During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Okay, how is this image for "Top Cow Universe" possible page?
Oh, that works.
More DND ones potentially incoming from other settings...I've barely even tapped Ravenloft, let alone Birthright, Eberron, Dark Sun and Midnight.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Is that nudity in that image?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
All the slaves are naked, but we don't see any "forbidden" nude parts.
Edited by VeryVileVillian on Feb 16th 2019 at 11:49:09 PM
For the DND page, btw... was thinking of overhauling it so it's divided into settings, with characters like Orcus and so forth being there for general entries, but to combine everything so it's organized solely by its world. Thoughts?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
If that's a female slave being tortured, we may have an issue.
I'm fine with a D&D reorganization.
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
You can see her nipple; that his probably no bueno.
Edited by ACW on Feb 16th 2019 at 3:57:19 PM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Goku Black
Sure sounds good. Something like the forbidden Realms Games, Literature and Evil Gods pantheon should be listed toegther .
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
....She's carving them apart, but it's the barely perceptible nudity that's the issue? Really?
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I don't see any nipple anyway. On the table is male slave. Every "forbidden" nude part is hidden.
Edited by VeryVileVillian on Feb 16th 2019 at 12:00:13 PM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
If it's a male slave, then it's fine.
Mods. I don't mind myself, but I think the mods might (if it was a female slave, which apparently it isn't).
Goku Black
Should we make a creater page first. It's be weird to launch a CM page without something to attach it to first.
Edited by miraculous on Feb 16th 2019 at 1:08:35 AM
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I'm thinking yes. Either Top Cow or Top Cow Productions
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Better call it Top Cow Productions, as it is official name of the company.
Edited by VeryVileVillian on Feb 16th 2019 at 12:16:23 PM
@Austin DR The DCAU one was the sole Media Darkseid one I was talking about.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
For Madeline, if someone can crop this
◊, we can get it without the text, and use the text as the caption: "Sometimes true evil does take flesh and walk the Earth."
Okay, new tabletop entry:
What's the setting?
A more obscure DND setting, Midnight is a now-discontinued line from Fantasy Flight Games which gives this question: What if the bad guys won? On the world of Aryth, things have gone hideously wrong....long ago, Izrador, a god, turned on his fellow deities and tried to destroy them and seize control of the heavens, turning angels into demons and devils as he did so. Izrador was defeated and cast down by his kin to Aryth, whereupon they wove the Veil of Izrador to make it a prison....unfortunately things went a bit pear-shaped.
See, the intent was to imprison Izrador's soul there when his body was destroyed...the veil cut off the gods' access to the world, but it didn't imprison Izrador like it was went to....great going, guys...so, let's talk Izrador.
Who is Izrador?
God of Corruption, lord of darkness, The Shadow who is not Sauron, I don't know where you got that idea. Izrador attempted to destroy his fellow gods, perverting angels into monsters before his fall....upon finding himself on Aryth, namely the continent of Eredene, Izrador decided to make lemons out of lemonade and began to prey on his enemies. Rising up, Izrador was driven back the first time after a horrific war with an army of orcs under his control, stopped by an alliance of men and elves (he's not Sauron)...the second time, again, he tried to wipe out the elves and dwarves, only to be stopped at the last moment by the arrival of dragons who sided against him.
A long time passed and this time, Izrador decided to get creative. He went for corruption, weakening the minds of men to bind and seduce them, overthrowing them from within. And this time...The Bad Guy Wins. The setting opens a millennium later where we live under Izrador's dictatorship and what a nightmare it is. Izrador has rivers of blood thanks to his wars, and is working on completing the genocide of dwarves and elves alike, while he dwells in his shadowy form in his massive black tower (okay, he's Sauron)....basically? Torture, brutality, tyranny? All part of the daily life under Izrador's rule. Izrador demands regular sacrifice, expansion, warfare and the only ones really resisting are the elves, led by their queen Aradil who's held the line in some way, shape or form for 8,000 years...Izrador? has outlawed literacy through his church, association with elves is punishable by death, and he has the Black Mirrors set up to drain the magic out of Aryth and feed him....which require several human sacrifices on a daily basis.
I'd also be remiss if I didn't mention the Night Kings. Izrador's top minions...a lot of Izrador's servants didn't fare much better. Once the greatest opponent of Izrador, Izrador infiltrated the mind of the elf Ardherin and trapped him in a prison of shame and torture for a long, long time until Ardherin shattered under it and Izrador corrupted him into his greatest warrior.
Oh, yes, and the Fell. I forgot the Fell...every soul he can get? Izrador twists into an undead monster, that rises every night to serve his legions. He's been doing that a while. Ultimately, his goal is to steal the magic of the land, leave it to die and return to life stronger than ever before destroying the Veil of Izrador and launching hmself back into the heavens for round two with his kin.
Heinousness?
Izrador is the Big Bad of Midnight. Literally every evil thing in the present is due to him. And I mean, he obliterates the baseline. Horrifically. Izrador is hands down the worst villain in Midnight, with massive amounts of blood, death and destruction and really nasty torture.
Mitigating Qualities?
No, not at all. He's evil by choice, he cares nothing for anyone and his brethren? The Gods would love to help, but their screw up with the Veil keeps them from Aryth, and also let Izrador run free...and Izrador doesn't really believe power is any fun if it's not abused.
Conclusion?
Very easy keeper.
Goku Black
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Not Sauron
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Yes to Izrador.
Edited by Bullman on Feb 16th 2019 at 5:03:07 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
The Unknown Unknown
Easy keep indeed. Yes to Izrador.
Now, lemme get this out of the way and send it to the drafts:
Kiba no Tabishounin: The Arms Peddler: Baron Oulardt of Yuga runs a lucrative slave market of war prisoners and families taken because clients could not pay his exorbitant interest rate. He parades around his latest line of "merchandise," the people of Caradia, to eager buyers after the men, women, and children were stripped, chained, and flogged. His human trafficking victims include the Caradians' young princess Airi, who he planned to sell to the nefarious Zora cult. To ensure he'd receive his pay and keep his business running, Oulardt ordered the smuggling of outside weapons illegal—Garami encounters the impaled heads of two arms dealers before her that failed.
Good enough? Needs a little more trimming?
Edited by erazor0707 on Feb 16th 2019 at 2:26:21 AM
A cruel, sick joke is still a joke, and sometimes all you can do is laugh.
Sauron—I mean, Izrador!
Izrador.
Yea to Lighty’s but that Apos comparison falls apart at him having a massive wrap sheet. I did the King of Despair, who tries to end the world from a 12-ep work at ~140 words and Lighty did Shyamalan, who tries to eradicate the Earth of everyone but those he deems chosen at ~90. If you’re gonna be resistant to change that’s fine but if I see the anime and find this can be massively condensed it’s more than fair to say I’m not going to be happy at the trouble I have to go to get a decent summary.
I know it's a bit late to ask this question, but did you guys and gals have a good Valentine's day?
jjj
Yeah, I feel like those were grandfathered in.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts