Michael Jackson: Leaving Neverland

The controversy around accusations of pedophilia against Michael Jackson has been renewed with the release of a four hour documentary named "Leaving Neverland", in which two former victims tell of their experiences.

It hasn't been released yet, but preliminary viewings have left viewers shocked, apparently.

The Jackson family denies everything and calls it a smear campaign. But how long can you maintain that?

Several reviews are out, and apparently it's a hard watch but it's really important. The thing, though, is that the trailer has way more dislikes than likes with a lot of comments defending MJ's innocence and calling the victims liars. I'm wondering how many of them will even watch the movie.

But even so, this could be a monumental shift on how people see him. I know I no longer want to hear any of his work.

And of course the family is defending him. They're not just going to admit to that. I don't think it'll do them good for long though.

I'm not surprised there are many dislikes on the trailer. I heard people discussing it on the radio, and people are really reluctant about accepting this. Dropping R Kelly was nothing compared to the king of pop.

Personally, I'm going to wait a few years to see what comes out of the woodworks before passing judgement.

While there is the definite possibility that Safechuck and Robson's accusations are true, there are far too many details that prevent me from considering their case to be beyond reasonable doubt.

But haven't we already been waiting a few years for that? I think this is the "coming out of the woodworks" phase now.

Jackson's footprint on modern pop music is huge, and his collaborative works are beyond counting. Even if we as a society could get around to accepting what happened, dealing with an offender with such an inescapable legacy is probably going to take a different approach than the previous abusers we found out about.

Wouldn't Bill Cosby be comparable though? I mean, he also had a light hearted image before it came out he was a creep. This situation very much reminds me of that, although then again Michael Jackson was way bigger and he's dead unlike Cosby. I guess it might be more accurate to compare it to Jimmy Savile.

The movie has aired, so has anyone seen it? What did you think?

So… Considering there's been allegations for decades, do the testimonies in this film bring new elements?

Yes, it is certainly a new light on the situation. The victims did testify that they were not molested years earlier, though that testimony may have happened out of fear. Ophra has done a piece on it as well, and she can understand the contradictions in the stories.

I haven't seen it yet, but I have heard of some radio stations dropping his music out of rotation in the wake of the film. It got me thinking that Michael Jackson is so omnipresent in certain US radio formats that if stations "canceled" him nationwide it would be pretty noticeable and they'd have to fill the gap with something else: In particular there's a "mix" station that they used to always have on at work that practically has an entire greatest hits album worth of MJ in rotation ^note we haven't had this station on lately, so no idea if they're still playing him so much.

I’m not sure it will be that difficult to replace his songs. The New Zealand and British radio stations mentioned his work hasn’t played for years and I think I’ve only heard one of his songs once on the radio. There was a similar backlash to drop him when the molestation trials happened in the 2000’s, so this isn’t anything new.

Cross posting from other threads that have done the same, the episode of The Simpsons featuring Michael Jackson has been pulled from syndication and even streaming and future DVD sets.

Okay, now who is that supposed to help? "Damn, this guy was in an episode of a show that also featured dozens and dozens of other voice actors, writers, producers, etc. We better not play it."

It's largely done out of the creators' personal volition, on top of avoiding the possibility of one of his victims getting triggered when they see it. The same reason why his music is getting pulled, really.

And like I said on the other thread, this will likely merely lead to said DVD becoming a collector's item and drive up the price.

HBO is being sued by his estate for breaking a contract they had forbidding them from Disparaging MJ.

I don't think the comparison works. Neither of them were really... Jackson big. (And in Saville's case, it's not clear if Jackson was anywhere as prolific as Saville was - yet)

Countless artists came to prominence in relation to Michael Jackson.

For example, do you not discuss that Jackson is the one who convinced Queen to release Another One Bites The Dust? Watch Todd in the Shadows' one hit wonderland and count the number of episode that mention Jackson. How do you discuss Motown without bringing up Jackson? It's gonna be a hell of a time for music historians to figure out how you even talk about this one.

His estate probably gets royalties from the syndication. So I think it's more a "We don't want to be giving them any more"

Edited by Ghilz on Mar 8th 2019 at 9:17:18 AM

You can have a contract like that? What did HBO get in return for it?

You can have a contract for anything that's not illegal. Agreement is dated 1992, so presumably what they got is whatever else was in the contract.

I have never been a huge Michael Jackson fan, so I am not particulary moved by these allegations. And what the alleged victims tell sounds very plausible and paints the picture of a nefarious predator. Yet it does not suffice in my opinion to condemn him, since one could easily question their credibility (they would have previously lied in court, and they are currently suing for compensation). Then again, this documentary might encourage other possible victims to come forward and tell their story.

The film is in any case an important reminder how readily people are willing to trust celebrities (or perhaps more cynically, how readily they trust them when it looks like it might pay off). I mean the parents had no problem with leaving their children unsupervised for the entire day with a man they barely personally knew... . I doubt they would have done the same if MJ had simply been a stranger who lived in the neighbourhood... .

Edited by Zarastro on Mar 10th 2019 at 1:13:58 PM

But that's just it. Usually these predators aren't strangers to these children and their parents.

And you can hardly blame the parents for being star struck. People have a tendency to trust famous people, or those in positions of authority, more than other strangers.

Personally, I don't believe this iteration of the MJ fuel. Primarily, there's been numerous trials and raids on Jackson's properties and he's been found "not guilty" on all his charges and they've found nothing, respectively. If anything, this is more akin to the guys cashing in on the #metoo movement while also trying to defile his name even when most of the evidence does point to him being innocent.

You could not have picked a worse avatar to attach that post to.

Eh, I got this avatar because I liked the joke it was from. It was basically just "A $320 skin-tight jumpsuit or 320 Chicken Mc Nuggets" joke. And yes, I know that Bill Cosby is not a good guy anymore, but I've dissociated the man from the joke the image was portraying.

Are you so sure people wouldn't leave children alone with another person unless he were rich and famous? Check Abducted In Plain Sight on Netflix