Sympathetic rape?

One of my stories opens with the following scene:

A man & woman are heading to bed, kissing and undressing. Then the man pulls the woman's pants down to reveal that she has a penis. He freaks out and attacks her, yelling that he's going to kill her. She defeats him using Super-Strength and paralyzing spit powers, and then anally rapes him while he's paralyzed. Then she leaves before he can recover.

Would you feel that the rape was a Moral Event Horizon-crossing thing to do, or does the situation make it somewhat sympathetic?

If I'm asking for advice on a story idea, don't tell me it can't be done.

Personally I think it's a bit weird to rape someone after they threaten to kill you, not to mention seemingly pointless and For the Evulz, since there's not much plausibility there. I suppose it's somewhat sympathetic, but unless the rapist feels REALLY guilty afterward, it's more of a MEH.

I have played Borderlands now, but my Undead Ned persona predates it!

The man trying to kill her just because of that is too extreme. The fact that he was "freaked out", if it's the only justification, isn't enough.

About the topic, this does sound like a MEH for me. Sure, he attacked her, but she still rapes him for fun.

^ Actually, I can sort of see someone freaking out and doing something irrational, though in either case both of them respond with Disproportionate Retribution. I can see a setup like that evoking plenty of Narm.

I have played Borderlands now, but my Undead Ned persona predates it!

Okay if you're going to do this you should have it be a spur of the moment things something the woman does possibly in anger or revenge without thinking. Afterwards they must feel remorse about it. Like My God, What Have I Done? level remorse.

Even then you'll probably have a good portion of people who still won't view it as sympathetic.

Well, she's going to turn out to be a Blue-and-Orange Morality shapeshifting spider looking to implant eggs in unsuspecting hosts. But I want her to be somewhat sympathetic despite how inhuman she is. And I figured her implanting a Chest Burster into an attempted murderer would be more sympathetic than implanting it into an innocent guy just looking to have sex.

If I'm asking for advice on a story idea, don't tell me it can't be done.

It's REALLY difficult to make something like that sympathetic. Utopia Justifies the Means?

I have played Borderlands now, but my Undead Ned persona predates it!

Perhaps she liked the guy? would make for a interesting Monster Sob Story

Yeah, this will be extremely difficult to pull off given the squick factors involved. The fact that the "woman" is a transexual isn't helping matters. If she were an actual female that might help matters but not by much.

♥♥II'GSJQGDvhhMKOmXunSrogZliLHGKVMhGVmNhBzGUPiXLYki'GRQhBITqQrrOIJKNWiXKO♥♥

Not to mention the "horrific spider monster from beyond the stars here to wipe out humanity" bit.

Honestly, I picture the whole thing as some kind of weird Black Comedy, which is really the only scenario in which that would be anything but a MEH.

I have played Borderlands now, but my Undead Ned persona predates it!

"horrific spider monster from beyond the stars here to wipe out humanity"

She's not out to wipe out humanity. She's just looking to give birth to her babies. Her species is endangered, so there's plenty of humans to go around. Her kind's always been on earth, along with all the other supernatural beings in the story.

Incidentally, would it help if I show her being a caring mother?

Also, the protagonist is a half-vampire Technical Pacifist who tends to get caught up in monster vs slayer conflicts, and always sympathizes with both sides. Species centered morality (What Measure Is a Non-Human? played fairly, basically) is something he readily understands and empathizes with.

If I'm asking for advice on a story idea, don't tell me it can't be done.

Thread Hop:No.

I'm feeling strangely happy now, contented and serene. Oh don't you see, finally I'll be, somewhere that's green...

There is no way to make rapist sympathetic. Even if the victim is an irredeemable hitlerite. You could manage an unsympathetic anti-hero getting away with it, though. Threatening to kill someone because you found out they had a penis is not an adequate enough offense to keep the rapist from full-on villainhood.

This makes it even more impossible, because the rapist in question probably does deserve to be killed.

edited 14th Dec '10 1:31:18 PM by Mammalsauce

No. Just... No.

OK, lets normalize and gender-flip, and see how it comes out. A man and a woman are going to have sex, when the man suddenly, out of nowhere, announces that they're going to have another type of sex (fill in a sexual act or fetish of your choice). The woman is totally shocked and disgusted by this, and tries to kill him. I don't know why this would happen, by the way. It just seems odd for the response to be attempted murder. The man, who's much stronger than the woman (in this case, I realize it isn't always the case), is unworried and easily restrains her. He then rapes her and performs X on her anyway.

That's what you've written, you've just changed the roles.

Except for 4/1/2011. That day lingers in my memory like...metaphor here...I should go.

BANDWAGON JUMPING MANUVER! TRIPLE COMBO!

also:

No. Just No.

...unless it's hentai. And even then, the answer is proably still no.

Incidentally, in Real Life, there are several cases of transsexuals being murdered in this kind of situation. The only reason she wasn't killed was her supernatural powers.

And is the rape different from doing something else unpleasant to him? If she'd given him a No-Holds-Barred Beatdown (as opposed to stopping as soon as he was incapacitated) would that get the same reaction?

If I'm asking for advice on a story idea, don't tell me it can't be done.

Well "I" myself for one would rather give him the No-Holds-Barred Beatdown. Rapists just lose my respect really.

edited 14th Dec '10 6:41:52 PM by PsychoFreaX

Help?.. please...

We have a trope for that.

I have played Borderlands now, but my Undead Ned persona predates it!

It's not sympathetic simply due to the fact that you really have to prepare and get everything ready to rape someone. By the time you actually get ready to go through with it, you'll either end up thinking "Wait...no this is wrong." or just go Complete Monster on 'em and say "Eh. Fuck it. Literally."

I have all the cookies but oatmeal.

Threatening to kill someone without following through doesn't justify the alien spider queen protagonist to do ANYTHING. If he actually did try to kill her, a sufficient beating in self defense would be acceptable, maybe with a few low blows. Your rapist is trying to trick unsuspecting shmucks into having her freak babies, you've already stretched audience sympathy as thin as it could possibly go at best.

edited 15th Dec '10 1:16:33 AM by Mammalsauce

"She's not out to wipe out humanity. She's just looking to give birth to her babies. Her species is endangered"

This goes a long way to make her sympathetic for me. I'd still root for a group of humans trying to kill her, but I wouldn't hate the character either.

However, I think it's better if you scrapped the "he attacked her first" idea. This doesn't make her any less sympathetic, and only sounds like a lame excuse for her to appear good, which is exactly what it is.

You should also probably get rid of the Tansexual part as well as that could lose quite a few sympathizers.

♥♥II'GSJQGDvhhMKOmXunSrogZliLHGKVMhGVmNhBzGUPiXLYki'GRQhBITqQrrOIJKNWiXKO♥♥

"If he actually did try to kill her"

He did. He tried to hit her in the head with a vase, but she was too good at defending herself for him to pose a threat.

If I'm asking for advice on a story idea, don't tell me it can't be done.