Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

I'll concede on that point with Azula attempting genocide, but I think Zhao is just as bad because even Azula had Hidden Depths and was a "Well Done, Son" Guy toward her mother. Zhao reacted the same way as Azula did when Zuko was scarred and has no redeeming traits.

edited 24th Mar '17 8:36:05 PM by k410ren

On second thought, forget it. I won't plead my case any longer.

@Ravok

Ok, while I agree that he's not heinous enough, I don't think he was treated like a joke. Iroh and Jeong Jeong took him pretty seriously, and the only comedic scene I recall him being involved in was where the butt of the joke was somebody else (some guy from the water tribe who tried to attack Zhao and promptly gets knocked off the ship by him with Iroh shaking his head)

Ok. Been a long time since I saw Book One, so my memory's pretty fuzzy on it.

edited 24th Mar '17 9:38:14 PM by Awesomekid42

to Zhao echoing Ravok and Lighty's reasons

For my loathsome CM in terms of acts and personality, it still be Joffrey Baratheon. My reasons include Joffrey being a massive Sadist enjoying making everyone's life family included be a living hell just because he's King, him being such a Dirty Coward and Weakling who doesn't even try to fight back those who aren't afraid of him, and gloating to everyone on how he single handily won the War of Five King, when its his grandfather who won the war for him, and practically did all the work. Seriously his death is still my all time favorite scene and that includes scene where Ramsay gets eaten by his hounds. I'm glad on how Jack Gleeson made the character so despicable, shame he retired acting so early.

As for my most loathed CM in terms of being poorly written and boring, Jarvis comes to mind. To me, he is just a cliche villain who wants to use a pokemon to Take Over the World, something that been done many times before, simply looks non-threatening and bland. It also doesn't help thatin the English dub his name is changed to Alva and changed his voice actor from Sean Schemmel (Voice of Goku and other characters in Pokémon including Grings Kodai) to Billy Bob Thompson just because the former is now living in LA. In fact I found it easier to be scared of Lusamine than I did for Jarvis and she is not even a CM.

Anywho I currently have 3 for D'Arby anyone else want to vote?

Reaffirming my on D'arby.

I wouldn't consider Zhao a joke, either - he was absolutely a dangerous villain and a significant threat across the season; his ego and ambition just exceeded his competence and the story had a tendency to smack him down for it. An observation I made a while back is that Zhao, both in his arc as a whole and most of the individual episodes he appears in, has a distinct tendency to start out strong and then fumble his endgame, usually because his explicitly noted in-story flaws of pridefulness and temper get ahold of him (as Aang notes, he has no self-control). That said, as has been mentioned previously there's really no axis he's heinous on that Ozai and/or Azula don't beat him at, so I'd definitely agree with a .

EDIT: There were a couple of explicitly comedic scenes at Zhao's expense - Aang's mockery of him in "The Deserter" and his being attacked by Momo after he captures the Moon Spirit in "Siege of the North II" ("get it off me, get it off me!"), but the first was a deliberate, and successful, attempt on Aang's part to get Zhao to blow his top and stop fighting rationally, and the second was more about breaking the tension in what was, at that point, one of the most serious and intense scenes in the entire series. There was also a brief bit in "The Blue Spirit" where Zhao is bragging about having a full transcript of his speech about having captured Aang sent to Ozai along with glowing testimony from the audience, only to immediately discover that Aang has escaped, but that's a brief moment in the episode as a whole where Zhao is probably at his biggest threat level all season. Zhao isn't played for laughs in most of his scenes, and speaking of Book One antagonists, Zuko is the butt of jokes much more often (admittedly, partially because the audience spends more time with him).

edited 24th Mar '17 8:52:55 PM by MasterGhandalf

A CM wouldn't be played so lightheartedly as Zhao. I'm sorry, but they wouldn't.

Getting a butt wagged in your face, having a flying lemur jump on you while you shriek like a lunatic, being regularly and embarassingly beaten down by the heroes/Zuko, having a badass speech you are writing be interrupted by the fact that you have just failed horribly, and appearing in a sequel series SOLELY for the show to make fun of how pathetic you are are NOT things that a CM would have.

If one or two were present, then MAYBE we could brush it off, but all working together makes Zhao a stooge 49% of the time.

I know that the ones arguing about this humor thing aren't saying that Zhao is a CM, but saying that he wasn't Played for Laughs quite a bit in a way no real CM would be is plain untrue.

There's no point to this debate, regardless.

As for D'Arby....I'm gonna need to think on him. I originally voted 'No' last time, but seeing the crimes refreshed makes me rethink it a bit...I'll need to think on it.

edited 24th Mar '17 9:23:11 PM by Ravok

Zhao. Butt-Monkey and Complete Monster are usually mutually exclusive.

I certainly wasn't trying to argue that Zhao was never played for laughs or the butt of jokes; he was. I do, however, disagree with any attempt to dismiss him as a solely comedic villain, because he was a genuine threat when firing on all cylinders - but when he overreached, which he almost always did, the story was quick to punish and humiliate him for it. I actually think Zhao's scenes of competence made the humorous moments more effective, because they were karmic - there was never any doubt that this man deserved whatever humiliation was being thrown at him. I wasn't trying to make the point that he was treated seriously enough to be a CM, because it's moot anyway - he doesn't qualify for other reasons (though in a hypothetical universe where Ozai and Azula either didn't exist or were significantly less menacing - the only way I can see to make Zhao count - I would imagine he'd have been treated with greater gravitas).

But we're quickly moving beyond the scope of this thread.

edited 24th Mar '17 9:33:38 PM by MasterGhandalf

Diablo's entry needs to be trimmed, like, by AT LEAST 1/4.

Rest look good. Beast, bobg, drafts please.

Besides the usual batch, I may have 2 effortposts of my own (those Department 19 ones). One I didn't think was heinous enough, but taking another look may indeed be. The other I'll have to check.

edited 25th Mar '17 2:13:46 AM by ACW

Kira and Zhao

Having finished Catalyst I have an expansion for Krennic:

• Catalyst & Rogue One: Commander Orson Callan Krennic, The Sociopath who would eventually become Director of the Advanced Weapons Research division of the Imperial Military—and thus in charge of the creation of the Death Star, especially the superlaser—fought for the Republic as a Lieutenant Commander in the Clone Wars, where he revealed his true colors by massacring civilians and noncombatants whose only crime was being affiliated with Separatists. Upon the rise of the Empire, Krennic enthusiastically supported the new regime, both to make his dream of creating the Death Star a reality. Krennic frequently engineers schemes to give the Empire control of mining interests, and at one point engineers a war on one world, both so the Empire can end up brutally suppressing it and to distract Tarkin. Krennic frequently displays a tendency to betray and kill those who work with him. He is the Evil Former Friend of the pacifistic genius scientist Galen Erso, and acts as his False Friend, in order to use his research for the superlaser. When a group of engineers ask to be released from their contracts, Krennic simply obliterates their facility. When Erso escapes, Krennic tracks him down, resulting in the death of Galen's wife, and forces him to help design the Death Star. Krennic later has it tested on the civilian city of Jedha and has innocent engineers massacred just to hurt Galen even after Galen admits to leaking information. Firmly dedicated to his own career, Krennic will betray or murder whoever he has to in order to keep the command he feels is his by right.

edited 25th Mar '17 6:24:05 AM by ACW

Kira and Zhao. I'm not really sure about D'Arby.

What is the show

Panty and Stocking with Garterbelt is a vulgar comedy that is a parody of adult animation. The main characters are anti-heroines. These characters constantly do Kick the Dog moments such as trying to kill a character, liking BDSM or sex and also joking about abortions. However there is the main villain of the work that the main characters who are comedic sociopaths don't like. His name is Corset.

Who is he?

Corset is a tyrant and the mayor of Daten City. He is a sadomasochist,sadist and also a pervert who abuses his own daughters to unlock the keys of hell using the ghost of a character's penis which will then open up the gates of hell allowing him to rule the world and will kill everyone with his ghosts.

What has he done?

The first mention we see of Corset is after Episode 6 where he is shown to abuse Scanty and Kneesocks through various torture works that are described to be very disturbing. He makes his official appearance in the end of Episode 12 (There's 13 episodes overall) where he pretends to be Brief's father and was using him to marry the daughters so they could have sex. Brief instead falls in love with Panty but it still triggers anyway giving Panty a Heroic B.S.O.D. He then goes up against Garterbelt ripping his heart out of body cruely smiling before destroying it killing Garterbelt with no seem of remedy and uses Scanty and Kneesocks of literal tools and weapons for his need without giving a crap about them. Corset then tries to kill Panty and Stocking to get his job done despite that Stocking is also related to Corset. When Corset ends up being defeated by God all seems over until he is still revealed to be alive and used Stocking to kill Panty and then he tries to do his plan again.

Lack of redeeming features

He has a weird love for Bondage which he uses to power himself up. I don't think having a BDSM fetish counts enough though.

Heinous example

Has a 0% approval rating from the main characters who are comedic sociopaths. While typically Panty and Stocking is a vulgar comedy he is a Knight of Cerebus that drops most (If not all) of the comedy in the show and is the Big Bad. Notably every other villain is a case of Made of Evil (The Ghosts) or Laughably Evil (Scanty and Kneesocks).

Verdict

Comedies are always to be skeptical but while Panty and Stocking is indeed a vulgar comedy, Corset is always to be taken seriously and a huge case of Knight of Cerebus. Gainax works are always iffy and Scanty and Kneesocks do some incest at one point. Notably however those two having incest would be a step down but I always believe that in a comedy if a character only does vulgar stuff once and never does it again I don't think it's as bad as a character doing vile stuff all the time and it playing 100% completely seriously. I'm midway with this guy as I can see both points but he's easily the second worst Gainax/Trigger villain besides from Ragyo. I'll be leaving it to you guys.

edited 25th Mar '17 11:09:58 AM by ReynTime250

He proably SHOULDN'T be on the YMMV page, as he hasn't been approved yet.

As for the proposal, I don't know enough about the work's tone to vote.

Hi so in Patrick Bateman's writeup, it says "the novel and its movie adaptation completely construct the idea of the Complete Monster". I would just ask the the last part about "movie adaption" in that sentence be removed-given it's been proven the movie adaption does not count because he couldn't bring himself to kill a girl he worked with.

I mentioned that. Corset is not on the YMMV page at all. That's why I made the proposal.

Foremost...Bateman not murdering Beverly doesn't mean much. He's amused and fascinated by her because she's the only person around him who's not utterly shallow and empty. It's not him being moral. He's not really capable of that.

@ Reyn: A work won't be on the YMMV page (or shouldn't be) if it's not proposed here first. Regarding posting...it helps a lot if you first explain what the work is, who the characters are, etc. so we have some background info here. Especially as from what I recall, Panty & Stocking was a comedy, which means we have to know more and be naturally skeptical. This post doesn't even mention Corset's ultimate plan...he doesn't even seem to pass the baseline from what you said

edited 25th Mar '17 10:21:16 AM by Lightysnake

"A work won't be on the YMMV page (or shouldn't be) if it's not proposed here first."

Yeah, that's what I was trying to say; I just wasn't clear.

Lighty, thoughts on D'Arby? We're trying to settle this once and for all.

Edited my analysis of Corset's actions with more detail and context.

Hello, I am new to this. I looked over the rules and was still wondering if I could just add some potential candidates or is there some sort of waiting I had to do? My suggestions are not from works that have not been released yet.

If they're not released how do you know they count?

I'm sorry, I guess I worded that incorrectly. :/ I was trying to say that the suggestions I have are not on a list of works waiting to be released, but from a show that has been out of production for the past several years. I hope that cleared things up.

Using the ghost of someone's penis as keys? Yeah...no. I can't vote up a character like that.

If it's been out of production for several years, you can probably propose the character.