Not Tropeworthy: Slapstick Knows No Gender

Quoting a discussion in the discussion page:

"Whitecroc: "I don't quite get why this needs to be listed as a trope. The description claims it's unusual, but there are plenty of examples noted. Maybe the description could be folded into the Slapstick article, if it is felt that this trope actually exists?"

Darthvoorhees:"Because it is very uncommon. You're much more likely to come across slapstick against male characters. Compare how many are on here, then compare how many of the "Traditional male slapstick" you see."

Mag Bas: "Be uncommon not means be a trope. Tropes are conventions and devices, independent of the rarity. The question here is: said women are Butt Monkeys because they are women?"

I think this trope would work better if reworked into a trope about Double Standard in slapstick. Most of the description is about that, anyway. As of now, it sounds more like an attempt to list subversions to that Double Standard.

The way I see it, this trope is simply "a female Butt-Monkey".

In works with a diverse cast there is a trope in the fact that most of the characters who receive slapstick are male. There isnt a rule when the cast is mostly female as someone has to be the Butt-Monkey, especially when the leads of the show are girls.

I would say stuff like Panty And Stocking With Garterbelt, Tenchi Muyo, Mitsudomoe, Azumanga Daioh and other shows shouldn't be in this but I would say yes to Pokemon.

EDIT: I would say a majority of the list itself have an all female cast.

edited 22nd May '15 2:10:03 AM by Memers

Hence why this trope is pretty much indistinguishable from Butt-Monkey.

And you mention Pokemon, but I see their character pages still list Butt-Monkey (rather than this trope) for female characters who got the brunt of jokes.

What I described would be a subtrope of that and not really a specific character trope its more the work itself allows such antics to take place. Also Butt-Monkey is not always physical, its just simply ' being the butt of many demeaning jokes', 'Slapstick' itself is far more physical.

Admittingly the stereotype itself is might be Dead Horse Trope though at least in the past 20 years or so. But it was a stereotype way back when, only Lucille Ball could really pull it off.

edited 24th May '15 5:45:11 AM by Memers

The real trope is more like Slapstick Is Male, and a trope much like Black Dude Dies First. Not always there, but it's something that's far more common than chance would have it.

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Cut.

What Another Duck said. The real trope is "men are more frequently the subject of slapstick" and then this lists aversions.

It's one of those tricky Tropes in Aggregate but it most certainly has been a thing. It's leaning towards a Dead Horse Trope, but it's still a noteworthy trope.

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The name, description and examples seem to suggest that the trope IS about the aversions though ("Women can be subject to slapstick too!").

I agree that there is an underlying trope implied in it (as the Duck pointed out), but I think it's better to just scrap this one, and YKTTW that other definition.

Tropes in Aggregate isn't something that works well if it's something that's fallen out of favour, and the page lists aversions. The more modern the examples get, the less notable they get as far as pattern-breaking is concerned.

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A Dead Horse Trope is still a trope, though.

I agree with the idea to rework it into an Aggregate Trope about "slapstick only features men".

So, this trope is the comedic version of Would Hit a Girl, with the equivalent of Would Not Hit a Girl being the presumed state?

Ketchum's corollary to Clarke's Third Law: Any sufficiently advanced tactic is indistinguishable from blind luck.

Would Hit a Girl is a character trope.

Would Hit a Girl is a character trope. This is the writer writes 'slapstick', which is basically physical comedy, to happen to a girl.

Something that didn't happen very much till like the late 70s early 80s aside from Lucille Ball.

edited 8th Jun '15 5:32:49 PM by Memers

Ok: looking again, I guess what I meant to say is that, at its foundation, this is an Aversion of Women Are Delicate due to the physical nature of slapstick. (I'm surprised it's not in that index.)

Then again, I'm thinking that in the 60's and later, there could be slapstick visited upon a woman so long as it was by another woman.

I agree that it is a Trope in Aggregate; or perhaps better said an Aversion Of Aggregate. Perhaps we rename the Trope Double Standard: Slapstick Is For Guys and list these as aversions.

Ketchum's corollary to Clarke's Third Law: Any sufficiently advanced tactic is indistinguishable from blind luck.

Mabel Normand was starring in slapstick 100 years ago.

I agree with this; but how about making it an example-less trope? Or maybe list only historical aversions.

edited 19th Jun '15 8:28:01 AM by Rjinswand

Bump; just saw this new YKTTW: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/discussion.php?id=p76etd3n6x4rqftwzaxpdahv

If we remake Slapstick Knows no Gender into Double Standard Slapstick Is For Guys as has been suggested, it could become a subtrope to this YKTTW'd trope.

UPD: And another similar YKTTW: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/discussion.php?id=3gaekm86awgmd7cpfgx5qxll

edited 25th Jul '15 2:18:48 PM by Rjinswand

Indistinguishable from Butt-Monkey?. Butt Monkey is about someone designated by the story to be humiliated. Slapstick Knows No Gender is about women being the butt of comedy deriving from physicality.

Being the butt of a joke doesn't make one a butt monkey unless they are the designated butt of jokes. Angelina Love running into a closed door is an example of Slapstick Knows No Gender but she was not the butt monkey of The Beautiful People. That was either Cute Kip, for being kicked out of the group twice and being beaten up by the male wrestlers they crossed since TNA had an anti male on female violence rule, Velvet Sky for being on the wrong end of multiple successive squash matches, being held hostage with a big hairy tarantula, having her friend turned into a zombie against and being the Dumbest blonde in a quartet of dumb blondes(until Lacey Von Erich showed up anyway), or maybe it was Madison Rayne for enduring such 'hazing' as wearing a brown paper bag over her head and involuntarily serving as a whore to a referee.

Angelina Love was the furthest thing the group had from a butt monkey. She was the only one not to be put on a stretcher during Awesome Kong's Roaring Rampage of Revenge against the group, but she did prove slapstick can still apply to women in TNA when Velvet Sky was being beaten up by Tara(another example of her being the butt monkey) and Love hurt herself trying to get away..

edited 12th Aug '15 10:05:27 PM by IndirectActiveTransport

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The problem is that they are not the butt of physical comedy because they are women. And considering that the new year is close and the major part of the tropers that participated here concurred that this is not a trope i am creating a crowner. tvtropes.org/pmwiki/crowner.php/Slapstick Knows No Gender

edited 20th Dec '15 2:37:09 AM by MagBas

Sorry, but that is not a functioning crowner link. You might want to check out How Crowners Work.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman

The address works in the URL window, but i am not sure as create a link to this. EDIT: Second attempt: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/crowner.php/SingleProposition/SlapstickKnowsNoGender

edited 20th Dec '15 11:10:29 AM by MagBas

Hooked a blank page action crowner; stacking so many ideas into a Single Prop is a bad idea, best to have all options separate.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman

Thanks.