Discussion Main / AgeGapRomance

It sounds like the age gap is the least unusual thing about it.

Yes and no.

It's true that it's the least of their concerns, but it's still acknowledged in-universe because Reiri is an adult and a superior officer who's sleeping with one of her subordinates, who also happens to be a minor. If anyone among the top brass were to find out about it, she would likely be stripped of her rank and Kizuna would likely be facing expulsion.

That's why they have to keep it a secret. Reiri even uses her military authority to give Kizuna days off so they can be together, without fear of being caught. All of that deals with their respective ages and their positions within Ataraxia's military. The trope description doesn't say the age difference has to be the only concern.

Edited by MiinU I wouldn't mind failure so much, if I didn't fail so much.

You're right that it doesn't have to be the only concern, but the way the example was previously written, it got lost in the description of all the other, arguably greater concerns.

The way the entry is written now, it's not addressed at all. It says that an age gap exists but not that it's noteworthy in-universe.

Can you write the example in such a way that it clearly establishes that the age gap is notable in-universe and a significant barrier?

Edited by HighCrate

That's a fair point. How about:

• Hybrid X Heart Magias Academy Ataraxia: Kizuna (age 17) becomes involved in an incestuous relationship with his 27-year old sister, Reiri. The age difference and the difference in rank creates an ethical issue, given Reiri would likely be stripped of her rank if anyone among the top brass were to find out she's sleeping with a minor, whereas Kizuna would likely be expelled from the academy. So Reiri uses her authority to give Kizuna days off so they can be together without fear of being caught.

I wouldn't mind failure so much, if I didn't fail so much.

That looks better. Thanks for working with me on this.

Likewise. I'm glad we could reach an agreement. I'll add the revised example later today.

I wouldn't mind failure so much, if I didn't fail so much.

Well, I agree with some of your choices when handling these case of ZCE, but some are way too strict.

First, the description says it should be mentioned in-verse, not that it absolutely has to be.

Second, some of the examples clearly mentioned the age gap and the uneasiness the characters felt, be it the lovers themselves, or their family or friends, yet you deleted them or commented them out (the Last Kingdom example, the Downton Abbey examples, and probably others as well).

Edited by XFllo

I've added some of the deleted examples with tweaked context.

Some of your deletions set the standard on ZCE too high, yet some of the examples that are left on the page barely have the age stated.

Why do you insist that these two examples do not fit?

• Betty's second husband Henry Francis is about two decades older than her. Henry met Betty when she was married and pregnant with her third baby and he was simply charmed with her beauty. His mother doesn't approve of the relationship, thinking he need not marry her.
  Pauline Francis: Well, I know what you see in her. And you could have gotten it without marrying.

Deleted line(s) 120 (click to see context) :

• Peggy Olson had an affair with Duck Phillips. She was a young talented copywriter in her early twenties and he was a middle-aged guy. They met at Sterling Cooper and he later tried to get her to work for another company. She refused, but they started to sleep together in secret.

About the change of the description — it is allowed to add some links to related tropes and improve the description.

BTW, I was a sponsor of this trope in TLP. I know it doesn't make me the trope owner, but the in-universe lampshade hanging was never intended to be the only requirement for this trope. That sets the standard for listing examples unreasonably high.

I think this trope is only in play if an obstacle is presented. I'll cite Doctor Who for my counter-example:

• Rory, also known as "the last centurion", experienced almost 2000 years of life before he was married to his childhood sweetheart. He is clearly much older than her twenty or so years old, yet it is not presented as a problem for their relationship.
• The Doctor himself, over 900 years old, is in a very complicated relationship with Melody Pond, who is less than 50 years old. Again, their age is never presented as a conflict.

Link to TRS threads in project mode here.

Thanks for your input (truly and sincerely), but that is a different trope, no? I think those examples fit very well on Mayfly–December Romance. And I think there is an obstacle for the couple — if only that one of them might die sooner. I assume so — I don't watch Doctor Who, so I don't know how the trope plays precisely in that show.

The Doctor also fits Human Aliens. The fact that the characters fit other tropes doesn't mean that they don't fit this trope's definition.

That said, my examples don't fit Mayfly. The first example are two humans, and the second example are two Time Lords.

Edited by crazysamaritan Link to TRS threads in project mode here.

I feel like given the nature of Doctor Who, the trope probably can't apply at all unless it is between two very standard same-race characters and likely discussed. (X Fllo, it basically invented its own rules of time travel and a few alien species who are connected inherently to time travel — the Doctor is a Time Lord, for example)

I think that the requirements for the trope should really have 2 options, if the work is Like Reality, Unless Noted, so we can use common sense for works where we have to assume it is like reality (e.g. Downton Abbey, set in the early 20th century and about an aristocratic family, it would probably not be unusual for an age-gap romance) and where there is a difference noted from reality (e.g. Doctor Who, actually) where it probably more needs to actually be discussed in universe because we can't otherwise know the societal values of age-gap romances.

OH MY GOD; MY PARENTS ARE GARDENIIIIINNNNGGGGG!!!!!

This is the argument High Crate advocates, as I understand it. I could have used other examples, like James Bond, where the male lead can be in his forties, but the female Love Interest is always less than thirty. Their character ages are rarely specified, though, so it's not as clear. Doctor Who is just more dramatic about it. I could also have used Young Justice, where M'gann is about fifty and Kon-El is about one. But that gets into the different species problem, and potentially lifespan differences.

We can easily say that a May–December Romance is a dramatic enough difference that there's no need to comment on it, but I don't think Age-Gap Romance is a trope unless the work acknowledges the gap as a component of the relationship.

Link to TRS threads in project mode here.