RWBY General Discussion

Given that Jacques was critical in manipulating Whitley to think exactly like him when he grew older and was old enough to take his place, does he count as The Corrupter or would a different trope apply here?

Edited by gjjones on Jun 29th 2020 at 2:51:41 PM

When was that said? Weiss want to be heriess because is her company, jacques deshoned her after one act or rebelion maker clear she wont be cowed by him, the idea of reforming never get talk.

Hell aside from some conversation the company hire practices never get properly talked

Okay....so let me get this straight...

You think. Weiss was actually going to keep Jacques horrible policies going?

That's not how I read it. Here's the family photo.◊ We've got a grown woman in red in back, with the girl in the orange shirt being the oldest-looking of the others, and I assume that's Saphron because... Saphron. Her hair's lighter, but that happens. For that reason, despite the fact that Jaune is so small, I'm guessing that they were born ROYGBIV, making Jaune the third-oldest, followed by the David-esque girl in green, the girl in aqua with the glasses, the twins with the dark blue bows, and finally the girl in violet sitting on top. The only one who feels out of place in that birth order is Jaune, and it's not a huge surprise he'd be the runt of the litter.

Edited by TwinBird on Jun 30th 2020 at 5:05:47 AM

Uh, wow. I'm not sure how you missed the "Redeem the Schnee family name" thing, when it's a central aspect of Weiss's character. It's not subtle at all, it gets explicitly discussed multiple times.

Weiss was abused by her father, and also unaware of his crimes until she started at Beacon. Meeting Blake opens her eyes, and she repeatedly talks about how her family's company has wronged the Faunus and how she wants to fix that.

She explicitly states she wants to reclaim her family's honor, restoring the company to her grandfather's ideals. She gets disowned for challenging her father over how he married into the Schnee family and she's going to undo all his horrible actions.

The World of Remnant episode about the company literally concludes with how Weiss is the hope for fixing the company.

It's.....really not something that is easy to miss. I mean you complain about Adam not matching his early appearances....but then you completely miss a core aspect of a major character that we've gotten beaten over the head with at least once per volume. I'm really not sure how to take that without being rude. It kinda sounds like you just don't like the heroines?

Edited by harostar on Jun 30th 2020 at 5:23:09 AM

My reason for not minding the direction Adam got taken in is more or less cause we already have a charachter like how the fandom wanted with Illia

Edited by Kylotrope on Jun 29th 2020 at 11:37:10 PM

So, on the main work pages, I've been thinking: given that some trope pages on TV shows have notices that spoilers for the individual seasons set prior to the most recent ones are unmarked, should we unmark all spoilers on those pages with the exception of the latest volume (that being Volume 7)?

I really want to learn what people with semblances were like pre Hunstman era

Were they at one point considered demigods? Were they perhaps the ones who started the monarchies in a few kingdoms.

"You think. Weiss was actually going to keep Jacques horrible policies going? "

No, but that is the thing here: the show never really dwell that much, the focus is not on redeeming thr schnee family, is about on weiss taking what is rightfully hers and that jacques as dick extraordinary have taken and kept from all her life, is more a "taken my life back into my own hands" which is a good arc, but kinda divorced of what the company have done, I mean weiss never even saw Adam once in the entire show, we dont even know she knew exactly what they have done because the show is damn coy about everything.

and quite frankly harostar, im a little bit annoyed with the implication that some fans have throw around about how adam fans that they are deluded(like that tumblr post that kinda try to *wink* *wink* the implication on how he got fans after he stab blakd and yang becuase of course it does), so you can see how miffled im right now about it.

I dont think people back them didnt have semblence but magic, in fact my theory is that semblence ARE magic...or whatever magic it remind in them.

To act like the companies corruption is just skipped over in Weiss arc and reasons for wanting the company....is...just plain absurd

This is Weiss's quote for her character folder on the work's page.

"When I said I wanted to honour my family's name, I meant it. But - it's not what you think. I'm not stupid; I'm fully aware of what my father has done with the Schnee Dust Company. Since he took control, our business has operated in a 'moral grey area' ... which is why I feel the need to make things right. If I had taken a job in Atlas, it wouldn't have changed anything. My father was not the start of our name, and I refuse to let him be the end of it."

I seriously doubt this would be the first thing of substance you read when you open her character folder if her character arc didn't focus on "redeeming the Schnee family".

And exactly how much that come out?, we have Illa who talk how her parent die in a mining accident to Blake, Adam backstory who even to this day get muddy, Jacques mention how faunus wants right in a degradatory manner and that kinda talked about in the mine in volume 8, is not really a big focus, specially since now that we know what happen to him, morally grey area dosent even get to started.

And again, I dont said she wont redeem the company, but is more about Weiss arc to get what her father have stole than confront the damage the company have done(one can make the question if the company can be really worth saving of it is part of the same system that create problem like Atlas and Mantle), the whole branding for started is pretty much gloss over from most part because the plot have other things to do.

The Faunas subplot has it's downs yeah, but We're repedtelty told about the SDC uses the Faunas as more or less slaves and have done horrible things to them.

Plus You started this by saying that Weiss still wanted to be the heiress to the company that branded Adam.

If my calculations are correct as Doc Brown would say, Team RWBY's (and by extension, Weiss's) biggest problem at the moment is Salem and her forces as well as the relics. Weiss and Blake might also rally the Faunus.

Do you guys think that Taiyang might get involved in the crisis in Atlas once he learns about the situation and Raven might join forces with the heroes?

Edited by gjjones on Jun 30th 2020 at 12:22:45 PM

I honestly would like to see more moments where the group questions Ozpin's hiding things from them. It could use the whole Atlas fiasco as a stepping off point as well, i.e. "you hid all that stuff from Ironwood and look how that turned out".

Kylo: because is true, even if she reformed is still going to be that company, specially because before it was just"shady thing he does to faunus" and we know what that exactly that entails, but we know about the branding pretty much a episode before Adam is killed and the white fang sub plot being pretty much over, that lack of disconexion is kinda telling.

And as it is own it kinda dosent matter with jacques in jail for enterel different reason at that.

If anything I feel the oposite, volume 7 feel like Ozpin telling their critics "see, YOU TRY not hide secret in my place!".

I feel like Ironwoods reaction is gonna be what makes the team understand Ozpin a bit more, after they finally thought James was trustworthy with the information he did...what he did.

yes but saying "heiress who still wants to inherit the company that branded him" paints a much darker picture of Weiss charachter then what she is with context.

Edited by Kylotrope on Jun 30th 2020 at 6:19:21 AM

Because the show pretty much said the same company she want and feel injust to take out is also the same that brand people in the face, a element that come and went quietly which is something it should be said right there.

After all I make me wonder if weiss really should get the company with so many skeleton in the closet or just be a huntress, something she is good and enjoyable for herself.

Minor thing, not sure if I've said this already....

I think it would be kinda fun if works by Stephen king were alluded to in Vacuo

I mean, it's a wild West setting with tons of king Arthur References.

That would be cool, yeah.

....

I saw a horrifying theory

Serial Killer's tend to go after specific types of people

Someone pointed out the possibility that Jaune fit Tyrians initial "Criteria". Wich was why he was "interested" in him

Oh man, I come back to.......some very interesting takes, apparently.

Unknowing, I think you're kind of.....inching dangerously into Ron the Death Eater territory with some of these arguments. I'm sure that isn't your intention to demonize characters that way, but it kind of? sounds that way based on your arguments and statements here. It might be good to take a step back and consider the implications of some of your arguments and whether that accurately represents what you actually want to say.

Weiss's primary motivation in the series involves wanting to restore what her grandfather created. She doesn't feel entitled, doesn't think it BELONGS to her, nor does she ignore the horrors happening under her father's watch. She just flat-out stated in the last volume that she wishes she could take back the horrible things her father has done to the Faunus, and acknowledges she spent her childhood unaware of what he was doing.

As I mentioned before, the Schnee Dust Company short discusses how Jacques has corrupted the company that Nicholas Schnee built through hard-work, honesty, and fair practices. (Remember, Nicholas Schnee is Santa Claus!) The short ends with the hope of the company and the Schnee family being restored by Weiss.

It's a central theme of Weiss's character in the series. It's really not accurate or fair to frame her as just wanting the company because it belongs to her or otherwise not being driven by a desire to undo her father's evils. It's a central theme, as much as Blake wanting to further Faunus-Human relations and Ruby wanting to be a hero that saves people.

Edited by harostar on Jun 30th 2020 at 4:55:50 AM

I know a lot of people think it's supposed to be for Ruby and Oscar, but I think the story "warrior in the woods" might be symbolic for Qrow and Summer

Leaning into the idea that Qrow had feelings for summer(NOT in the sense he is Rubies real father or something like that)

Both Qrow and the Boy lived in communities deep in the forest meeting a silver eyed warrior after leaving the village. In both cases they Did Not Get the Girl, in summers case non Fatally(well....at first)

And in both cases the silver eyed woman died alone

This

Edited by Kylotrope on Jun 29th 2020 at 11:36:11 PM

The reason all the sub-pages have the message is because those are the pages people who have seen the work tend to frequent, and most sub-pages tend to fall under the Administrivia rules and guidelines for either minimising spoiler tagging as much as possible or not using them at all (depending on whether they're Spoilers Off or not).

The main work page is what people will browse if they're not sure of the work or haven't seen it. It needs to be much more careful about the spoilers than sub-pages like the Character, Moments or YMMV pages (for example).

Hm. You're right about my memory of photo being inaccurate. You and I agree on who Saphron is in the photo (and for the same reasons). My problem was that I misremembered how old she looks compared to the other kids. That said, my post was mainly driven by my memory of Red, who is by far the oldest one in the picture, yet Saphron's words suggest she's still living at home.

As much as I like the ROYGBIV theory (and I tried to make it work myself when I first saw the photo), Jaune's appearance compared to the others just doesn't work for me as third-oldest.

To me, the age order of that photo looks like this:

• Red is several years older than all of them (I'm guessing she's at least 15).
• Orange (Saphron) is the next oldest, but a few years younger than Red.
• Green and the Blue twins look very close in age, and it's hard for me to decide for certain who's really the older. I lean towards Green being the older.
• Cyan and Magenta look quite close in age as well, and I'm not sure which way round to settle on for them either. I lean towards Magenta being older, but I do really go back and forth on these two.
• Yellow looks even younger than Cyan and Magenta.

I'm not even a hundred percent on who is supposed to be blue and indigo in that photo. The twins are obviously blue, but that just means they're far closer to the colour of indigo than Cyan is, whose colour is nowhere near Indigo.

Likewise, Magenta is closer to indigo than Cyan is, but is the only one even vaguely 'purple' in colour scheme, so she's almost certainly Violet.

So, are twins really Blue... or are they Indigo and Cyan is supposed to be Blue?

That decision affects my rainbow order because I have either of the following:

• ROGBVIY (or ROGBIVY)
• ROGIVBY (or ROGVIBY)

I find it easier to figure out what story and personalities are happening in the photo than their ages.

• Red probably is a second mother to the kids. Her hand on Jaune's head may have a 'motherly' aspect, but it's also holding him in place, so she's probably both playful and forceful.
• Orange is fun-loving, but also contrary in the sense of liking to be different from the rest of her sisters (hence being upside down for the photo).
• Green is a tomboy who is always seeking adventures and probably is scrappy (since that's usually what a lost tooth 'symbolises' in stories — none of this 'losing teeth just because they're at the right age for them to fall out marlarky). She's on look out to make sure no-one comes to rescue the prisoner their brother.
• The twins (be they Blue or Indigo) have the obvious stereotype of mischief-makers and practical jokers.
• Cyan or Indigo is the smart one. However, she's also a bit of a trouble-maker — not overtly like the twins, but sly in the 'butter wouldn't melt on her tongue' fashion: she has the Scary Shiny Glasses, which she's adjusting in the anime 'I'm not doing/thinking what you think I am' tradition, while looking rather smug and pleased with herself. Why? The bunches Jaune is wearing are tied with ribbons that match her colour; so I think she outsmarted Jaune to get those bunches on him, and that's what she's so pleased about.
• Violet, who is leaning into Red, and doesn't seem as outcoming or sneaky as the others may be the 'shy one', although that may just be relative to the other sisters.
• Jaune. The only boy, outnumbered, outgunned, and outmanoeuvred. He's been ganged up on to get him into that photo, since Red is 'holding' him down, Orange is taking up the one side of him, and his tormentor (Cyan) is on the other side of him. In fact, his bunches may be the reason for the photo in the first place.

I think it's more a case that there was no formalised method for teaching people how to unlock their Semblances and master either Aura or Semblances. It would either happen individually or through a less widespread method of teaching. The Huntsmen Academies appears to have been the first major attempt to formalise the training of Aura and Semblances in a widespread manner.

We already know that Semblances can unlock in the right circumstances, so people will have been unlocking Semblances long before the Huntsmen Academies came along. It's the Academy system's active attempt to make the teaching of Aura and Semblances as global as possible that seems to be new, rather than the concept or existence of Semblances.

That said, I'm sure people with appropriate Semblances would have been willing to take advantage of them for personal gain — both before Academies ever came along and afterwards.

I think the opposite is happening: the heroes (Ruby, at least) are starting to become aware of how hard it is to both keep secrets and reveal them — that the idea that it's automatically bad to keep secrets and automatically makes things better to reveal them is naive; that it's much harder and more nuanced than it looks — that's it's extremely hard to figure out when it's best to keep secrets and when it's best to reveal them.

Especially since every character who has been put in Ozpin's position to date (carrying the weight of the fight against Salem) has crumbled very quickly in some fashion (Qrow, whose response to one difficult conversation with Leo is to go on a bender and get completely trolleyed; Leo, who gave into Salem and became her mole; Ironwood, who went full authoritarian). So far, Ruby's the only one who hasn't crumbled — and that's party because she doesn't fully understand the situation she's in (as evidenced by her confrontation with Salem).

I've said this before, but Blake's comment about not being sure there are any good options left any more is wrong; the heroes haven't yet realised what Ozpin's real secret was: it's not that his secret-keeping has left them with few good options anymore, it's that his real secret is that there were never any good options to begin with.

In support of your point, the key thing to look at with Weiss is how Nicholas became the head of the SDC: he started out with very little, educated himself as highly as possible, became as good a fighter as possible, and then led his men personally on adventures to find Dust-mines, thereby sharing the risk to life and limb that he was asking of his men. That earned him respect and trustworthiness and meant people were willing to deal with him when he was building up the company.

Weiss isn't just metaphorically following in his footsteps, she's doing so literally: she's trying to excel both academically and in combat, she wants to build up an honourable, respected reputation as a Huntress who protects the lives of others, and she wants to use the reputation she builds up to fix what her father has done to the company.

She's using her grandfather's journey as her own road map.

They do?

I suppose I can see why, especially since the Warrior is older than the hero by quite some years (given that she has grey in her hair and he's still a child when they first meet) but personally I think it's a bit of a shoehorn — partly because the age-difference is implied to be so much more in the fairy tale.

Well, her fate is unknown, and we don't know how Summer died (that she went on mission alone doesn't mean she stayed alone).

Edited by Wyldchyld on Jun 30th 2020 at 11:40:51 AM

Little challenge.....come up with the plot and Charachters of an In-Universe show or comic with the fairy tales we know so far being the basis of certain Charachters.