Miraculous Ladybug

It kind of makes me wonder what this show would be like if it had some more talented and ambitious people behind it. Like GregWeisman for example.

Edited by Neveratall on Sep 26th 2020 at 3:01:28 PM

Well, Greg Weisman did help make W.I.T.C.H. better when he joined the show, so something like that is possible here.

Edited by jessicadicicco610 on Sep 26th 2020 at 12:01:05 PM

A show like this under Greg Weisman would be fantastic, mostly because the things he tends to focus on are exactly the kind of things this show needs to do. I'd even say he's specifically amazing at shows like that. At the very least, he would know how to make this show's cadre of villains significantly more interesting - especially the entirely sympathetic ones (IE, pretty much everyone that's not Hawkmoth).

On the flipside, Hawkmoth would probably be a Shakespeare fan, and I'd be wondering every episode which villain it will be who ways "revenge is for suckers."

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 26th 2020 at 12:06:16 PM

I just kind of feel like this show is wasted potential.

What about the show? I was trying get into it, but I just wasn't into the romance plot.

It's alright. It's still the same Strictly Formula lifted from a few magical girls series: bad guy with corrupting powers picks a random citizen - usually but not always one of the heroine's friends - and corrupts something about them into a villain/monster. Heroine and sidekick fight monster, lose at first, then the heroine figures out the perfect way to beat that villain/monster and cures them. In the meantime, main character agonizes over telling the guy she loves about her feelings, and then doesn't. Will They or Won't They?. "Everybody Laughs" Ending.

The romance subplot never goes away, or really goes anywhere. Every other episode they hinge the plot over whether something's going to change, and then don't do so. Rinse, repeat.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 26th 2020 at 6:38:53 AM

At this point, either side should be figuring out the other's identity, made their way through some major villains or preparing for the final fight with the main villain. This show is kind of trapped in the mid point.

Hell, the main duo are still stuck in this awkward two person triangle and everything goes out of its way to keep it that way.

Edited by Blueace on Sep 26th 2020 at 12:02:49 PM

Now that you mention it, yeah, I wasn't a big fan of the "Bad Future" episode.

The point where "does everything in its power to keep it that way" started to annoy me is when I realized just how much of the show's rules are in place specifically to keep things from not being formula any more.

The characters can NEVER reveal their identities to ANYONE, because it's the RULES, even in situation where it would clearly help immensely. Other characters who get Miraculous can NEVER hold onto them, because REASONS. The relationship between the main characters and the ones they trust must always be at arms length and NEVER change. Hell, the show just barely started using recurring antagonists at all. I've never seen a show not just be formula, but canonize it to such a degree.

Hate Sink aside, one of the reasons Chloe was legit one of the best characters in the show for a while is because she got an arc, she got development, and even when she went bad (the first time) we started to understand why. One of the reasons Lila is such a good replacement antagonist is that she actually engages with other characters and does interesting things with Marinette's character. But then they decided Chloe should be back to the way she was before, square one like it never happened (and a big shrug for Lila who was taking her former role).

But TBH, the problem isn't being formulaic (the Scooby Doo joke wasn't disparaging Scooby - Scooby is formulaic and works for a reason). It's that its formulaic and pretends that its not because that's what attracts its audience (who are now starting to catch on). Which, especially for me who likes it for the strength of the supporting cast in general, can be a pain to watch sometimes. It's still a fun show, though. It just really needs to Grow the Beard .

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 26th 2020 at 9:53:27 AM

I hate the idea that that waste of flesh Chloe never learns a thing or even TRIES to be less of a scumbag. At least nobody else likes her or is intimidated into liking her.

Also I wonder why Hawk Moth doesn't just ASK FOR HELP. His attempts at forcefully taking the Miraculous are clearly going nowhere.

We can see he wants his wife back. Maybe if he just made an honest plea for help, maybe they could work something out. Though that probably requires his identity being sussed out.

Edited by GreatT on Sep 26th 2020 at 1:42:04 PM

I mean Gabriel is clearly a dick and a control freak, he probably has issues just asking.

I came to accept that that's probably never going to happen, which is a large part of the reason I gave up on the show. I get the impression that the creator/showrunner for this show feels that the show doesn't need to be improved, and is fine the way it is.

Edited by Neveratall on Sep 27th 2020 at 4:10:31 AM

Watched the New York Special

Of course this starts with Mr. Pigeon.

Heard about the voices sounding a little older. Definitely noticeable, does make the fangirling by Marinette seem a little off though. The babble mainly sounds a bit off, but maybe its just getting used to it.

The animation bump is also nice.

Oh Nathalie in a sick bed.

Kagami kissing Adrian was cute. Still rooting for the impossible OT3.

Thought the bag LB gave CN was going to be the macaron which lets CN purify Akuma.

Plagg:"See any super villains in this house?" ehehehe

All those people in the plane noticing Marinette's distress over Adrien were great

Framing Alya/Nino, Mylene/Ivan and Rose/Juleka as couples again I see.

American Heroes!

Oh right, The Owl is still a thing.

Nino and Alya are trying to convince Adrien to cheat on his girlfriend right?

I like Uncanny Valley but not a fan of her instantly shipping Adrian and Marinette

Hot Dog Dan is kind of amazing. Although those anti-gravity hotdogs have totally killed at least one person.

Again, Rose and Juleka doing the couple dance when Marinette and Adrien dance above the building

That thing with Alya talking about Doorman. She says superhero, but does he really even need to be one? Maybe he just does global transportation on weekends and teaches for the passion?

Is the door thing like a superhero magic defense against the Kwami?

Who's driving Gabe's car? Also wow Gabe almost got a nuke.

Oh, Doorman's thing about the common good ruins my theory.

I like Sparrow too a lot.

Haha at Chat's failure to help Marinette.

When Owl guy says to hand over the source of their powers, does he know about Miraculous? Cause Uncanny's powers are effectively built into her, how does he know its not the same for them?

Drain tunnels again like season 2.

I laughed at Kwami of FREEDOM!

Not really into Marinette's resolution for Adrian to stay. On a weeklong school vacation.

Also damn, so many people just died when Majestia blew over those skyscrapers

Really not a fan of Chat's sudden incompetence driving this.

Miraculous magic doesn't work on non-humans.

Cristina Vee's older voice sounds perfect on Ladybug.

Oh Hawkmoth got his nukes.

You know, given they seem to have more rules for superheroes in America. I feel like them killing half of New York (while mind controlled) should massively drop public opinion. Even with the resurrections.

Other lost Miraculous is actually a kind of neat way to make other similar specials.

Glad Chloe didn't ruin Sabrina's happiness. A bit of progress of her part I guess.

Think they were purposefully a little vague, but its neat having a couple of lesbian superhero mothers, who're also the Superman/Batman analogues.

Stinger was interesting, but shallow. Which is kind of how I feel about all of the new heroes aside from Sparrow and Uncanny.

Overall I found I didn't really enjoy it that much? Uncanny & Sparrow were highlights. Plus getting to see Sabrina be happy for once. But everything with Chat giving up his ring felt pretty contrived.

The relationship stuff was also pretty dull to me personally. Just felt like spinning the wheels with a few scenes for fanservice. Also I'm pretty sure Adrian is at least emotionally cheating on Kagami?

Previously I haven't noticed or not minded instances of Chat being the weaker member of the team. But this case felt pretty egregious to me. I'd probably give the special 5.5-6 out of 10.

Edited by 32ndfreeze on Sep 27th 2020 at 9:17:12 PM

Now that was a real special! Fancy opening, extra-long, new location, and tons of new characters and designs... I wonder how if the rest of the season enjoys such a fat budget. Also, I wonder if this season will still have 26 episodes - Christmas Special caused season 2 to be one episode shorter.

I think I'm most impressed by all those extra heroes. Some like the bee guy never got any focus but they still have effort put into their designs and powers (in his case summoning some kind of sting-spear)

There were a few small problems with production. I felt that some voices felt off, particularly Marinette, and apparently it has something to do with editing that was done to make the episode hour-long messing with audio. Only Nino had a different reason - he has a new VA. Also, the special was originally suppose to be 2 hours long which explains why some characters have subplots that go nowhere (Chloe, Sabrina, Mendeleiev, and Damocles)

American characters were pretty cool and well designed. Uncanny Valley is a pretty odd codename but it works especially her unusual but interesting design. Doorman is my favorite though.

I think baddie was the one who got the short end of the stick. His name and costume got worse and worse with each upgrade. Like, they can't all be winners but "Techlonizer"? Also, I just can't take seriously villain whose suit restrains his hands. He seems to be loosely based on Dr Ock "mummy" look but that made sense, Doc was dying. Pirate literally never've been better.

Ahh, Gabriel's dedication to keep using Mr. Pigeon. Truly, his most admirable trait. LB and CN's new flight suits look really cool...Now if only the camera lingered on them for a bit longer.

Man, Rose and Juleka sleep together even closer than any official straight couples.

Two notes on Captain Red Light 1) Having superpeople do pretty much everything makes me think a lot of My Hero Academia especially with Doorman being the "Rescue Hero" type. 2) When you're flexing your budget in almost every scene it's pretty weird to have one moment where the character is kept off-screen for no reason other than that likely they don't have a model.

I really dig the disguise bracelets all American heroes seem to have. They're like a logical next step from unstable molecules from Marvel. Why not give to all respected heroes tech that would make their jobs easier.

I must admit, after constantly using magic ladybugs to keep all previous adventures safe and consequence-free, seeing Paris destroyed for real was a serious gut punch.

Wait, does eagle kwami knows HK's identity? He faces her as Gabriel for pretty much no reason. Also, I guess Markov knows LB & CN's identities?

Ooh, and finally explanation for Clark Kenting! It does feel unfair though that Majestia gets away just glasses then. Especially when her partner wears a full face mask and pretends to be a dude. Fine, so there is a reason for that.

"No, really! I care about the celebration! Killing robot girl was one thing but ruining parades is just going too far! I've even dressed like an eagle so you know you can trust me!" No wonder no one fell for it.

So superhero president Victory (who's pretty oddly an Expy of Captain America who also looks like thinner Amanda Waller) has guns on everything in the city. I don't care if she normally isn't using them, that's concerning! Also, the world's most powerful heroine builds a robot daughter with the power to look through anyone's secret identity. She also secretly records all your conversations. Welcome to America!

Too bad that we don't get to see Eagle's weapon.

Launching of that rocket is just such a Hawk Moth scene. He's not some one-dimensional maniac, he doesn't want to launch a rocket and start the next Word War. But you know, the thing is, he does it anyway. He may not cackle about it but no evil deed seems to be too great for him.

So Knightowl and Sparrow pretended to be immortals? I guess it's not crazier than heroes selling magic hot dogs or villains kidnapping unloved people. Wonder if she will redesign her costume.

Edited by Sunchet on Oct 17th 2020 at 10:56:02 AM

Victory seems to be more an expy of Mr. Terrific, with a Captain America motif.

This was interesting. The worldbuilding here is interesting with the way it runs counter to a lot of the things that are rigidly put in place for the main series, which makes me wonder if they're going to start changing things in the near future.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 27th 2020 at 3:24:14 AM

Sparrow and Uncanny Valley were definitely highlights.

x4

I thought Majestia was supposed to be a Captain Marvel expy, not Superman.

Aside from that, I enjoyed the special for what it was. Nothing too different from the main show but it was fun and I love Jess, though her identity as Sparrow > Eagle.

As for the main series, I don't have a problem with it being formulaic. It works and we still get status quo shakeups on occassion. Aside from the Love Square being kind of dumb my biggest problems are the show turning Chloe evil again just because and Lila's treatment in general. Though I'm biased since those two are my favorite characters.

Majestia is definitely a Superman expy. Her powers are largely Superman, and that bit where she catches the rocket is a classic Superman styled scene.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 27th 2020 at 6:43:56 AM

I guess the comparison is a bit easy, since Majestia has a star along with the red, blue, and yellow accents, plus Captain Marvel also is a flying brick. But she had a lot of Superman allusions and is apparently married to the Batman expy, so.

Honestly I could totally read a spin off about Sparrow and Uncanny Valley. Which shows they were excellent characters. I also liked the joke about New York being so full of heroes.

I think it's pretty funny that Miraculous Ladybug until now was a show that had a pretty good justification for almost every superhero trope.

All characters shared Meta Origin.

Magic supplied every one with the costume and all supplies they will ever need (The only exception being Gabriel who needs to farm butterflies).

Miraculous Ladybug fixed everything explaining how they can have their hero fights every other week.

Akumas brainwashed people explaining a) new villain each week b) their obsession with their gimmick c) use of codename even when everyone knows who they are d) why new villains were good enough to take on heroes e) Why completely normal person could suffer one bad setback and suddenly swear revenge on the world and be completely ok with harming innocents, friends or heroes.

And then we get this special and we just go "That's just how things are in America. Have a magic hot dog."

Edited by Sunchet on Sep 28th 2020 at 11:13:56 AM

I've always found rigidly shared Meta Origin to be a pretty limiting plot device anyway. Most series I can think of that did it eventually stopped or branched out to include different origins of meta powers eventually.

Just realized that Eagle's weapon does shop up in the very last scene. It's some kind of stick on a string, similar to Ladybug's yoyo.

I love that, as it's a hilarious jab at American superhero comics. Obviously the reason so many heroes are from the US is because for a long time, most creators were American/US based, but it's cute. Also, it makes sense that if there's a huge spellbook and all sorts of stuff for the Miraculous, magic wouldn't be strictly confined to the Miraculous.

I saw this on the fanfic idea pitch:

"When Hawk Moth tries akumatizing Cat Noir in "Cat Blanc", Ladybug pushes him out of the way and takes the hit for him, turning into Lady Beetle, a palette-swapped version of Ladybug with unlimited power of creation at her fingertips and a psychotic desire to protect her boyfriend, even if it means using the power of creation to enslave and destroy the world in the process."

Is there a fic with this premise? Sounds like an interesting read.

If that happens is that not an auto loss for the good guys. Cause Hawkmoth can just make them give him the Miraculous.