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Commander

Before Faust, i would EP Efret from Sol divide-sword of darkness video game. However i want to ask anyone who played the game whether was he possesed by Heladius or not.

In Tyora's path, she said something like: "Heladius inside you"

But in Vorg's and Kashon's paths there is no indication that he is possesed.

Thanks again Ravok for the help with Frankie. I agree with cutting Le Tenia.

edited 18th Mar '18 4:46:04 PM by ACW

@ Ravok I gotta say... I second that motion. The crime is brutal and graphic in its depiction, and undoubtedly evil, but it's his only standout crime. If he had done more than that or if a pattern of that kind of behavior was established, I'd say keep. But since that's his one really awful crime, I say cut.

edited 18th Mar '18 4:48:35 PM by JoeBlitz

Okay. For the longest while, I defended Tenia, but I brought up to 43 and Ravok not long ago that I had reservations with him. Tenia's rape is portrayed brutally and the character hasn't a slightest glimmer of redeeming qualities, but when you take out the way it's shot, what are you left with? One rape scene and some brutal beatings. The only reason Tenia's rape stands out is because there's no discretion shot ever used — but we have long held crimes held in a Gory Discretion Shot to the same standard as a crime that is completely onscreen as sufficient to be measured by the trope. Aside from that? Objectively, how is this supposed to be any more heinous than a single cruel, godawful murder (like what the protagonists of the film do in their sociopathic revenge spree?) or a rape that's played with discretion but nevertheless is still rape?

I've long, long stood that it takes more than a single crossing of the MEH doesn't net you on this trope unless it's a true, spectacular display of absolute, unrelenting brutality. Even in the mundane niche and setting Tenia occupies, I have to say Tenia? Doesn't truly cut it.

edited 18th Mar '18 4:50:15 PM by Scraggle

Edit: "yeah" to Frankie, sorry, missed that one

Sad as it is to say about one of our iconic "one really bad crime CMs", I've gotta support this cut as well.

Grotesque as it is to be shown nine minutes of rape... it's not any worse than a rapist who doesn't have their entire rape shown, just grosser. His writeup also mentions him getting a kick out of violence when his lookalike is beaten as though it's a crime when that's literally just being an asshole.

Furthermore, the fact that the "heroes" take such an extreme vigilante "shoot first, ask questions later" stance on attacking who they think is Le Tenia, also means he's got heinous standard competition.

I'm not even sold on his one rape being enough to cross even an absolute baseline and he's got pretty brutal anti heroes competing with him, so a "cut" vote from me.

edited 18th Mar '18 5:03:30 PM by 43110

One major sticking point for me? Tenia's writeup is mostly just bloated with pointless details of him being a jackass that don't really contribute to his qualification overall.

"I've long, long stood that it takes more than a single crossing of the MEH doesn't net you on this trope unless it's a true, spectacular display of absolute, unrelenting brutality."

John Wakefield from Scars being probably THE best example of that.

I'd honestly go with the minority opinion here and I'll be honest with you guys. I'm actually in favor in keeping Le Tenia. Here's my argument why:

While Le Tenia's only standout crime was raping a woman for 9 minutes that ended up making her in a comatose state. Personally, I think he does enough due to the horrid personal scale that he has and sure, those guys who tried to seek venegance also screws the heinous standard. But I still think Le Tenia still qualifies due to the Personal scale that he inflicted towards the protagonist. So yeah, here's my opinion towards this debacle

Oh and I'll say yes to the Fly Guy btw

Yes. Even me and Ravok had doubts on whether or not Wakefield went all the way, but fact is there's a great difference between one singular rape, brutal though it may be, and raping and torturing a little girl for three months before cutting her apart, alive, all for a heinously petty reason.

edited 18th Mar '18 4:55:44 PM by Scraggle

I get what you're saying Elfen but that relies a bit too much on Protagonist-Centered Morality for me. In my view he may not have cared whether she lived or died and clearly didn't care about her human rights but at the end of the day: he did one bad thing to one person.

I'll give a to Le Tenia as well.

Yes.

edited 18th Mar '18 5:19:56 PM by AustinDR

Fair enough. Though I'm still keep my opinion on keeping Le Tania. Ah well, if he's a cut he's a cut anyways. Welp, time to say goodbye to one of the most recognizable C Ms when it comes to "one crime could push you over". But hey, We still have Shou,Rich or Wakefield so that's something. And I'll have to admit that Le Tenia is one of the reasons why I kept hearing one of the OST from Berserk

Jung-Hyuk, Frankie, and Commander.

Gotta say I'm going with the crowd and agree with cutting Tenia, especially since we hold DiscretionShots to the same heinous standard as on-screen portrayals.

... Austin, are you going through a Doki Doki Lit club phase?

edited 18th Mar '18 5:05:50 PM by erazor0707

So a while ago I made an EP for Splinter Cell villain Norman Soth. Unfortunately, I've discovered something that may count as a mitigating factor.

So during the final mission when Soth plans to unleash the small poxes virus at LAX airport? He actually tries to prevent the virus from spreading to other countries, only wanting to kill people in the USA.

One of his mercenaries carries a message where they talk about try to prevent infecting passengers boarding international flights. Later in the mission, the protagonist can also overhear a phone call between Soth and someone who could be either his CIA mole or a Bigger Bad - it's never revealed and never brought up again - asking him if he has made sure that once they've unleashed the virus, no international flights will be departing,

He’s still planning to unleash a virus that could killed hundreds, if not thousands, of people. And he had no problem ordering his men to kill all the French lab employees in an earlier mission. Still, a mitigating factor is a mitigating factor. Therefore, I sadly have to suggest to cut my own etnry.

Holy shit! Now we have to cut Soth as well. That hurts but ah well. So many cuts that we have this week actually

You know what come to think of it. I think is rather ambiguous

edited 18th Mar '18 5:21:59 PM by ElfenLiedFan90

"asking him if he has made sure that once they've unleashed the virus, no international flights will be departing,"

Who's doing the asking? And could this in anyway be considered Pragmatic Villainy?

Frankie

Tenia and Soth

New proposal, from Legion of the Dead.

Who's the candidate?

High Priestess Aneh-Tet, a Set worshipper exiled to the Americas thousands of years aho.

What does she do?

When Aneh-Tet died, she placed a spell on herself that could resurrect her to take over the lands of the living and the dead in a wave of destruction. She then placed her nody in a Booby Trap filled tomn. First scene of the film is a couple of idiot dirt bikers stumbling upon Aneh-Tet's tomb and being killed by the traps. One is impaled through the head with spikes and the other has a stone slab dropped on his head.

A couple days later, Ameh-Tet is resurrected by the spell being read aloud. Starting her quest to awaken six warriors who will be needed for her scheme, she runs into a cop investigating a noise, and strangles him to death. She then stumbles upon the head of the dig, and uses magic to dehydrate his body so fast that it melts his damn flesh and char him into a skeleton.

The next morning, Ameh-Tet stumbles upon the two remaining professors. One of them tries to ask why she's in the tomb (as she looks fully human, but nobody really recognizes her). Ameh-Tet immediately drains his soul. She goes to drain the other professor, but the Dirty Coward makes a deal with her: His students for his life. She's fully prepared to deny him, but he nltes that this will be a much quicker way to unleash her army.

That night, the priestess seduces one of the students and lures him out into the woods. She then pins him down and drains him. The next morning, she attacks another student, who tries to stab her. She does not like this one bit, and drains him.

She tries to claim her sixth and final victim in Molly's Love Interest Connor, trying to drain him before he escapes. However, she simply drains another guy. She then resurrects the Six and demands they get the final Virgin Sacrifice (who turns out to be Molly's sister) for her plan and massacre ecerybody else in the area. This amounts to an entire motel, by the by. While our heroes escape, the motel is massacred and the virgin is procured. They end up going after Ameh-Tet, which leads to the also-virgin Connor being made the sacrifice and a coiple law enforcement officials being killed in the struggle. Finally, Molly stabs the priestess with her own sacrificial dagger, blasting her to bone in the magical recoil.

Heinousness?

Big Bad, sets it.

Mitigating factors?

Her devotion to Set isn't mitigating. She explicitly serves him for power. Otherwise, nuthin'.

Verdict?

Soth's asking the guy on the phone. And sadly there's nothing that indicates that it's just Pragmatic Villainy.

Commander, Frankie and Aneh-Tet. Not sure on cutting Soth, since it could be Pragmatic Villainy. I'm indifferent to cutting the tapeworm as I'm not familar with the character or film. Now on to business.

Ever wonder what Mark Jefferson would be like in a slasher movie ?

This one of two characters I've been planning to revisit for quite a while. I brought him up back in 2014, and after rewatching this film, I thought it'd be worth a shot.

Urban Legends: Final Cut is a loosely connected sequel to 1998's Urban Legends, with both films focusing on a Serial Killer who terrorizes university campuses with an MO revolving around defeating urban legends. Like other slashers of its time, it's a Follow the Leader to Scream. The first film was one of my favourites in 90's horror. The second film focuses on college student, Amy Mayfield, the daughter of a deceased, documentary filmmaker who seeks to start a movie making career of her own, and meets security guard Reese Wilson (one of two returning characters from the first film) who brings up the previous films events giving Amy the idea to make a movie of that premise (talk about meta) when surprise surprise a new serial killer is terrorizing her school with the same MO as the previous killer.

Since this guys following Scream format, the killer is a spoiler so cards off the table, it's the University Professor Solomon.

Who is he ? What Does He Do ?

Professor Solomon at first seems like your typical cute looking, charming and charismatic film making teacher at Alpine University. He announces to his senior students that if they submit a thesis film they worked on, they will win the prestigious Hitchcock Award, virtually guaranteeing the winner a film career in Hollywood. Unbeknownst to everyone, when Solomon himself was a student and put his work in for the contest, it was down between his film and that of another students. They brought in a filmmaker for deciding vote, who happens to be Amy's father. Short version is Solomon lost and his Hollywood career was over before it began. Now he's stuck as a teacher.

Anyways, when Amy announces to Solomon her movie idea, Solomon gets an idea of his own; to play Jack the Ripoff to the previous killer and frame Amy as Revenge by Proxy. To kick off his killing spree, Solomon sneaks in to a bar where he spikes the drink of an acting student named Lisa. Lisa wakes up to find she's been tortured by an ominous masked killer (Solomon) who has removed her kidney. Lisa tries to escape, but the killer decapitates broken window and feeds her kidney to his guard dog. Later on, the killer goes after one of Amy's actresses, Sandra, whom he stabs and slices repeatedly, chasing Sandra down while filming it and showing the reel to the rest of Amy's cast and crew.

Another part of Solomon's plan involves a student named Travis Stark, who worked on a great film that was sure to win the Hitchcock Award. Travis apparently Ate His Gun and committed suicide over a fail that Solomon gave him earlier. This draws the suspicion of Travis' twin brother Trevor, who seeks to find the truth about his brothers death, teaming up with Amy. We later learn that Solomon in fact murdered Travis himself in a plot to steal credit for his work. It turns out that another student named Toby, the films Red Herring worked on an awful film and Travis faked a sound credit for Toby to help him graduate. The whole reason why Travis failed is that Solomon edited the credits of Travis's film and placed them on Toby's, so Solomon himself could steal credit for Travis's film.

Back to his killing spree, the killer corners one of Amy's crewmates Simon and bashes him to death with his camera. Since neither Sandra's nor Simon's bodies are found their deaths are seemingly unnoticed. When Amy and her crew plan on filming a Tunnel of Death scene using an old theme park attraction, the killer shows up and electrocutes her other two crew members Sam and Dirk. Next, the killer lures Amy to a bell tower, with her Vanessa with a fake love note. The killer chases Amy and Vanessa up to the top of the tower, locks Amy in a room with the bodies while she listens to Vanessa being killed. Amy escapes and meets up with Trevor and they discover that all of Amy's friends and crew where part of Travis's thesis film as well as Toby's film having its credits switched with Travis.

Suspecting Toby of being the killer, Amy and Trevor kidnap him and take him to a horror studio to get him to confess. They also call Solomon for help. It's there where Toby reveals that Travis was helping him and his confusion of the credits being switched at this point Solomon reveals himself to be the killer, shooting and seemingly killing Toby. One Motive Rant about stealing Travis' film and framing Amy later, Solomon takes Trevor at gun point as he chases down Amy down, before trying to kill him and Toby again with a shovel after being disarmed. Amy gets ahold of a fake gun and holds Solomon at gun point. Reese and tells Amy to drop the gun and kick it away. As Solomon tries to spin this on Amy, there is a commotion with rack of fake guns are knocked over Amy, Trevor and Solomon get into a standoff where it turns out that both Solomon and Trevor both have fake guns, while Amy had Reese' gun. She doesn't fire so Reese can make the arrest, but Solomon lunges at her, setting the gun off on both of them. Luckily Amy was wearing a bullet proof vest, while Solomon is rendered unconscious.

At the end of the film, it is shown that Amy did manage to make a film career of her own, having submitted her film based on the events around her campus and got the Hitchcock Award. Solomon meanwhile, has presumably been rendered either vegetative or catatonic as he's placed in a mental facility, where after watching the film is wheeled out by a nurse...who turns out to be the first films killer Brenda Bates, who smiles at the audience.

Redeeming Qualities or Freudian Excuse ?

Notta.

As per the norm of the whodunit slasher genre, Solomon is one of those killers who puts up a front before their reveal. His being that of a seemingly laid back, charismatic teacher (reason why I compared him to Mark Jefferson). In actuality with his killer persona, he's as sadistic as they come in trying to make his murders as brutal or cruel as possible. When revealed his personality is that of a vicious egomaniac.

His motivations stem from the fact that he hates being a teacher and he feels that his life was ruined when he lost the Hitchcock Award. As such he sees fit to murder and torture his students to steal credit for a film they made and, but also frame the daughter of the man who casted a deciding vote against him as Revenge by Proxy.

What's is find interesting is how according to his Motive Rant, this scheme of his was thought up on a whim! The idea never occurred to him until Amy pitched her movie idea. He's been hiding his bitterness and jealously for years before Amy told him about her project and now the opportunity is presented to him, he goes on a killing spree.

Heinous by the stories standards ?

Now Solomon's main competition here is Brenda Bates of the previous film, who doesn't count due to genuinely loving and mourning her dead boyfriend who was killed by the protagonist in an urban legend testing (gang initiations with turned off headlights) and the fact that she goes to a university that has a local urban legend and a class that teaches about urban legends as fuel for her fire. Brenda is a sadistic killer herself has a body count of nine people and one dog. Her main points of brutality comes with microwaving said dog and attempting to torture the protagonist Natalie to death by cutting out her kidneys in a room with her other victims bodies.

As for Solomon he has a successful bodycount of seven, with the additional attempted bodycount of about four others. He also adds cruelty and brutality to a lot of his kills, that I find adds more to him than Brenda; Solomon's brutality comes in with his first two kills; torturing Lisa in the same manner Brenda was planning to do to Natalie, and drawing her death out; chasing and cutting Sandra while filming and and showing it to her friends; his killing of Sam and Dirk has him forcing the former into grabbing a metal bar connected to an electric wire and strait up pushes the latter into a fuse box after hacking both his hands; locking Amy in a room full of bodies while she listens to her friend being murdered.

I also stated before in my belief that ones motive for their crimes can makes their crimes worse (but that's just my opinion); while Brenda was out trying to avenge the Accidental Murder of her boyfriend; Solomon in the other hand is basically doing his killing spree out of jealously and a petty vendetta all to steal credit for a movie so he can become famous, and land the daughter of the man who cost him his fame in prison. And having watched to the two movies and killers back to back today I notice a bit of a Contrasting Sequel Antagonist between Solomon and Brenda; besides the former being a male teacher, the latter a female student, Brenda apparently had her revenge planned out, sought therapy after her boyfriends death and a somewhat redeeming or sympathetic motive - Solomon thought of his scheme on a basic whim after years of bitterness, and had a completely selfish and small minded motive for his killing spree.

Also last note I realized while writing this effortpost, that completely blew my mind - Brenda is an Ax-Crazy female villain and clear cut case of Love Makes You Crazy and Love Makes You Evil and at the time of the second film, is now a nurse working as a mental institution. In the first film, she had something of a Villainous Crush in the male lead Paul, who is played by none other than Jared Leto.

edited 18th Mar '18 5:47:47 PM by Beast

Yea to your candidate, Duck.

NTG, help me understand... was this like a recent DLC kinda expansion or was this mitigating factor overlooked upon first play through? Really hoping for the former.

Hence why I said "DLC kinda expansion". I appreciate the honesty but it is a little frustrating when something so blatantly mitigating gets missed. I'm not pissed or anything but please make effort to be fully attentive to these kind of things going forward.

Also Beast, what Scraggle said x99999, I'm literally upvoting him based on my trust of Joe and Scraggs' opinion because of how long it is.

edited 18th Mar '18 5:36:14 PM by 43110

The High Priestess and Solomon.

Yes to Aneh-Tet and Solomon but please truncate your effortposts Beast this is becoming a legitimate issue. We do not need so many paragraphs dedicated to stretching out the details of a serial killer.

edited 18th Mar '18 5:33:55 PM by Scraggle

The game was released in 2004. DL Cs didn’t even existed during that time.

Sadly it was just something I overlocked during the play through I did before the EP. I’m really sorry about that.

edited 18th Mar '18 5:33:49 PM by NTG

I'm abstaining on La Tenia. I cannot in good conscience vote on someone so despicable in a film I have not seen.

I am curious what Lighty thinks on this.

Sorry bout that.

There. I trimmed it.

edited 18th Mar '18 5:48:11 PM by Beast