Game of Thrones [Potential Book Spoilers]

That said, they can do really well with a strong guiding hand and I can see Disney keeping them in their place.

Honestly, this show is proof that Executive Meddling is not an inherently a bad thing.

Edited by Larkmarn on Feb 19th 2020 at 9:03:08 AM

Thing is, is there any evidence that any of the successful parts of the series was due to their input anyway, rather than the efforts of the highly skilled team and cast around them?

I think claiming they're not skilled showrunners is being disingenuous. They had an unprecedented amount of control over the project. And they did well (when they had material to work off of that wasn't their own). Including forming that highly skilled team and cast around them.

They're just like, the worst at writing.

Edited by Larkmarn on Feb 19th 2020 at 9:16:55 AM

Being good at producing/managing is something I could probably give them. Hiring the right people is a skill in itself. But they themselves admitted they were kinda winging it and learning on the job.

Yeah, while mistakes were definitely made, you don't make the most successful show in modern history for 8 years on blind luck alone.

I do think they're a terrible fit for Star Wars though, namely due their seething hatred for any form of religion (doesn't quite mesh with a universe so built on mysticism as SW) so it's good they're out.

Wait, seething hatred for religion? Where was that established?

IIRC another reason they lost the SW deal is while they were telling Disney that the Star Wars Project would be the sole project they would be working on once Go T wrapped, they ALSO signed a contract with Netflix for another project telling them they would be working on both at the same time.

This plus a whole lot of other factors that surfaced post the Finale made Disney decide to scrap the project

Basically a conclusion taken given the show's suspicious treatment of religion even in comparison to the books. Davos, a heroic character who worshiped the faith of the seven in the books is atheist in the show, The Faith Militant get a dash of Adaptational Villainy, Stannis and Mel are much more openly fanatic nuts, Sansa and Brienne lose any attachment to religion by the end, e.t.c. The only religious character portrayed with some heroism to him is Septon Ray who is basically a atheist priest, downright confessing he's not too sure if the gods are real.

Ah, I see.

I mean just look how they portrayed the High sparrow and his followers. They removed all their sympathic traits and made homophobia one of their defining features, whereas I am not entirely sure if that is even mentioned in the books.

Stannis went beyond his MEH when he burnt his daughter out of fanacism, when in the books he a) is much more sceptical towards religion, and b) refused to burn people in a similar situation. They basically turned the flawed, but overall relatively heroic Stannis into a villain, and justified that by his (in the book absent) religous fanaticism.

Edited by Zarastro on Feb 19th 2020 at 5:23:38 PM

They also made his wife - who was actually the religious fanatic - the sympathetic party in that scene.

That is illogically fucked up.

They also had Jon Snow bluntly say that there is no afterlife and imply that his friends were stupid for thinking there was on. D&D are not subtle.

Game of Thrones' barely disguised contempt for religion was probably one of my biggest gripes with the show, especially since the source material was much more nuanced on the matter.

Well, "nuanced" is not really something D&D seem to care about. In hindsight it is obvious that they took all of the subtle themes of the books and either ignored them or amplified them, to the detrimental of the story. Not to mention how they took all morally ambiguous characters and made them into heroes or villains.

It is really too bad that chances are pretty high that we will never get the last book, because I really would have liked to know where GRRM was going with the different religions. Specifically if there is anything "magical" about the Faith.

Edited by Zarastro on Feb 19th 2020 at 5:31:47 PM

GRRM has left notes for how the story ends for them to release if he does die before ADOS, so there's no need to worry about that.

But yeah now that I think about it they made the High Sparrow way more overtly evil in the show. Only reason he was like that in the books was because Cersei was a whore to begin with. They didn't treat anyone like that who didn't deserve it (except Margaery but that's also because of Cersei).

No truth whatsoever. They had been adamant about 7-8 seasons years before the Star Wars deal was on the table.

Edited by MadSkillz on Feb 20th 2020 at 1:53:09 AM

I thought that GRRM ordered his notes to be destroyed in case of his death, or have information on this changed?

What makes the High Sparrow such an interesting character in the books, is that he is really only punishing those who deserve it one way or another. Well, Margaery didn't, but the Tyrells on the other hand are much more shady in the books (except for the two adapted out elder brothers). Ironically book Loras would actually somewhat deserve what he got in the series, since he did murder two of his fellow rainbow guards out of anger.

Edited by Zarastro on Feb 20th 2020 at 10:59:27 AM

I mean, 8 seasons sure but the truncated schedule is still up in the air.

While I don't actually think there's validity to the rumor, they absolutely did rush the season by making it six episodes. I personally think they were just... over GOT itself.

Edited by Larkmarn on Feb 20th 2020 at 5:03:50 AM

Why D&D wanted to shorten the last two seasons is a matter for speculation, but it's pretty clear that they are pretty much the only people who did.

I imagine they just got tired of it and decided to phone it in or something.

Even though there'd been warning signs in prior seasons like what they did with Barristan Selmy (apparently when his actor came to them with suggestions for how his story could continue before then they laughed him off) not to mention the Dorne plot.

It was even worse. The actor deduced that they wanted to kill Selmy off, and asked them to reconsider it, and the laughed it off. He wrote afterwards a lengthy essay in which he explained why Selmy could still play an important role in the narrative, and they just brushed him off without even trying to adress his arguments. There are legitimate reasons why Selmy needed to die (mostly because otherwise neither Tyrion nor Mormont could have become Daenery's principle advisors), but that was just callous.

And yet he's still alive in the books........

Nice to know the actor is that devoted to then character at least.

Edited by slimcoder on Feb 20th 2020 at 4:22:06 AM

You say that but Martin has probably penned his death,he gets eaten by a dragon

Yeah, basically Tyrion and Jorah shilling was the main thing. Selmy also likely would have been able to talk Dany down from going Mad Queen.