Chatterbox - Anime & Manga

Louise isn't nearly far enough to the right.

I know, right.

Poor Mewtwo, though.

Huh, I recognize maybe half of those. Disagree with a lot of it, though

Fully agree with Yujiro's (85,20) placement.

Not sure how Asuka got away with a deserve score of only 20.

I'm surprised Sasuke, Sakura, and Gaara all get charted but not Naruto himself.

Griffith I think should probably be lower on the suffering list. Not that what happened to him wasn't monsterous, but then he ultimately ended up hitting the Ultimate Karma Houdini Jackpot afterwards.

I read it less as how much they literally deserved to suffer and more "How much their actions or flaws are the root of their suffering."

edited 16th Sep '17 10:05:50 PM by Lionheart0

Neptune and Umaru should probably switch places.

Nah.

Double nah.

Is that Gaku at 75, 95? Given the nature of that story, I'm not sure either axis even applies to her

Also C.C. at 55, 95, and I feel like both values should be, like, halved

I think I'd have Homura (45, 95) and Ai (30, 95) switch places

That's just one row

EDIT: Vash is at 25, 75, which means that 20, 95 is fucking Knives. Who the hell put this together?

edited 16th Sep '17 10:26:01 PM by Hylarn

I think Guts and Punpun are about right.

Same with Yuko Amamiya.

edited 17th Sep '17 9:31:58 AM by Demongodofchaos2

I general there are a few characters that suffer explicitly worst than death fates. Like one of them was burned alive as an act of mercy levels of bad. So that kind of throws off that whole scale.

Someone on Tumblr made a rather interesting observation on the differences in the creator--fandom relationship between Japan and, say, the USA, using Kadokawa's recent debacle involving the dismissal of Kemono Friends director TATSUKI.

Quoting verbatim (and thus retaining the source post's lack of proper capitalization):

Honestly, though, when you look at most American fandoms, it's not hard to imagine why creators might insult them.

edited 26th Sep '17 6:18:17 PM by PhysicalStamina

The temptation is pretty easy, for any fandom of any nationality

It makes me sympathetic to the view of how real art wouldn't be that beholden to consumers

A creator who holds his audience in contempt is a worthless stuck up idiot who deserves to fall into obscurity. Japan has it figured out, man.

edited 27th Sep '17 4:56:00 AM by Shlugo_the_great

Even if said audience is full of idiots, elitists, trolls, and other terrible people?

Plus, bending over backwards to please your audience isn't always a good thing. See: Sonic Team.

edited 27th Sep '17 5:06:53 AM by PhysicalStamina

Reasonable contempt (e.g. proliferation of Fan Dumb types within the relevant fandom) is one thing. Unreasonable contempt, where the creator expresses disdain towards any and all of their work's fans even in the absence of Fan Dumb, and especially if it turns into "creators always know better than fans" / "all fans are stupid, all creators are infallibly smart", is flat-out discrimination and the offenders deserve any backlash that they suffer.

See Yamakan for example.

You get the audience you deserve. If your fandom is full of terrible people, that probably just means that's the kind of people your work attracts, so looking down on them is ridiculous.

The point is, creators are nothing without their audience so they have no business looking down on it.

I would argue Steven Universe (as an example) deserves better than people who would harass someone on Tumblr for drawing a character too thin.

Plus, we have Misaimed Fandom for a reason.

edited 27th Sep '17 5:45:10 AM by PhysicalStamina

Oh please, crazy Tumblr people is exactly the target audience of Steven Universe.

And yeah, Misaimed Fandom is a thing, but as I said - you get the audience you deserve, not the one you'd wish for.

edited 27th Sep '17 5:52:51 AM by Shlugo_the_great

Yeah, still not buying it. That implies that good works get good fanbases and bad works get bad fanbases, which is incredibly simple-minded. Good works end up with terrible fandoms all the time. So to imply that SU or MLP deserves an audience that harasses anyone they don't like when both shows stand for exactly the opposite of that is, to be blunt, fucking ridiculous. You're essentially blaming the creator for the fanbase ending up so horrible.

In today's edition of I Read That As:

• Hakata Tonkotsu Ramens (which is getting an anime adaptation in 2018 with Daisuke Ono, Yūki Kaji and Yūsuke Kobayashi as the main characters)
• Haruka Tomatsu Ramens

The preview (obviously for the former) was just released.

This PV definitely reminds me of Cowboy Bebop, style-wise.

edited 1st Oct '17 4:00:13 AM by Pyrite

I don't want to insult anybody for liking what they like, but am I the only one who thinks manga & anime is getting increasingly creepy? A few years back Miyazaki-sensei said that the industry is too full of otaku, and I'm starting to agree: just look at all the ecchi series (and not "comedic" ecchi like Minna Agechau, but soft-porn ecchi, like Maken-ki!), creepy merchandise like body pillows and cast-off figures, etc.) As a person who likes anime characters as people and not as lust objects, it's beginning to really creep me out. What's worse is that the people who like this creeptastic stuff get lumped in with people like me who are, well, disturbed by it, and miss the older days when this sort of thing wasn't so common.

edited 7th Oct '17 2:11:02 PM by YasminPerry