vigilantly taxonomish
Perpetually Confused
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![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
That's my preference. I think there's more to the style than just complexity of movement methods. There's something about the face. The split ping-pong ball/pacman cartoony face is one, though it's not 100% ubiquitous (Big Bird and Snuffleuppagus don't really have it). Cartoony faces and odd skin colors on humanoids are common, though again not universal.
I also oppose using googly eyes as a requirement. Yoda and especially Farscape's Rigel are what I'd call Muppet Style, but have realistic eyes.
Please don't call them animatrons, though. That word conjures up robotic dinosaurs and creepy Chuck-E-Cheeze animals crawling out of a dimly-lit Uncanny Valley to eat my soul.
edited 22nd Jan '12 10:25:59 AM by ArcadesSabboth
Oppression anywhere is a threat to democracy everywhere.
Hammer of the Pervs
Bump for votes. I'm fine with the name the way it is.
"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
Muppets should just be a disambiguation, since it's not the official title of any of the works.
Rhymes with "Protracted."
Perpetually Confused
Why the (bleep) do we have "If a trope has the same title as a work of fiction, except if that title is a common established term for that trope." as a reason for renames if people will just ignore it?
We're not ignoring it. The title is not the same as a work and it's commonly established term for this trope. People use it to refer to things like Avenue Q after all. This would be the exact opposite of that ruling. Thus it's not really relevant.
edited 10th Feb '12 11:39:07 AM by shimaspawn
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Perpetually Confused
- Muppet IS a trademark. Yes. It's the name of a work. The creations of Jim Henson Company (now Disney).
- Even the Jim Henson Company calls their creations "puppets" or "animatronics" when not referring to the actual Muppet brand. But I suppose you will tell me they don't know the name of the stuff they make. Not as well as the almighty forums of TV Tropes. Who are clearly better experts than the people making the stuff.
Bandaid is a trademark. They call them bandages. Yet people still call bandages from other companies bandaids. A lot of times words are used much more generically than a company tries to keep them used. We even have a trope about it called Brand Name Takeover. What Henson does is the exact same thing.
There's really no need to get aggressive about it. I am merely explaining the logic of those who voted against the rename.
The rule says works. Not trademarks.
edited 10th Feb '12 11:53:08 AM by shimaspawn
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Perpetually Confused
While on the topic, there's also the rampant misuse where the thing is potholed for the work, rather than the trope. Seems we are deciding to let that go. And why not? Two wicks with a one letter difference.
See the previous post
For example
- (...) with the muppet Animal, but he's actually a pretty quiet and easygoing guy. (All Drummers Are Animals)
- A collection of Muppet parodies of famous artworks, under the title The Kermitage Collection, included Kermit and Miss Piggy in American Gothique. (American Gothic Couple)
- Often done by the Muppet characters on Sesame Street, The Muppet Show, etc. In one scene in The Muppet Movie, after getting thrown about in a bar brawl, Kermit mutters to the audience "I hope you appreciate that I'm doing my own stunts," and the piano player gives the camera a "who are you talking to?" sort of look. (Aside Glance)
- Milder variation: In The Muppet Christmas Carol, the ghostly Marley brothers (Jacob and Robert, played by Statler And Waldorf) reminisce about the year they shut down the orphanage on Christmas, leaving the kids in the snow with their frostbitten teddy bears. (Burn the Orphanage)
And I am only down to the letter C
edited 10th Feb '12 11:53:25 AM by Ghilz
That's a better argument for renaming. No one did a wick check before.
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Perpetually Confused
Yeah. I did. Page 1. Three posts in a row.
edited 10th Feb '12 11:56:10 AM by Ghilz
Perpetually Confused
Bump. So how're we solving the misuse problem.
I'm still for making Muppets a disambig.
Rhymes with "Protracted."
Perpetually Confused
I can get with that. Any other solution for the 1 out of 4 Misuse?
Well, most of the "misuse" is technically correct. The only one that was actually wrong was Muppet Christmas Carol. The rest of it is muppet being linked when talking about the puppets. So I would say a disambig link at the bottom of the description "If you're looking for the series, go here."
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
Crowner called.
Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
Loser
The The Muppet Christmas Carol example on Burn the Orphanage has been fixed, the disambig link has been added to the bottom of Muppet's description, and I went through the wicks to weed out misuse. Is it worthwhile check over the wicks again and see if there is any more misuse or can this thread be locked now that the crowner has been called?
edited 10th Mar '12 8:50:45 PM by LouieW
"irhgT nm0w tehre might b ea lotof th1nmgs i dont udarstannd, ubt oim ujst goinjg to keepfollowing this pazth i belieove iN !!!!!1 d
locking as requested
Crown Description:
Vote up for yes, down for no.
This discussion is fairly extensive, so it might be reasonable to go straight to alternative titles, but I made a single proposition rename crowner for this trope just in case here
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