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The biggest problem I have with the rename is that it fails to roll off the tongue. It's a few syllables short, as are the other MO As. Thus I suggest a new, appropriate adjective, and for Awesome I propose Epic. The redundancy is funny, IMHO, and it feels more complete than just moment(s) of awesome. Add the plural to compensate for trope decay (which was a decent reason for renaming, kinda)
Awesome Moments Of Awesome?
I liked that, too, but it was already shot down for NO RASIN (sic).
I wish we could get a crowner going for each of these (awesome, funny, heartwarming) just so these threads stop poping up... (rule that "Crowning" is not an option)
edited 12th Oct '10 1:48:24 AM by Raso
I don't see anything wrong with the current title. No need to touch it.
The grand high dictator of the wiki has spoken on this. It's not up for voting.
If the Crowning moments are suppose to be the ONE and ONLY ONE example for an entire series, then it's purpose has failed spectacularly, because people are defining them with moments on a per-episode basis, or multiple points per scene. Many of them also come down as a YMMV situation anyway.
The name "crowning moment" still refuses to die. Blame the Grandfather Clause, it was in wide use on this wiki well before the alleged administrative fiat performed unilateral renaming.
The trope is about epic moments. Renaming it to Epic Moments Of Awesome would be much more fitting than what we have now.
I'd say Moments of Awesome is fine. "Crowning Moment of Awesome" has become a fairly established phrase even outside the wiki, but if we're not going to use that because the word "crowning" implies singularity, then we shouldn't try to replace it with a different adjective.
^^^ Crowning Moment of Awesome is not going to die. We should not force it to die, and we should not complain when it refuses to die. It's an expression for when someone does their "most awesomest thing evurz". That concept exists. But it is not a concept that can be meaningfully expressed by a trope, hence the need for its rename.
Epic is a fad word, so it's a bad idea to name it that because it'll become Totally Radical in a few years.
I meant "refuses to die" slightly more as a compliment, than as a complaint.
If Crowning Moments have gone memetic, we should consider having a page about the meme.
edited 12th Oct '10 12:54:08 PM by Stratadrake
I don't really see why we can't change it back to Crowning Moment Of Awesome and rule it exampleless (if examples are indeed the problem) because every person is going to have a different thing they're going to think was OMG MOST EPIC MOMENT EVER.
I think the reason why "Crowning Moment of Awesome" did so well on the name is because the internet likes the word "Awesome".
Given that the internet also likes the word "Epic", I think Fast Eddie is perhaps somewhat concerned at the possible memesplosion that could result from a name that contained both.
(I was going to make this a new thread, but this one already exists.)
While I am entirely aware that the rename from Crowning Moment Of Awesome to Moment Of Awesome was a decision of admin fiat, it was also a very stupid decision of admin fiat. Here are the reasons why, in accordance with the guidlines listed on Everything You Wanted To Know About Changing Titles:
1. It wasn't broke.
It may have drifted a bit away from the initial definition, but only in the absolute strictest sense. It had good inbound links and I've seen it show up numerous times in the wild, so it fits two out of the three categories for a working name.
2. The change was very explicitly not for the community, but for admin's personal opinion.
In fact, this is the entire reason why the admin responsible used fiat to do it: because no one wanted it, meaning it wouldn't last unless he did use admin fiat.
3. There was a consensus, but the consensus was heavily against the rename.
The amount of whining and moaning on the discussion page, particularly prior to when the admin wiped it, should make this pretty obvious.
4. The original name, Crowning Moment Of Awesome, did not fit any of the four listed reasons to propose a rename.
It's coherent, it isn't work-dependent, it isn't named after a character, and it isn't titled after a work of fiction. Literally the only reason to rename it is the minor definition drift, and considering it's a subjective trope, it's arguable whether there was really any drift at all.
So yeah. The least you could do is follow the guidelines that you set yourself. This also goes for Crowning Moment Of Funny and Crowning Moment Of Heartwarming.
Another thing that's worth noting: I've seen the new name used as a Pot Hole exactly once.
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^100% agreement. Atleast the old name was kept as a redirect.
^^^The meaning of the trope has changed as well. It used to be "the single most awesome thing in a given work." It now means "an awesome thing in a given work," which is how people were using it.
IMHO, the "crowning" part was derived from the Crowner system, which was occasionally used to determine which moment to list in the article. But the term has since gone memetic.
No, it's the reverse. The crowners were created to figure out what actually was the Crowning Moment Of Awesome.
@Sean Tucker: There were plenty of people who supported the rename, they just stayed out of the conversation cause they were tired of the shitstorm.
Back on-topic, the original rename was Awesome Moments, but after continued whining, it was change to the far more awkward and unwieldy Moment Of Awesome. And then the continued complaining got annoying and the thread in question was nuked, iirc.
edited 12th Jan '11 9:15:38 PM by KrisMahai
Well at one time there were crowners made for some series that had ALL the awesome moments in it and people could vote up and down for the most awesome ones. The West Wing Co MA's had a system like that at one time.
I for one wouldn't mind a return to that system since every series seems to have its own page now and it could return to its old name.
edited 13th Jan '11 2:29:46 AM by Raso
....why not just Crowning Moments of Awesome?
Add an "s" so people don't fight over the singularity of one event?
Because then no lesson is learned.
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How well does it match the trope?