Full Metal Alchemist General

I've finished vol 8 of the manga.

Greed is crucified on a cross in the newer prints. My book was printed in December 2014. As such it has ads for both the anime.

Out of curiosity Link, are you going to watch Conqueror of Shamballa?

Yeah, I probably will. My friend and I made an agreement to start on Brotherhood both equally blind on November 4 (we've been planning to marathon anime together around Halloween for months now, and I suggested we watch FMAB during the marathon) so I'll probably watch the movie to get my FMA fix in the couple weeks between now and then, as well as a couple shows I've been planning to watch in the meantime.

All right then. If you like 2003, then I would say it's required watching. You'll see what I mean.

edited 19th Oct '16 8:27:07 PM by LordVatek

I'm a little disappointed with Frank Archer. I was hoping that he'd be a kind of well-intentioned but antagonistic Inspector Javert with the potential for an interesting character arc but he just turned out to be kind of bland and a total jackass with no redeeming qualities.

Someone remind me what Archer's role in 2003 is.

Antagonistic General Ripper/Smug Snake? Got turned into a cyborg for reasons I don't entirely understand?

I don't remember him much myself - never really cared for him. Kimblee is much better as the prominent human antagonist for Brotherhood, in my opinion.

Man Dante is such a horrible person. Ugh.

I am quite liking the series becoming a deconstruction of its own tropes and story.

Ed can force his way back through the gate because he's Edward Elric, damnit!

Oh, now Envy's actions make more sense. We just need to pull Hohenheim back from across the gate and Trisha/Sloth back to existence to complete the single most awkward family reunion ever.

Ed's Dead

Finale hyyppppeee

No Fuhrer Bradley, why'd you have to kill your own son

FUCK YEAH ROY MUSTANG IS AWESOME

Roy C'mon dude I ship you and Hawkeye there's no way you can lose to Archerbot

Getttt dunked on Dante

Al

Ed

Human Transmutation...ACHIEVED. Not quite sure how it's possible, but given that this scenario is still EE-compliant and more was given up than what was received keeping in with the series thematically, and also because this is a special case due to Stone influence and Gate shenanigans I'm OK with it...sorta. Shouldn't be possible to bring back the dead though...

So Ed traded himself and Al's memories of their adventures together for Al back in his 10-year-old form. Bittersweet for sure, but strangely heartwarming. Brothers playing in the background really seals the deal here.

Why is nobody reacting negatively at all to Al saying he'll bring Ed back? Have they forgotten the last time they tried that?

Still though, this is a nice ending. Story went in a weird but neat direction, and the ending is super feelzy. I wouldn't mind if this were the end, even without the movie. Al chooses to believe in equivalent exchange in some way, even if it's not quite perfect and you will usually give more than you receive but it's all worth it anyway, and Ed will continue to try and find Al again, while living amongst us. As a sidenote, I am now totally tempted to write fanfics about Edward Elric, Fullmetal Rocket Scientist.

edited 19th Oct '16 11:18:02 PM by LinkToTheFuture

So Dante must die?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

2003's finale may look fine at the first glance, but if you poke at it it's moral crumbles like dirt.

edited 20th Oct '16 8:13:36 AM by RAlexa21th

What do you mean?

I found out that there's a bit of a Dub-Induced Plot Hole: In the original, Ed was Only Mostly Dead when Al transmuted himself as opposed to him resurrecting a dead Ed in the dub. I think that makes a bit more sense.

My biggest problem with Brotherhood is that it seems to demand that I see characters like Kimblee as respectable - and I just can't. The series tries to be relatively non-judgemental, respecting people who firmly believe in their philosophies (even horrible ones like Kimblee), but this results in me feeling like the story is trying to make up my mind for me.

You see this again when the heroes stop the coup. We're supposed to respect Mustang not killing any soldiers, particularly the ones who don't know what the government is doing. But at the same time, we're also supposed to respect Briggs not caring about that, as they're perfectly willing to kill.

As a whole, I'd say I prefer Brotherhood. The villain is better, being just as pathetic as he is malevolent and dangerous. Furthermore, the plot feels more structured, at least after the series gets past the stuff 2003 already covered. As others have stated, it uses its side characters better as well.

edited 21st Oct '16 2:45:50 PM by SilentColossus

Uh, what, not once did the series call Kimblee a hero. No hero respect Kimblee's philosophy, at best they say "holy shit this asshole has a point, but I'll punch him in the face anyway." It's Kimblee who respects people who believe in their philosophies. Look at where Father's philosophies took him.

Both Colonel Mustang and General Armstrong use different means to achieve the end (toppling the current government). Mustang uses a more stealthy, elegant approach, using politicians and propaganda to make him look like a good guy. Armstrong uses a more... uh.. strongarm approach, "haha my army is stronger than yours" and it got many of her troops killed and even Mustang's troops call her a traitor to protect themselves.

Also by your logic, people cannot like Daredevil and The Punisher at the same time.

edited 21st Oct '16 2:32:48 PM by RAlexa21th

No, Kimblee is not a hero. He is firmly a villain. However, he is treated as a respectable one; we're supposed to admire his dedication to his beliefs, his respect to his victims (as he remembers all of them), and we're supposed to cheer when he gives Pride his "Reason You Suck" Speech.

Father doesn't really have any philosophy. Not one that really matters to him anyway; he abandons it all when things start going south. He is a scared little creature who wants to escape his prison, whether it is a flask, or the world itself. Nothing is enough for him, and he'll devour everyone in his way.

edited 21st Oct '16 2:45:20 PM by SilentColossus

Yes, characters (and people) can be terrible and still have virtues, or else we'll get Frank Archer and 2003 Kimblee.

Mostly because Pride is a bigger piece of shit and he saves Edward's ass.

edited 21st Oct '16 2:38:35 PM by RAlexa21th

Yup. But I don't have to respect them. Everyone has good traits. Or at least most, even if they're otherwise horrible people. That doesn't make them admirable.

But this isn't the point. Kimblee is very interesting, and I like him as a character. What I don't like is that I feel forced to respect him.

edited 21st Oct '16 2:45:00 PM by SilentColossus

Should I move to the Brotherhood thread now to avoid spoilers?

I didn't much like Kimblee in '03, so I'm glad to know he has a more fleshed-out role here.

Again, no one in-universe likes Kimblee except Winry (because he's too smooth a criminal) and the Homunculi (oh man, you're a sociopath, HIRED!)

edited 21st Oct '16 2:44:14 PM by RAlexa21th

Whoops, sorry.

I'm not talking about how the characters feel, but instead how the narrative expects me to feel. The tone of the series, and how the characters are presented

It's fine.

Eh, I'm not good at telling what the narrative is telling me to feel. And "real life" people respect fictional genocidal villains all the time. Just look at comments in videos where Wrath kills tank.

edited 21st Oct '16 2:50:19 PM by RAlexa21th

Well yeah.

He killed a Tank with a sword. That's gonna earn you some awesomeness browny points.

Yup. even though his actions makes things worse for the good guys (and by proxy the country), we still cheer him because it's freaking awesome.

…With all these discussions I'm taken by a sudden urge to marathon Brotherhood again.