This thread exists to discuss British politics.
Political issues related to Northern Ireland and the Crown Dependencies (the Channel Islands and the Isle of Man) are also considered on-topic here if there's no more appropriate OTC thread for them.
If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations
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As with other OTC threads, off-topic posts may be thumped or edited by the moderators.
- There is a dedicated thread to discuss LGBTQ+ rights in the United Kingdom. That doesn't mean it's always off-topic here, but unless something's directly linked to political events, that's probably a better thread for it.
- There's also a separate thread to talk about your favourite British Prime Ministers.
Recent political stuff:
- The vote to see if Britain should adopt Alternative Voting has failed.
- Lib Dems lose lots of councils and councillors, whilst Labour make the majority of the gains in England.
- The Scottish National Party do really well in the elections.
A link to the BBC politics page containing relevant information.
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 3rd 2023 at 11:15:30 AM
The Polisci Majoris
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Shadow minister? What is this, has the UK government been infiltrated by the Sith? 
Disasturbator
yes
Actually,it' just means the opposing party has their own version of the post as a kind of 'shadow' get it?
New theme music also a box
Figure of Hourai
We have an entire Shadow Cabinet!
But it's just a fancy term for the Opposition setting up a parallel structure (i.e. shadowing) the government, with everyone knowing what their responsibilities are to lead questioning on and champion policies for. It's part of why we can have a general election one day and replace the government overnight, because short of the 3rd largest party completely cannibalising the 2nd, the ministers are largely ready to go from the start and the civil service isn't changing.
Avatar Source
The Element of Hyperbole.
Do we have a Shadow Prime Minister? Like, I get that that would just be the leader of the opposition, but I don't really recall ever hearing the term Shadow Prime Minister.
Disasturbator
Google says it's just 'Leader of the Opposition' aka.Keir Starmer
Edited by Ultimatum on Jul 2nd 2022 at 1:36:50 PM
New theme music also a box
For deputies it's not always clear - Harriet Harman oscillated between "Deputy Leader of the Opposition" and "Shadow Deputy Prime Minister" in common usage during Miliband's tenure.
Figure of Hourai
It's also helpful that Leader of the Opposition is pretty much a position/title in and of itself.
Avatar Source
Also, it's the second most powerful party that forms the shadow posts. So, the Shadow Cabinet will always be led by the Leader of the Opposition.
The third largest party will also shadow the Cabinet, but they have to use the term "spokesperson". That's why you'll hear the SNP (Westminster) leadership referring to the "spokesperson for X" when there's a response to a government minister's announcement.
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
Granted shadow cabinet just reaaaaally sound like a fancy name.
"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
Isn’t there some sort of Shadow Fire Baron or something like that?
Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
Tief girl with eartude
I wouldn't have thought so. The shadow cabinet just parallels the actual cabinet, so it's just the same job title with "Shadow" at the beginning.
And all the cabinet positions are "Minister for X", so all the shadow cabinet members are going to be "Shadow minister for X" or just "(Shadow) X Minister".
TV Tropes's No. 1 bread themed lesbian. she/her, fae/faer
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
Ah, then it must have been “Shadow Fire Minister”. I remember somebody commenting that it sounded like some sort of video game boss.
Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
The Best Worst Psychonaut
It's too bad there's no minister for the conservation of hedgehogs.
"If you think like a child, you will do a child's work."
If we're being really pedantic, then the vast majority of cabinet positions (since the 1960s) are "Secretary of State for X", with their immediate underlings in their departments being "Minister of State for X" and the ones below them being "Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for X".
"Minister of Y" is a form that was first used in 1915 (Munitions) and dominant for much of the next few decades, but gradually declined after the '60s with the last example (Agriculture, Fisheries & Food) disappearing in 2001.
"Minister for Z" is generally an informal title, always given to someone who also holds another government office (whether that be substantive or sinecure).
Rishi Sunak and Sajid Javid have resigned from the Cabinet. Those are some very high level positions to be losing.
Of Course, Sajid Javid's done it before. Resigning over a matter of principle must have been so fun he wants to do it again.
Technically, there is. Rebecca Pow's portfolio includes the domestic natural environment and its recovery. If you're talking about international hedgehogs, however, that would be Zac Goldsmith (his portfolio includes the international natural environment).
Edited by Wyldchyld on Jul 5th 2022 at 10:50:14 AM
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
Not A Lawyer
I can't imagine that Boris will do the decent thing and resign with dignity. Technically speaking, there can't be another vote of no confidence against him for another year, but the 1922 Committee which controls the Tory leadership is due for reelection on Wednesday (I believe) and there's been talk of them wanting to return candidates who want to change the leadership rules. I imagine today's events will exacerbate that.
Edited by Herbert40k on Jul 5th 2022 at 6:58:52 PM
Trans rights are human rights. JK Rowling preaches hate. If you sit at a table with five bigots and say nothing, there are now six bigots.
Professional Forum Ninja
Disasturbator
I did NOT see that coming
New theme music also a box
At 12:36 today Michael Ellis (Paymaster General and Minister for the Cabinet Office), made a statement to the House of Commons about Standards in Public Life.[1]
At 15:19 The Lord True (Minister of State at the Cabinet Office) repeated the statement to the House of Lords.[2]
Neither version was well received.
There are additional rules and guidance to help ensure consistency of approach—for example, in relation to public appointments, corporate governance and business appointments—when individuals move to roles outside government, and there are independent bodies that provide a broad oversight of standards. The right honourable lady the deputy leader of the Labour Party has asked about the mechanisms for upholding those standards. They exist and they exist as a result of the decisions of this House. There are bodies and officeholders with a role in overseeing specific aspects of public life, such as the Parliamentary Commissioner for Standards, the Civil Service Commission and the Commissioner for Public Appointments. Alongside them are regimes for the publication of government transparency data and information on those who lobby government.
We have a Parliament, as you know, Mr Speaker, that upholds standards to cover all those in public life, but it is incumbent upon us not to prejudge these decisions. Ministers, public office holders and officials, in all their activities, must maintain the confidentiality of those who wish to make complaints across the lifetime of their involvement, but let me say that no system can replace the fundamental importance of personal responsibility. We all know this to be true. Codes, rules and oversight bodies are there to guide us, but all of us in public life must ultimately choose for ourselves how to act.
Saqib Bhatti, Javid's Parliamentary Private Secretary, has also resigned.[3]
Edited by TommyR01D on Jul 5th 2022 at 12:39:00 PM
Nadhim Zahawi, formerly Secretary of State for Education, has been appointed Chancellor of the Exchequer.
Michelle Donelan, formerly Minister of State for Higher and Further Education, has been appointed Secretary of State.
The new Minister of State is yet to be decided.
Steve Barclay, Downing Street Chief of Staff, has been appointed Secretary of State for Health & Social Care.
Bim Afolami has resigned as Vice Chair of the Conservative Party.
Theodora Clarke has resigned as Trade Envoy to Kenya.[1]
The Lord McDonald of Salford, Permanent Under-Secretary of State for Foreign & Commonwealth Affairs 2015-20, wrote this to Kathryn Stone, Parliamentary Commissioner for Standards.[2]
The RT Hon Christopher Pincher MP
Five days after Mr Pincher's resignation as deputy chief whip, there remains significant confusion surrounding complaints about his behaviour prior to the drunkenness he admits at the Carlton Club on 29 June.
Inaccurate claims by 10 Downing Street continue to be repeated in the media. On 3 July, the BBC website reported: "No official complaints against [Mr Pincher] were ever made."
This is not true. In the summer of 2019, shortly after he was appointed minister of state at the Foreign Office, a group of officials complained to me about Mr Pincher's behaviour. I discussed the matter with the relevant official at the Cabinet Office. (In substance, the allegations were similar to those made about his behaviour at the Carlton Club.) An investigation upheld the complaint; Mr Pincher apologised and promised not to repeat the inappropriate behaviour. There was no repetition at the FCO before he left seven months later.
The same BBC website report continued: "Downing Street has said Boris Johnson was not aware of any specific allegations when he appointed Mr Pincher deputy chief whip in February." By 4 July the BBC website reflected a change in No 10's line: "The prime minister's official spokesman said Mr Johnson knew of 'allegations that were either resolved or did not progress to a formal complaint,' adding that 'it was deemed not appropriate to stop an appointment simply because of unsubstantiated allegations'."
The original No 10 line is not true and the modification is still not accurate. Mr Johnson was briefed in person about the initiation and outcome of the investigation. There was a "formal complaint". Allegations were "resolved" only in the sense that the investigation was completed; Mr Pincher was not exonerated. To characterise the allegations as "unsubstantiated" is therefore wrong.
I am aware that [it] is unusual to write to you and simultaneously publicise the letter. I am conscious of the duty owed to the target of an investigation but I act out of my duty towards the victims. Mr Pincher deceived me and others in 2019. He cannot be allowed to use the confidentiality of the process three years ago to pursue his predatory behaviour in other contexts.
Yours sincerely,
Simon
Mc Donald of Salford
Permanent under-Secretary
Foreign & Commonwealth Office
(2015-2020)
Edited by TommyR01D on Jul 5th 2022 at 2:21:57 AM
Did so in the middle of giving an interview as well. (Video)
Edited by Deadbeatloser22 on Jul 5th 2022 at 10:40:17 AM
"Yup. That tasted purple."
What's with all these resignations all of a sudden?
Christopher Pincher has resigned his position as Treasurer of the Household (succeeded by Kelly Tolhurst) following allegations of drunken groping at the Carlton Club.[1]
[2]
Mike Amesbury has resigned as Shadow Minister for Local Government.[3]
Natalie McGarry (MP for Glasgow East 2015-7) has received a two year prison sentence for the embezzlement of £25,000.[4]
[5]
The Procedure Committee of the House of Commons recommends against allowing babies into the chamber.[6]
[7]
The Justice & Home Affairs Committee of the House of Lords has requested the government overhaul the "Life in the UK" test for would-be citizens.[8]