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Headscratchers: Kingdom Hearts: 358/2 Days
  • I'm surprised no one's answered this question yet. What the HECK is up with that Snarl of Memories scene? What does it mean? What the heck's going on?
    • To me, it seemed like Roxas was suffering from Xion's flooding of Sora and Kairi's memories, somehow gaining access to Riku's mind from her close proximity, therefore causing the Zexion backdrop. Better explanation: Play FF7. If that made sense to you, then you're lying to yourself. Same goes for this cutscene; playing Re:CoM will serve no purpose but knowing what the backdrop is...replacing your desire to know what the backdrop's about to wanting to know why that backdrop is even present.
    • Xion, being a being made up entirely out of memories, was taking in some of Riku's (The dialogue Zexion has with Riku in that cutscene also appears in Chain of Memories. This is further proven by Jiminy's Journal in coded, which is linked to Sora's Heart, having memories of Riku's experiences from the first Kingdom Hearts.
  • Anyone else bothered by Day 27's Secret Report? Marluxia wonders why Axel killed Vexen...Wasn't HE the one to give him the order?
    • He said he already suspected Axel's Double Agent role and was now surprised and thinking differently due to Axel killing him. He thought that Axel may not be a Double Agent after all if he was willing to go and kill Vexen. He reiterates this when he confronts Axel later, with Axel replying that he was simply willing to do anything to gain Marluxia's trust and then betray him.
  • The meaning of the title 358/2 days?... Roxas is with Organization XIII for 358 days. However, he wakes up (in the simulated Twilight town) and considers the events a dream. The evening he goes to sleep and the morning he wakes up is over 2 days.)
    • The "/2" meaning the 358 days as shared by Roxas and Xion?
      • Nomura did confirm in an interview for the tricked-out guidebook released only in Japan that the title does mean the 358 spent by Roxas and Xion.
      • Well, really he just confirmed that title meant 358 days spent between two people. He left it up to the fans to decide which two.
    • In the game, you play Roxas until 358 days of his life have passed. Then Kingdom Hearts 2 begins.
  • So just out of curiosity, why is the page title spelled literally phonetically that way instead of being titled to "Kingdom Hearts: 358/2 Days"?
    • Because Japan-titles don't allow slashes, which are used for namespaces. If you're wondering why the "over" is in such a strange place, that's actually the official pronunciation, according to the developers. It's Japan. Don't ask questions.
    • I was wondering the former, but I was unaware that titles couldn't use slashes. Thanks for the info.
  • On the game itself: Why didn't DiZ, Riku, Namine and Mickey just help Roxas defeat the Organization at the end of the game?
    • Namine's a doormat, and there's really no evidence that Mickey even knew about Roxas' existence at the time, let alone DiZ's plans.
    • Sora is pretty much the strongest out of all of them, his assistance was sort of a necessity. Plus DiZ probably still needed time to create that machine he wanted to use to contain Kingdom Hearts.
    • They could have tried to. Roxas is rather strong when equipped with both keyblades, and he took out Saix with relative ease. Kingdom Hearts wasn't yet finished, so if he had uber!Riku on his side, it is plausible that he could have won. He would only be required to slash through buildings if Xemnas were able to enter Kingdom Hearts. The reason it didn't happen was that DiZ was pulling the strings. He essentially had Sora, Donald and Goofy captive, not to mention the only person able to fix him, so Riku and Mickey would obey him if it came down to conflict between them. As it stood, they were happy enough to follow him. As for DiZ himself: He hates Nobodies. Understandable in a way, being locked in darkness and all, but too eager to take vengeance on all Nobodies. Working WITH one would be too much to bear for him, even for taking down the Organisation.
      • He only took out Saix because he wasn't using uber Kingdom-Hearts moonlight power like he does during his fight with Sora.
    • They all wanted Sora back, is my personal interpretation. As far as they're concerned (except for Namine), Roxas is just a shallow shell of the guy who's not only their friend, but the one most capable of fighting and defeating the Organization. They had already wasted 300-some days trying to fix his memories, after all.
      • Not to mention how powerful Sora's Heart is, which Roxas doesn't have.
      • Because Sora is The Chosen One, everyone's friend, and the protagonist. When it comes to bringing him back, nothing else matters; certainly not the lives of two Nobodies. There's a splendid, tragic bit of deconstruction to it all.
      • DiZ and Riku had no reason to think that Roxas was really that different from any of the other members in Organization XIII. Just because he can raise his voice isn't evidence to them that he actually feels emotions. All of the members can fake emotions without much trouble. As for Xion, Riku let Xion go and gave her a good deal of time to decide things for herself even though he knew Sora couldn't wake up without her disappearance.
    • Just because Roxas could beat Saix doesn't mean he can beat Xemnas, Xigbar, Xaldin, Demyx, Luxord, and Saix at the same time or right after each other. DiZ and Namine really wouldn't have been able to help much, Riku was afraid of giving into the dark, and as awesome as Mickey is he isn't invincible. Be reasonable here people.
    • Moreover Roxas has two keyblades and no companions, he attracts Heartless like honey out in the real worlds and needs to take care of them all himself. The Kingdom Hearts would be created in no time at all.
    • It's probably the above reason, it took no time at all for Neo Shadows to pop up as soon as Roxas stepped into The World That Never Was, not to mention becoming a Nobody seems to make someone a lot stronger, but Hearts seem to offer limitless potential in the KH universe. Especially strong Hearts like Sora's. Roxas, strong as he is, does not have a heart. There's also the other reasons stated above. Mickey Mouse, probably would've taken what Roxas wanted into account but there's a possibility that he didn't know Sora had a Nobody at the time, DiZ hates Nobodies, and he and Riku probably didn't see Number Thirteen as anything more than. . .well Number Thirteen, simply the body of Sora acting on its own.
    • Nope, Word of God is that Roxas was the second strongest Nobody in the Organization, with Xemnas as strongest and Xaldin at third, Him and Riku would have Rofl stomped their way through the castle if they had tried.
      • Just because Roxas is stronger compared to most of the Organization doesn't mean he can beat six members at the same time or in succession. And if he somehow could, then clearly power levels mean everything, so Xemnas could still kick his ass. Also Riku has no real reason to help Roxas (hell, if anything he'd be all for just killing Roxas if it means bringing Sora back), so he was really never in the equation to begin with.
      • I very much doubt he'd be "all for" it. He'd probably hate himself after going through with it. He might do but he'd very much regret it. As for why they didn't try to ally with Roxas, such as figuring out what side he's really on, the risk is far too great. Even if they got Roxas,(and maybe Axel) on their side, they'd still have six members and a legion of lesser nobodies to take on. If Roxas died, Sora'd never wake up, and they'd be screwed. If they somehow managed to win, Riku would feel like the mother of all Ungrateful Bastards. How would that even play out? "Roxas... Thanks for helping us save the universe. Now you get to be whole!" "What do you mean by 'whole'?" "Simple. We'll shove you back inside Sora and you'll get to spend the rest of your existence watching him live out his. Doesn't that sound nice?"
  • How do Roxas's and Axel's backstories work without the presence of Xion? She was so very important to their lives, and yet she's gone - so what do they remember in the end? Are their memories concerning her just blanks? Have they been modified and rewritten? And for that matter, do Xemnas and Saix even remember creating her?
    • They're probably rewritten, it's happened before in this series. And... the memories aren't gone. Chain of Memories states that memories can't be completely erased, they just get disconnected from the chain and fade away eventually.
      • Further theorization on this theory: From the way understood it, Xion was, by the end of the game, made up almost entirely of memories - essentially memories personified. Kingdom Hearts II kind of implied that Sora's memories being messed up worked both ways, everyone had forgotten about him until a short time before he woke up. If that's true, then by returning Sora's memories, the memories that made her up were broken apart and rearranged, so all the connections she had to others disappeared, and they forgot about her, if that makes any sense. Meanwhile, even if you don't buy into that, there's still Xion's own memories that have to be considered - probably hidden with all the memories of Castle Oblivion in Sora's heart, just waiting to be found again, especially if the BBS secret ending is telling the truth.
    • They work, they just don't work as well. Their friendship existed even before Xion joined the group. As was shown, Axel treated her as a friend, but she was never as important to him as Roxas was. Axel wigging out like he did in KHII over Roxas makes a whole lot more sense than if Roxas was replaced by Xion during KHII.
      • Though potential problem: we're told not that she'll be destroyed and forgotten, but that she'll never have existed at all. So there never would have been a Xion to remember. Possibly anyway, the whole 'memories can never be truly forgotten' thing may still apply as those events both did and didn't take place.
      • The answer is that Xion is Roxas. Any interaction Axel had with Xion is recast in their memory as interaction with Roxas, which goes a long way toward explaining the Yandere Ho Yay subtext between them.
      • Prove, please, or else, this is nothing but you're theory. Nothing in the game presents this, and neither do official statements. What they do show, is Xion fading away from their memories when hanging out in the clock tower once Deep Dive comes in, and it's only each other to interact with. And despite that it's a retcon that never truly existed, if we are to take Days as it is now in correlation with KH2, most of the spaces that are blank when Roxas slowly remembers his past memories shows that they were more erased out than replaced.
    • Roxas and Axel's memories get rewritten, with Xion out of it. During Kingdom Hearts II, they're both too busy to stop and think about how little sense their recently rewritten lives make, and as coded showed us, Roxas is very much aware that he's forgotten something, he just doesn't know what.
  • How is it that "Ice Cream" only appears twice on the main page for this game?
    • "Ice Cream" never ended up being related to that many tropes, it was just a object that showed up quite a lot.
  • Whatever happened to that trainee that Hercules scouted?
    • They fell into a Plot Hole.
    • In this series, it's probably better not to ask.
    • He was still on his way when Roxas left, and had probably finished his training by the time Sora showed up. There was like a 6 day window. Phil can knock someone into shape in that time. And my money is on that trainee being Zidane...heck, Vivi is the closest we're going to get to seeing Final Fantasy IX, so why not speculate?
      • And why didn't Phil take note of Roxas' resemblance to Ven, who he met in Birth By Sleep?
      • He met Ven once, ten/eleven years beforehand. Why would Phil remember one kid, even if he was a friend of Herc?
      • Not to mention that he can't even count to three right.
      • Keep in mind that they made a big deal of Herc always just missing him. This makes a lot of sense as a call back to BBS, considering how close Ven and Herc were, Herc would almost certainly have recognized him. In this vein, it can probably be assumed that Phil really doesn't remember Ven.
      • That doesn't explain that one scene where Hercules actually passed by Roxas casually. The Phil mentioned him immediately as Roxas was leaving. It probably wouldn't be that much trouble to go after him and say hello.
      • Related to the above; that's probably also would have been why Tinkerbel was the only one to have met Roxas...and Ventus. She probably recognized him too and was saying "Hey Ventus! Peter Pan's looking for you!"
  • Okay, how exactly are "Nothing, Flowers, The Moon, Space, Illusions, and Time" elements? I understand Nothing given who it is, I mean look at the way he preached about it at the end of KHII, but the others are just weird. Plus how exactly does space make gravity somehow become intensified purely to prevent you from jumping without some other effect on you. I get how flowers messes up your eyes, pollen is painful. Illusions could reasonably make you think you're going right when you're going left, whatever. Time... makes your defense level go to one? Is there something I'm missing here that makes that make sense? As for the Moon, since when does (enter name of whoever is casting silence) yell anything about the Moon instead of "SILENCE". As for the believable elements with stupid effects, why does water drain your hp to heal enemies? As for Earth... did they run out of things to make it do, I mean come on, it halves your hp. A lot of enemies can do that anyway, even without help from some crazy element. Light, what is up with Light, it disables your minimap... in fact why didn't light get used for the blinding one and flowers get used for... anything that makes more sense than pollen burning your eyes out. (I understand the existence and the effects of everything else, so they don't bug me)
    • First off, they're not really elements. "Attributes" would be a better term. Next, Time is stated to work in-game by rewinding your defense to level 1, Light can reasonably be assumed to short out a radar system based off of Nothingness (although it probably would have worked better as Blinding with Flowers doing Poison), and the idea with Moon is that it's so intimidating the enemy can't really speak... or something. You've got me on Water and Earth though.
    • Time, as it pertains to Luxord, seems to be purposefully limited, so the rewinding deal makes a bit of sense. Light I figured is a take on blinding you to your environment, a la Zexion in CoM. Moon refers to lunacy or insanity, i.e. babbling like a loon, which would cause unintelligibility, which would mess with spoken spells, which matches the RPG status effect of 'silence'. Space refers to space-time, which refers to gravity. The deal with water and draining is that water is commonly associated with healing, and the fact that it also damages enemies is a gameplay element.
      • Well, the moon has no atmosphere; no air, so no sound. Alternatively, I can at least say that there's a precedent for linking the moon with silence. "Silent Selene", specifically.
      • Its probably a call back to the berserk status restricting your ability to use magic of course without the added attack boost.Since the moon supposedly causes this effect they used it.
      • I saw Water as draining your health, and Earth as being connected to Gravity in the original Kingdom Hearts (Which halved enemies health).
    • As for why they're elements: well, "Flowers" makes more sense if you extend it to just "plants". Wood is one of the five eastern Classical Elements. Time and Space are natural things that they control, much like any other element, like Fire or Water. Illusions... is a bit of a stretch, yeah. And know that Square has set a precedent for using Moon and Flower as elements anyway.
  • Why is it when Roxas is in Beast's Castle, he must sneak around Lumiere and Cogsworth? He's not following them, and they are little more then anthropomorphic furniture after all, why doesn't he either knock them out or just shove them in a closet somewhere?
    • Because then they'd notice that there was a serial invader, and beef up defenses accordingly, making it harder to complete missions, and making Beast less likely to trust the Treacherous Advisor the Organization planned on sending him.
      • Roxas really isn't that mean. At that point in time he wasn't exactly a good guy but he certainly didn't go around hitting people on the head. Also he had standing orders to avoid detection.
  • Why is Luxord sent with Roxas on most of(if not all of) the Wonderland Missions? IIRC, Luxord shows up in Port Royal in KH:II, so you'd think Luxord would be scouting the area out rather then wandering around Wonderland with Roxas, or that missions with Roxas would be sent with Lux to Port Royal such as he is with Xaldin to Beast's Castle and Demyx to Olympus.
    • Several possible explanations, some storywise, some development possibilities. It's possible that Luxord was either investigating Port Royal himeslf and didn't need or want Roxas there. Will and the others remark on not having seen Heartless before so if they weren't there, he'd have no reason to go there when there weere plenty in Wonderland. Hell, maybe they hadn't even discovered it yet.
    • Development wise, maybe they couldn't get it to look right, the fans or they didn't like it enough to be included, they wanted to use older worlds more to give it more of a KH I feel as it takes place earlier in the series than KH II.
    • One fanfic explained it as he, as a gambler, loved the sheer unpredicability of the place, so he asked to go there. Also, there are a lot of cards there. Gambler's paradise I guess.
    • Their work in Wonderland was pretty much done. The primary purpose there (as with Halloween Town and Agrabah, which likewise experienced no Organization interference in II) was to find a good place to put the devices. After that, Luxord moved on to Port Royal. It is likely that they found Wonderland too difficult for Sora to navigate and take out as much Heartless as possible, but they probably needed to put the device somewhere Sora had strong memories. They couldn't put it in Olympus Coliseum or Beast's Castle, as both had other purposes to fill. Atlantica hasn't seen Heartless since the first game, and its largely underwater nature might also make things difficult (Sora has no memories of the world that weren't underwater). Sora's memories of Neverland are all on the ship or Big Ben at that point; the ship was too risky to put the device, and they probaly hadn't figured out how to get to Big Ben at that point. Traverse Town and Monstro are probably too unreliable location-wise.
    • Maybe it's because, other than Port Royal, it's the closest you'll get to Britain?
  • Okay, it's made clear in-game that Xion only has a face if the beholder has had some contact with Sora in the past; which is why Axel only sees her as a black-haired Kairi after he met Sora at Castle Oblivion. However, Birth By Sleep shows that Ven's heart is currently inside Sora's; Braig had met Ven before, which is why Xigbar sees Xion as Ven briefly. Problem: Birth By Sleep also shows that Axel (as Lea) had also met Ven, so why doesn't Xion appear as Ven to him as well?
    • Because he knew Sora, and Sora's memories, better, having been much more involved in the Castle Oblivion incident than he was in Birth By Sleep.
    • Also, it takes a lot more for someone to see Ven than it does to see black-haired Kairi, for some reason. Remember, Xigbar didn't see Ven until she was reaching critical memory mass in the endgame, whereas Axel saw black-haired-Kairi almost as soon as Sora fell Asleep. Axel knew Sora as well as Ven, and since the Sora connection was so much stronger, it overrode the Ven connection.
      • There's a scene near the end of the game which Xion removes her hood to show Axel that her face changed, I assumed at first that she looked like Sora, but now it could make sense that Axel saw Ven.
      • Secret Entries. One from Axel's perspective mention that she sometimes appears to Roxas to him. Make of that what you will.
      • Actually, I'm pretty sure they said that Xion looked like Namine to him, and since they have different faces, I'm sure it was more that an different hair style thing.
  • Wait. Lea saw Ven in BBS but Roxas' appearance never surprise Axel in the least? How does that work?
    • "Hey, the new guy looks like that one kid I met eleven years ago for all of five minutes, amazing!"
      • One would assume that because he's so obsessed with memories as Lea AND Axel, he'd recognize Roxas as at least being vaguely similar to Ven
      • Remember two things: Isa says that Ven is far from the first "stray puppy" that Lea's picked up, and Lea says that he wants "everyone he meets to remember (him)." He's probably gone around making tons of friends. Again, he's not going to remember just one that he met for 5 minutes. Xigbar, meanwhile, was involved in an entire scheme that revolved around Ven.
      • BUT, if you wanted people to remember you, it would be stupid to forget them yourself. It would be awkward too. And he could have a diary, y'know.
    • Actually, Axel DID remember Ven. That's why he became interested in becoming Roxas' friend in the first place.
      • From what I see, Axel seems to keep things to himself, so he probably did remember, he just didn't show it.
  • I suppose this goes under Kingdom Hearts in general, but seeing as it's so prevalant in this one, why is it the Clock Tower in Twilight Town has no safety measures such as a railing or something similar at the top? I originally just wrote this off as Roxas and friends aren't allowed to be up there, but if they aren't, how do they get up there in the first place?
    • The way to access the tower was probably locked. Roxas and Co. unlocked it with their Keyblade. Axel either jumped it or the left the gate open.
      • Fair enough, but like i said, this applies to Kingdom Hearts in general, how did Roxas get up there in the intro of KH:II with Hayner and the rest, Pre-Keyblade? Also, was i the only one expecting someone to fall off it during the course of the games? For a Dream Sequence, at the very least.
      • DiZ never bothered to program the lock into virtual Twilight Town?
      • ^I'd probably go with that one, since DiZ wanted to distract Roxas long enough to finish work on Sora, so he might as well make Roxas feel at home as possible.
  • Why is it every scene with Xion switches whether her hood is on or not. I went through that 4-5 minute scene after you find her and Axel Roxas and Xion are eating ice cream and noticed it would switch to her having a hood on and her hood off every scene that showed her.
    • It depends on who's looking at her. When the camera perspective is 3rd person limited(Roxas) we see her the way he does, as a black-haired Kairi. When the camera perspective is 3rd person limited(anyone else), we see her the way they do, which is with the hood up. Situations where the camera focuses on the group as a whole seem to vary based on if focused on Roxas' reactions or the other guys' statements, the former fits to Roxas' perspective, the latter to others'. Its all a symptom of how what you see of her depends on your personal perspective and connection; Roxas sees Kairi (and Axel eventually follows suit after hanging with Roxas long enough), most of the rest see an empty doll with no notable features, and Xigbar sees Ventus.
  • What exactly is the Ruler of The Sky? And what's the deal with basically all of Pete's plans in this game? (And why didn't he recognise Roxas? I mean, he should have some memory of one of the people who contributed to his imprisonment.)
    • Giant Space Flea from Nowhere
      • Actually, Minnie got him banished, not Ven.
      • And the official timeline indicates that the "canon" banishment scene, involves Aqua, not Ven.
      • Also, Pete's an idiot.
  • Why would Captain Hook be afraid of the Heartless if he has controlled them before?
    • Because he found out that they were using him rather than the other way around, of course; he probably heard about what had happened to Malificent, and that caused him to become scared of the things.

  • I do wonder one thing though...if Tinkerbell was trying to get Roxas to go back to the main island(s) and rejoin the lost boys because she thought he was really Ventus, why didn't she eventually try getting Peter Pan to meet him there?
    • Because Tinkerbell isn't stupid, and knows that if he's hiding and skulking like he is, he probably has a reason, and she wants him to return on his terms; no point in forcing him back, which Peter probably would.
    • I don't think it's stated anywhere that Tinkerbell thought Roxas was Ventus. She might have but we don't get any dialog or reports hinting at that.
      • It isn't stated, but its very strongly implied, and is the only really logical conclusion- she is the only person Roxas meets that also met Ventus, she trusts him implicitly instantly, she isn't at all surprised about the Keyblade or fighting skill and in fact seems to know about it already, etc.
  • So apparently Xion isn't actually a nobody, but a doll crated by Xemnas. "Her face was based off of Sora's strongest memory, Kairi, but as NaminÚ pieced together Sora's memories, she began to physically look like Sora." Does this make her (him?) a boy/transvestite/futa/something other than a normal girl?
  • Wait, why did Sa´x send Roxas to hunt down Neoshadows in one of 358/2 Days's missions? Neoshadows are pureblood heartless, and don't drop hearts.
    • They may not drop hearts, but they do eat them. Every heart consumed by a Neoshadow is a heart lost to Orgy XIII and its artificial Kingdom Hearts.
      • Ah, that makes sense. It also occurs to me now why Emblems drop hearts in the first place; emblems are imperfect, artificial Heartless, so they can't consume hearts fully, like the purebloods can.
    • This troper would like to point to the mirror with "Neoshadows can kill too" Written in the scraps of black coats. THINK OF THE PREVIOUS NOBODIES!!!!
  • Wait... you can't drown a goldfish.
    • Sure you can. Most aquatic organisms require a certain amount of dissolved oxygen. Not enough dissolved oxygen, and the goldfish can drown just like you or me.
    • This bugs me for a different reason. It's a Noodle Incident that was never shown to happen in Birth By Sleep.
      • Rule of Funny.
      • I think he meant that he hated Ven's "You kicked my puppy" expression. As for why he said "Drowned your goldfish"'s Jerkass who knows.
  • I find it kind of odd that, over the course of 358/2 Days, the only grunt-level Nobodies that ever fight Roxas besides Dusks are Samurai; which are supposed to be Roxas's minions. True, most of those fights are actually to help Roxas, during training missions, but during Roxas's flight from the Castle, you'd think that they'd be the last ones to turn on him.
    • I'd simply say something like the Samurai were assigned to Roxas and weren't necessarily personally loyal to him (your superior would obviously change if your old one defected), but the personalities of the subordinate Nobodies is fuzzy at best; those Dusks in Twilight Town seemed to show him not just respect, but reverence.
      • It probably depends on who is commanding them at the time. Maybe at the spoilered time, Xemnas was commanding them, and his will overrode their natural obedience to High Nobodies. When Axel was commanding them, his friendship with Roxas exaggerated that natural obedience.
    • Nobodies, even the inhuman ones, are intelligent, but being emotionless, have no true loyalty. When the higher ups blacklisted Roxas, they followed orders.
    • Meh, the Sora vs Roxas fight was a Mind Screw from the beginning, don't think about it.
  • So what's Saix and Axel's relationship? Were they best buds before they lost their hearts and sorta became like Yuri and Flynn after they became nobodies and Joined Organization XIII?
    • It's heavily implied that they were friends - Saix actually knows Axel's true name (Lea).
      • New trailer for Birth By Sleep confirms they were friends back when they were Sora and co.'s age.
      • Symbolism-wise, the dualism of moon and sun.
  • I just realised something. Xion is a Replica not a nobody. The only other replica we've seen is Replliku. Repliku is mentioned to have a heart by himself and Larxene. Organization XIII uses the corridors of darkness to do interdimensional travel. So doesn't that mean that their essentially forcing Xion to expose herself to darkness when they send her on missions.
    • She seemed to be enough of an emotional blank (since everything she has is just cribbing off Sora and Kairi) to be mostly immune to dark corruption.
      • And the extremely justified Cloning Blues wouldn't set her apart emotionally from Sora and Kairi?
      • Well, she didn't have a heart, per say, seeing as she wasn't created to have one.
      • The cloaks Org. XIII members wear protect them from darkness.
      • About that, then why does Kairi jump through portals of darkness wearing what seems to be quite-ordinary clothes and come out looking completely fine? And at the end of the game, don't Donald and Goofy, etc. go into a darkness portal in order to get back home (thus leaving only Sora and Riku to defeat the REAL series of last bosses)?
      • Because it takes repeated exposure to start corrupting people?
      • That's reasonable... thanks for clearing that up.
      • Also, the Secret Ansem Reports state that portals of darkness are safe for people with no darkness in their hearts. Kairi's a Princess of Heart, so she wouldn't need protection.
  • It is implied that Saix (and possibly Axel) are plotting a coup against Xemnas. It's also stated that the keyblade wielders Roxas and Xion are the only ones(with Sora out of commission) who can collect hearts from Heartless to bring forth Kingdom Hearts. It does kind of beg the question as to why Saix is such a dick to both of them, since he could exert a huge amount of leverage on the Organization if he was able to manipulate the only two capable of completing Kingdom Hearts.
    • He's one of the most Nobody-like of the Organization. He probably can't process enough emotion to see any need to pull off that kind of manipulation.
      • But you think that the other members would want to try to manipulate one of them. Let's recap: at the start of the game, Roxas and Xion have no memories, and, by default, no personalities. They are the perfect pawns! You'd think someone, especially Marluxia, would think to try and mold them to their will to get theme to do what they want, but they don't! Xion is made to be a puppet, and they don't even act on that!
  • Why on Earth does Xion wear high heels? They are impractical for acrobatics (the Organization members need to jump alot) and they make loud sounds that ruin your stealth. I could go on but, seriously it REALLY bugs me.
    • Doesn't Larxene wear high heels too? Last I checked, she was VERY skilled in acrobatics.
      • This troper's guess? Sora remembers Larxene and her pointy heeled shoes of pain from when she kicked him in the gut in Castle Oblivion, and that translated into Xion wearing heels as well.
    • Have you ever tried moving around acrobatically in high heels?
    • What we see isn't what she is, but a variable appearance based on Sora's memories; her true form is a featureless doll wearing only an Organization robe. We see her as a her because the most dominant Sora memories were of Kairi; either he was very fond of one time he saw her in heels, or the heels were part of whatever Nobody appearence-warp resulted in her black hair. In any case, the heels are as much of an illusion as her breasts and hair are.
      • What breasts? Chest pads appear to be standard issue as part of the Organization robe, since Roxas has the same features on his.
    • Dude, it's fiction - in Fiction, women can actually function in high heels.
    • Also since they come with the coat, which has magical properties, they quite possibly don't conform to normal physics.
    • I'm amazed that on this wiki of Tropes nobody actually realised: Nobody or not, they are still affected by the Rule of Sexy and the Rule of Cool. Except because they have no emotions both rules are far more muted than usual. The latter is why the black coats have the unnecessary Silver trim on the beads and so forth. The former puts all the female members in heels as part of standard uniform. Xion's Default form is a blank doll Wearing the uniform, which took the standard female form once Xion started being "Her" and not "it". I think that explains it neatly. Alternatively, Xenmas made the heals part of the uniform because of his own memories of emotions, which probably tells us something about Xenahort's interests....
  • Most, or all, of Org. 13 cannot feel emotions right? Then why, or how, are they so darn good at it? What's the use in even saying that? An Excuse Plot? They act almost the same, if not exactly the same, as everyone else. If not they're more emotional.
    • I always compared it to when you learn a language. Even if you become fluent, if you, say, move away from the country where you used it ( fall to darkness), you forget most of it, but you still remember the words and phrases (emotions) you used the most (ie: you personality, or at least shreds of it).
    • I thought it was already stated (and in-game, no less) that they're only acting out what they think they should be "feeling" based on their human memories.
      • They are. But why make them so good at it that they don't seem any different from anyone else? What's the point in that comment? Why at times does it even not seem like acting? It feels too realistic.
      • They've had ten years to practice.
      • According to Dream Drop Distance, Nobodies are capable of regrowing hearts if they have been in said state for long enough, assuming this is correct, they're not completely emotionless, but their hearts aren't "advanced" enough for deeper feelings.
  • Why does Axel get the Assasin nobodies if Marluxia is the "Graceful Assasin"?
    • Because Axel is the Organization's assassin; Marluxia is the Grim Reaper.
      • Because Marluxia was dead by the time II came about. If not, they'd be in Marluxia's control while the Sorcerer ones based off of Xemnas would be in Zexion's control.
  • Everything the organization does seem to make no sense to me. In order to create Kingdom Hearts they need hearts and the only who could collect those in the Organization were Roxas and Xion. Than what the hell are the point of any of the other Organization members? I mean you can argue that their similarities attract one another, but than Xilian tries to turn Beast into an Nobody. Why do make him an nobody? Thats the complete opposite of your goal. And also when they figure out that Xion will either absorb or be absorbed by Roxas, they first idea is to have the two fight each other, to see which one are better for their plans? Why, why get rid of one of the two members who can actually do anything towards your goal? Their both seem to be doing fine collecting hearts as two different people, why half the rate of the number of hearts you will receive? Also why did Saix order Axel kill Marluxia and Larxene? They stopped an rebellion just so they can rebel? Why the hell don't they just join forces? Another thing, in KH2, why did the Organization line up to get stabbed by Sora? I can see that they fought him for at least some reason in KH:COM, but in KH2, there was no purpose. The best strategy at that point was to just send more heartless at him. More Dead Heartless = More Hearts, More Dead Nobodies = jacksh*t. The only logical explanation I can think of is that maybe they were trying to get Roxas back, but that's a terrible idea after 358/2 days, its not like he won't have his memories this time around, the only reason that happen before was because Sora came back to life, something that probably wouldn't happen again. If they took Sora's heart all that would result would be an angry Roxas, and than what? Literally not appear in front of the guy at all is a wonderful idea. One last thing, if a nobody leaves the organization, why kill him? I understand Roxas, as they really need him. But its hinted that anyone who leaves, dies, but the as I pointed out before, none of the other organization members are useful to they're goal at all.
    • Killing Heartless for hearts isn't all they do, you know. They multiple Organization members facilitate the spreading of Heartless so that Keyblade wielders can kill them. Plus, a huge amount of recon is required for their operations, along with other various jobs, such as when the devices were placed. Turning Beast into a Nobody would create a Heartless, probably a strong one, which they could then get Sora to kill in order to add to Kingdom hearts. As for Roxas and Xion? Remember, they couldn't exist at the same time. As Xion grew stronger, Roxas grew weaker. One was going to be erased no matter what the Organization did. So, they wanted to make sure they kept the stronger one. Why did Axel and Saix kill the rebels? Well, first of all, it's never entirely clear whether Saix cares about rebelling against the Organization anymore. Second, just because they all wanted to rebel doesn't mean that they wanted to share power or even deal with each other if they succeeded. The enemy of your enemy isn't always your friend. Why did they attack Sora? They didn't attack Sora. Sora attacked them (now, before I continue, I want to make it clear that I am not one of those fans who believe that Sora is a Jerkass who was viciously slaughtering the poor, poor Organization members who just wanted hearts). There was no indication that they would kill Sora, just fight him back long enough so that they could go one with their goals.
    • It's also revealed in Dream Drop Distance that the Organization was meant to be used as vessels for different pieces of Xehanorts heart, so it looks like Xemnas was just keeping them all busy.
  • Lexaeus: The Silent Hero. Somehow, being a member of Organization XIII doesn't seem very heroic.
    • To be fair ,though, Lexaeus was probably one of the more "innocent" (and I use that term lightly when talking about the Org.) members. He was one of the kinder members and he probably just wanted a heart. Plus, you could probably call him a hero for doing his job of being a guard during Birth By Sleep.

  • How is it that giant Heartless can be wandering around Twilight Town on a regular basis and the town is still somewhat normal? I mean, it explains why the town is so deserted while Roxas is there, but come on- there's giant monsters that eat people's hearts wandering around Market Street every month. Who would continue to live there, much less be able to work? On that note, why doesn't Riku think it's important to protect a quite inhabited town that is considerably lacking in terms of soldiers able to combat the Heartless?
    • Twilight Town experiences perpetual Dusk-Dawn. People would probably have had set curfews for "sleep" and didn't notice the Heartless, maybe the Organization sends mission during a world's nighttime?

  • This is something about Xion except it's a different nature. When Roxas was fighting her in her final form, did nobody in Twilight town look up and notice that there's a bigass Sora-wannabe in armour floating right in front of the train station with someone in black running back and forth attacking it?! And did nobody notice her attacks, either? I can understand if maybe They forgot because Xion was unofficially erased from everyone's memory, but wouldn't they remember seeing someone in black running up in the air swinging something at nobody? I can understand why people didn't notice The first three forms because they were in out-of-the-way locations, but that's in public...does Twilight Town have some kind of Sunnydale Syndrome going on?
    • Giant monsters that eat people's hearts are commonplace in Twilight Town. I'm betting the Monster Alarm went off and sent people scurrying for cover. Remember, only a few days prior a freaking DUSTFLYER was at the same station.
  • Okay, there's one thing that just bugs me a lot. There's one mission in Twilight Town where you chase who you initially think to be Riku in an Organization XIII cloak, occasionally whacking the mysterious figure with your Keyblade when it stops. After the mission (and note you HAVE to hit the figure, and quite a few times at that) it's revealed that you've actually been chasing Xion. The first thing Roxas does is exclaim "Xion!" in a happy tone. Now... Am I the only one who thinks he should have been either apologising, horrified or both that he was actually beating the crap out of her only seconds before? I mean, I reiterate you are REQUIRED to hit the figure multiple times, and yet Roxas seems to blatantly ignore that he's just been whacking the hell out of one of his best friends unknowingly with his Keyblade. I was expecting a sort of "Oh my god... I had no idea it was you, I'm so sorry!" line or something in the cutscene, not a "Xion, I'm so glad you're okay!".
    • I imagine that was a case of Gameplay and Story Segregation. While in the game you have to hit the figure a few times to start the cutscene, in the story Roxas was probably just constantly chasing after her until she stopped.
    • How could he not tell it was her though? Hood or no she's the only other one dressed like that who's the same height as him, and he said before he could tell from the other figure's build that he wasn't one of organization (not sure why he's so familiar with all his teammate's figures but go figure).
  • Okay, I might be missing something very trivial here, but when Roxas was escaping from the castle, why couldn't he have just, I dunno, summon a portal in his room and travel to some other world? It does make for a pretty awesome mission and beating the crap out of Saix is fun, but it still kinda bugs me.
    • I'm grasping here, but I think the Organization can track Dark Corridors.
    • Not technically game canon, but in the official KH Days novel he talks about how that method seems "more fit for an escapee." Guess he wanted to go out with a bang?
  • So what does Xemnas do for his day to day job in the Organization? Or does he just sit in his throne all day?
    • He probably tells Saix and likely Xigbar things that they need to do, at the same time working on his plans. And as of Kingdom Hearts Dream Drop Distance, it's revealed he was also setting up the Organization to become Xehanort's vessels.
  • This is just a question that I have. It really doesn't have any real outcome on the game but it would be nice to know. Can Xion age? If she lived much longer then she did would she grow up?
    • That depends on whether or not we know for sure if Nobodies can age, since she's based off of Roxas. Then there's to find out if Riku Replica could have aged.
  • Am I missing something that explains why Xion couldn't just toss herself off the clocktower? What's the point of forcing someone you supposedly care about through the physical and emotional pain of fighting and killing you? And why does she heal herself?
    • Blind guess, but maybe the memories work like the Hearts. It had to be a keyblade to force the lost memories back to their source, otherwise they might have faded away for good. The healing... not sure.

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