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TLP Crash Rescue - Fixing prematurely launched TLPs and pages

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Prematurely launched pages, pages that weren't fully fleshed out at the point of launching, are a big problem. Since these usually share several problems at once, this thread is aimed at re-running them through YKTTW for fixing - the usual fix - or cutting them if they are too bad.

Problems this thread deals with include bad names, not enough/bad examples, unclear description, no crosswicking etc.

For the interested, here's a list of recently created pages. Launches

edited 8th Aug '17 10:10:12 AM by SeptimusHeap

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Lost in Space
Jun 2nd 2014 at 1:55:07 PM

Fanfic.From Azure To Zero

A new editor just typed in the article title, apparently as a placeholder. Is it worth trying to fix? Edit: Oh, okay, they're going to copy the template and then... /sigh

edited 2nd Jun '14 1:55:36 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
nrjxll Relationship Status: Not war
Jun 2nd 2014 at 1:59:43 PM

Hey, Fighteer, since you're here, can you verify that "no new complaining pages" is in fact an actual rule?

SeptimusHeap PCNA from Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
PCNA
Jun 2nd 2014 at 2:05:01 PM

Not Fighteer, but the discussion is here.

As for From Azure To Zero, in such situations I usually wait for a bit and if the page stays bad, I message. Many people start their pages as an one-sentence stub and improve it piece-by-piece.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Lost in Space
Jun 2nd 2014 at 2:07:41 PM

I will put my Official Moderator Stamp of Approval on the "no new complaining articles" policy.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Elbruno Mummy Woomy from Chile: Not As Dry As Space! Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Mummy Woomy
Jun 2nd 2014 at 4:05:07 PM

So I'm guessing it's okay to cutlist From Breakout To Scrappy then? It was launched under the radar, and we have a reasonable ammount of motions to cut.

"Yeah, it's a shame. Here we are in an underground cave with all these lasers, and instead of having a rave we're using it for evil."
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
SeptimusHeap PCNA from Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
PCNA
Jun 3rd 2014 at 4:42:18 AM

Worklist:

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Jun 3rd 2014 at 4:52:58 AM

Given that there is absolutely no overlap in the tropes on Bad Writing Index and This Index Is On Purpose, I don't see why we would call them duplicates.

There is nothing "Bad Writing" about Deliberately Monochrome, for example. That is simply an artistic choice.

edited 3rd Jun '14 4:56:31 AM by Catbert

Jun 3rd 2014 at 5:49:08 AM

I blanked it because I noticed I'd used the wrong format. The other WMG for The Dresden Files all have the series name in their URL, so I wanted to stick to that pattern.

crazysamaritan Could we just... not have Death anymore? from Lupin III
Could we just... not have Death anymore?
Jun 3rd 2014 at 7:01:09 AM

[up][up] There's nothing bad or weird about Deliberately Monochrome, either. That was the definition for the index.

Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
MagBas Mag Bas from In my house
Jun 3rd 2014 at 9:48:52 AM

If i understood well the description, all the examples of This Index Is On Purpose are intentional. In total contrast, the Bad Writing Index says that the pages listed there are used unintentionally outside parodies- and some pages that link there outright say that this is impossible to this trope be used intentionally- Strawman Has a Point, by example.

edited 3rd Jun '14 9:49:08 AM by MagBas

Larkmarn Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
Jun 3rd 2014 at 10:10:56 AM

My issue with This Index Is On Purpose is that its name is meaningless; it just sounds like, well, things that authors did on purpose. Which is all of storytelling.

Jun 3rd 2014 at 7:30:06 PM

I feel there is merit to the idea of From Breakout to Scrappy as a YMMV trope and not a complaining one. There were at least a few legit examples in there (i. e. Catbug, Ohgi, Scrappy). There is something of a metric: darkhorse character falls out of favor with much of the fandom due to one or more factors. Any "complaining" examples could be easily phased out. I mean, if that still makes it a "Complaining" trope, we should then just prune all examples from The Scrappy and all other negative YMMV pages.

edited 3rd Jun '14 7:33:09 PM by azul120

nrjxll Relationship Status: Not war
Jun 3rd 2014 at 7:47:21 PM

Don't tempt me.

Anyway, looks like it's already been cut.

Jun 3rd 2014 at 7:58:02 PM

Just going to leave it at that? Whatever.

Personally I believe It's Popular, Now It Sucks! is as bad.

Elbruno Mummy Woomy from Chile: Not As Dry As Space! Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Mummy Woomy
Jun 3rd 2014 at 8:01:30 PM

Those YMMV have the Grandfather Clause excuse. Even if you can make a good case against them, they've been here far too long like to just purge them without issues. That's why it was decided instead that adding more stuff like those is not allowed.

"Yeah, it's a shame. Here we are in an underground cave with all these lasers, and instead of having a rave we're using it for evil."
Jun 3rd 2014 at 8:14:24 PM

Perhaps. But they can at least be sectionectomied (i. e. Hype Backlash).

Besides, From Breakout To Scrappy in of itself isn't a "complaining about darkhorse characters" as it's been misinterpreted due to a few bad examples (i. e. the Rosalina one). It's a real thing where fans end up turning on characters, due in part to overexposure, derailment, flanderization or the like.

Also, we should determine which tropes could fall under excess complaining and prune any slanted examples so that it's all fair.

Elbruno Mummy Woomy from Chile: Not As Dry As Space! Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Mummy Woomy
Jun 3rd 2014 at 8:19:43 PM

Like I said, Grandfather Clause. Unless there's a sudden decision by the mods or Fast Eddie himself it'll be unlikely we'll see those tropes being sectionectomied.

You can make an "objectivity" case for The Scrappy, It's Popular, Now It Sucks!, and other tropes like those. One is characters that attract the ire of a massive part of the fanbase, and the other involves works that have a vocal part of people that dislike them for being popular (which kind of makes it more of a shot at the haters than at the work itself). But the fact is that they attract hateful entries that cause trouble, and we don't need more stuff like that.

"Yeah, it's a shame. Here we are in an underground cave with all these lasers, and instead of having a rave we're using it for evil."
Jun 3rd 2014 at 9:51:00 PM

Why then did Hype Backlash get sectionectomied? That's no less objective from a fandom reaction basis.

SeptimusHeap PCNA from Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
PCNA
Jun 3rd 2014 at 10:03:39 PM

azul120, in the interest of strict accuracy this is not the place for discussing established pages like It's Popular, Now It Sucks!. Nevermind that an example cut is a different thing than a page cut.

I'll write the worklist this afternoon.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
nrjxll Relationship Status: Not war
Jun 4th 2014 at 2:03:55 AM

My point was earlier that I am in fact 100% in favor of an example cut (or, honestly, page cut) for all complaining pages, and so their existence isn't any sort of defense for From Breakout To Scrappy. I'm not willing to put the effort into trying to get rid of them if wiki policy is against it, but I certainly don't see that as a justification for making more complaining pages.

edited 4th Jun '14 2:04:08 AM by nrjxll

SeptimusHeap PCNA from Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
PCNA
Jun 4th 2014 at 4:20:19 AM

Today's brief worklist:

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Larkmarn Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
Jun 4th 2014 at 6:49:53 AM

Clueless Hero: Cut it. Cut it twice. "Hero doesn't realize they're the hero" seems vaguely tropeable, but as-written it's less than worthless. It's just a page about some specific characters.

Candi Sorcerer in training from Closer to rimward than hubward Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
Sorcerer in training
Jun 4th 2014 at 7:57:28 AM

In All the Weyrs of Pern, Sharra has to point out to Jaxom that he's seen as the leader for much of Aivas' projects. So Clueless Hero, possibly renamed, might have tropeability, but as it stands, it needs to go through YKTTW to be sorted out. I suggest from scratch, rather than kicking what exists back, due to a gut feeling of it should be rebuilt from the ground up.

Coming back to where you started is not the same as never leaving. -Terry Pratchett
Jun 4th 2014 at 8:54:39 AM

...yeah, burn it to the ground and salt the earth. Maybe PM the troper on proper page creation?


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