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Mar 16th 2013 at 4:03:08 PM

Now, I don't know about you, but we don't seem to have that many Franchise pages.

For instance, Video Games. Take a look at this page. I guarantee that we don't even have that many listed in the Franchise namespace.

Also, I set up Franchise pages for Duke Nukem, Deer Hunter, and Grand Theft Auto.

Wouldn't it be more appropriate to list multiple games in a Franchise page as opposed to a Video Game page?

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Nocturna Seeking for Light
Seeking for Light
Mar 16th 2013 at 4:59:55 PM

On this site, Franchise pages are used to organize franchises that have works in more than one medium. If there's only video games in the franchise/series, the main page for the franchise/series should be in VideoGame/, not Franchise/.

Xtifr World's Toughest Milkman Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
World's Toughest Milkman
Mar 16th 2013 at 6:02:18 PM

In other words, none of those should have franchise pages; all of them should probably be moved and/or cut.

On the other hand, I think it could be good to have a thread for discussing things that might call for a franchise page. First candidate is Dune, which has several books, a movie, a tv series, a tabletop game, and a couple of video games.

edit: typo

edited 16th Mar '13 6:03:14 PM by Xtifr

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videogmer314 from that one place Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Mar 17th 2013 at 1:49:42 AM

Does Metroid really need the Franchise/ namespace? As far as I know, it only has video games and one manga (14 chapters, 2 volumes) that never left Japan.

m8e from Sweden Relationship Status: Wanna dance with somebody
Mar 17th 2013 at 2:31:37 AM

I'm not really seeing the problem with having Franchise pages for for game franchises/series. VideoGame.Duke Nukem should be about the game with that title(the first game), while Franchise.Duke Nukem is about the whole series and whatever other media.

Putting the page for the whole series in Franchise means that we don't need to have that 1 after the title of a game that didn't have it.

(VideoGame.Duke Nukem I vs VideoGame.Duke Nukem)

edited 17th Mar '13 2:35:40 AM by m8e

Mar 17th 2013 at 5:49:15 AM

I took a look on Wiktionary just so I can be very clear on what the word "franchise" means. You can see for yourself here.

Okay, so a franchise has to cover more than one media. But that begs some questions:

  1. Does Zatoichi count as a franchise? I created a franchise page for it, on the ground that it consists of a TV Series and a set of Live Action Films.
  2. I happen to know that there are lots of Licensed Games based off of movies and TV shows. How about Balls Of Fury or Dora The Explorer?

edited 17th Mar '13 5:49:32 AM by TiggersAreGreat

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SimplyWhatever bla bla bla from bla bla bla
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Mar 17th 2013 at 9:17:38 AM

[up] Eh, pretty much everything gets licensed spinoff media. By that reasoning, next to everything on TV needs a franchise page.

whatever
FELH2 TV Tropes' very wikibot
TV Tropes' very wikibot
Mar 17th 2013 at 12:41:24 PM

Then, there are some pages in Franchise/ like Kamen Rider which are Live-Action TV-only, but have really a lot of works. Maybe we should follow the Rule of Three (i.e. a new Rule of Three) and only make Franchise pages if a work

  1. has pages for at least three different media
  2. or has several long sub-series.

Also, there are some pages under Franchise/ like Bratz which would fit better in a Toy/ namespace.

edited 17th Mar '13 12:42:22 PM by FELH2

Get rid of the walled garden
Elbruno Mummy Woomy from Chile: Not As Dry As Space! Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Mummy Woomy
Mar 17th 2013 at 3:27:55 PM

[up]I agree there. I believe that when a series is big enough, such as Metal Gear, it should have an overarching Franchise/ page, especially for those cases where the series name is the same as its first entry.

"Yeah, it's a shame. Here we are in an underground cave with all these lasers, and instead of having a rave we're using it for evil."
Xtifr World's Toughest Milkman Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
World's Toughest Milkman
Mar 17th 2013 at 6:48:50 PM

This has all been discussed at length in previous topics. Three forms of media is the generally agreed-upon minimum we want for franchise pages. Two can easily be handled with separate pages (or a main page and a redirect).

The dictionary definition of "franchise" isn't really relevant here. We're not defining the term, we're defining when we use the namespace.

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Mar 19th 2013 at 5:13:32 PM

[up] Oh. sad Well, I wasn't there when all that was being discussed. But it's nice to see that spelled out in black and white. smile

So if a series like Duke Nukem doesn't really qualify for the Franchise namespace, then how about giving it a page titled Duke Nukem Series? That way, you can list off the games and you can just list the first game of the series as Duke Nukem rather than Duke Nukem I.

edited 19th Mar '13 5:14:03 PM by TiggersAreGreat

Oh, Equestria, we stand on guard for thee!
videogmer314 from that one place Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Mar 19th 2013 at 5:37:25 PM

[up][up] So I should move Metroid back to VideoGame/, and maybe create a page for the manga? The latter is probably the best-known non-game adaptation, and it never officially left Japan.

Xtifr World's Toughest Milkman Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
World's Toughest Milkman
Mar 19th 2013 at 8:20:44 PM

[up][up]That sort of thing is certainly done with literature quite frequently. I haven't seen it done with games, though. I'd be fine with it, but you might want to get a few more opinions.

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ScoutsGirlfriend Zombies taste like chainsaw death! from San Romero High School
Zombies taste like chainsaw death!
Mar 20th 2013 at 8:42:27 AM

Ratchet and Clank and Crash Bandicoot both a Franchise page, even though they're only video game series. But that's most likely due to their sheer amount of popularity and games, seeing as how both of them are (or were, in Crash's case) Sony's answer to Mario.

edited 20th Mar '13 8:43:34 AM by ScoutsGirlfriend

Stratadrake Dragon Writer
Dragon Writer
Mar 20th 2013 at 10:33:14 AM

Normally I'd say yes, except that Ratchet and Crash franchises are named after their first installment, so we need the disambiguation.

Now what about the Skylanders series? At its core it is 50% videogame and 50% toy line, and it has a variety of other Merch (kid's novels, Mega Bloks) on the side too.

edited 20th Mar '13 10:33:51 AM by Stratadrake

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Mar 20th 2013 at 12:12:58 PM

Hellboy needs a franchise page. I think what is sitting on main right now is probably fine and just needs to be namespaced.

Xtifr World's Toughest Milkman Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
World's Toughest Milkman
Mar 20th 2013 at 6:27:20 PM

[up]Yes, that can be moved straight to Franchise. It's got more than enough different media.

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AnotherDuck No, the other one. from Stockholm Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
Mar 20th 2013 at 8:49:21 PM

What about Dungeons & Dragons? It's currently sitting in Tabletop Game, and has a ton of other stuff in various media. Personally I'm fine with it being there, as that's what it is at base, with all the other stuff based around it, but it'd certainly fit in Franchise. Also, Franchise.Dungeons And Dragons is a redirect to TabletopGame.Dungeons And Dragons.

edited 20th Mar '13 8:50:45 PM by AnotherDuck

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SeptimusHeap from Bern, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
Mar 21st 2013 at 4:44:05 AM

I'd agree on Dungeons & Dragons being split. I also think that we can slice the description apart in two pieces for each page.

SimplyWhatever bla bla bla from bla bla bla
bla bla bla
Mar 22nd 2013 at 10:26:58 PM

Is three different mediums really enough? What if two of the mediums are just ancillary media for the main thing? For example, quite a few Transformers cartoons have spinoff comics and video games, even though they tend to be ancillary stuff.

Hell, I think pretty much any "big name" kids shows tend to get minor spinoff media.

edited 22nd Mar '13 10:31:04 PM by SimplyWhatever

whatever
Nocturna Seeking for Light
Seeking for Light
Mar 22nd 2013 at 11:03:38 PM

It's three different mediums, of which at least two are substantial enough to have their own pages, not just "three different mediums exist".

SimplyWhatever bla bla bla from bla bla bla
bla bla bla
Mar 23rd 2013 at 12:02:29 AM

What does "substantial enough" mean? Going with the Transformers example, Transformers Armada had a spinoff manga set concurrently with the TV show, but focused on a different cast, a video game with a different story from the TV series, and a comic book that's quite different from the TV show.

And would the live-action films need to be moved from the Film/ namespace because they have comics that flesh out the universe far more than the films, and games with somewhat different story? (not counting Dark of the Moon, whose game was apparently a prequel to the movie, but that separates it even more from the film, I guess). There was also a short web cartoon set after Revenge of the Fallen, although I doubt anyone on this site cares enough to do a proper write-up for it. I think it should stay in films, since pretty much all thee other media are "supporting" material, but I don't really know.

edited 23rd Mar '13 12:15:56 AM by SimplyWhatever

whatever
AnotherDuck No, the other one. from Stockholm Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
Mar 23rd 2013 at 12:27:29 AM

Just check if they actually have their own pages (or if you want to write up one yourself). It's not like we're going to pull out a spectrograph to see if it has enough colours or not. I suppose the question here, with Transformers would rather be if we have Franchise pages for subfranchises.

I mean, lots of series have associated toys, but those toys aren't generally associated with enough tropes on their own to have their own page. Transformers have toys associated with series associated with toys. There's a bit of recursion there.

edited 23rd Mar '13 12:30:06 AM by AnotherDuck

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videogmer314 from that one place Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Mar 23rd 2013 at 11:58:04 AM

Since nobody seems to care, I just moved Metroid back to VideoGame/ and I've started working on the wicks.

edited 23rd Mar '13 12:39:05 PM by videogmer314

Stratadrake Dragon Writer
Dragon Writer
Mar 23rd 2013 at 6:11:33 PM

So then, how is the distinction between series and original game going?

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