Bother You, Paddington 2, Mission: Impossible: Fallout, etc.

Maybe it's a response from the surprise critical hits these past couple of months.