Ban-Evader Reversion Thread
Please read the outline below before proceeding any further.Important Note: This thread is devoted to reverting the edits of Tropers who have repeatedly chosen to evade their bans and suspensions, since serial ban-evasion is an act which is by its very nature a display of untrustworthiness, the fact that some ban-evaders outright engage in vandalism or add false information notwithstanding.
, due to the prolific nature of serial ban-evaders, there needs to be a team effort devoted to reverting any and all edits made by ban-evaders, especially serial ban-evaders, and investigating otherwise suspicious edits.
Depending on how much of the pages can be salvaged, they will either be noted in the B.E.R.T. Watch-List, locked if necessary, or cut if unsalvageable.
Any Frequently Vandalized Pages will also be monitored for suspicious activity.
If you notice a page is primarily edited by a certain ban-evader and/or their socks, please bring your findings to this thread so that cleanup can commence.
Potentially valid examples added by ban evaders should be transferred to Ban-Evader Example Rewrites so they can be salvaged. Make sure to mention transferring examples to the sandbox in your edit reason so others who may be willing to rewrite are aware.
Handling General Ban-Evader Edits:
To paraphrase what is stated here and here:
- Bad faith is not necessarily assumed with the contributions of first-time ban-evaders, and their contributions can simply be rephrased assuming they're accurate.
- Any serial (more than once) ban-evader cannot be taken at their word, so their contributions are subject to harsher scrutiny. Any verifiable examples can be reworded (especially if there are grammatical or formatting issues), but unverifiable, false, or otherwise prohibited edits are removed.
- Ban-evaders who deliberately contribute inaccurate or false information are able to have their contributions deleted with little hesitation.
- Rewording or reverting can be as simple as expanding on a ban-evader's existing edits, especially if it means adding sufficient context or trimming word cruft.
The subsequent portions of this section outline further how to handle different kinds of edits and contributions.
The following types of edits can be left alone to preserve wiki quality:
- Grammatical corrections.
- Spelling corrections.
- Formatting updates and corrections.note
- Crosswicked examples from other tropers.
- Indexing (if accurate).note
- Accurately written potholes.note
- Links to the correct Work/Recap/Instalment/Franchise page, including red-linked works.note
- Archive edits. (See here.)
- Launched Tropes.note
The following edits might need to be reworded in order to stay on the wiki, and depending on the examples, may need to be re-evaluated/verified in this thread or in the proper cleanup threads.
- Zero-Context Example expansion.
- Otherwise correctly formatted and valid edits.
The following edits should remain hidden until they can be verified, and deleted if proven inaccurate:
The following items must be sent to the cut-list/otherwise removed on principle (and if applicable, re-created by a trustworthy editor from scratch using a Sandbox):
- Pages created by ban-evaders using their socks.note
- Videos uploaded by ban evaders using their socks.note
- Please refrain from "popcorn posting". This means refraining making comments such as "man, they don't know when to quit", or otherwise unproductive posts.
- Please maintain an atmosphere of civility.
- Please do not withhold information about potential sock-puppetry or other ban-evasion related misconduct, as withholding such information makes one an accessory to ban-evasion.
- When reverting edits, please make notes in the sandboxes, and transfer any potentially valid edits to the appropriate sandbox.
- When reverting ban-evader edits, please use an appropriate (and civil) edit reason.
- Should you suspect a ban-evader has shown up in this thread, please do not make open accusations, trash-talk them, or engage in other uncivil behaviour. Quietly holler the post and wait for mod input; if necessary (especially if suspicious edits or issues unrelated to the forum are involved), make a query at "Ask The Tropers".
- Please respect the thread consensus once it has been established. If an item is resolved, it is usually resolved for a reason.
- If you have any suggestions for new policies, or wish to contest an old one, do it in the General Policy Discussion, not here.
Edited by SkyCat32 on Apr 13th 2024 at 10:23:58 AM
The Draftsman of Doom
This post was thumped by the Stick of Post Thumping
the Retromancer
Personally don't know any evaders elsewhere than those two.
Edited by Amonimus on Oct 20th 2022 at 3:53:02 PM
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
The Draftsman of Doom
Pretty sure our "zce" obsessed friend has visited the Unreleased Work Cleanup at least once. It's not just cleanup threads I am worried about. It's any forum where there is a particular topic.
Edited by SkyCat32 on Oct 20th 2022 at 8:56:16 AM
Rawr.
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
And others. I've looked at HC's socks' forum activity and not only does he post in the Unreleased Work cleanup, he also posts in other threads like Is this an example?. I believe 4tell0life4's socks have also participated in the forums—prior to being banned 4tell was active in Trope Talk and I think TRS.
While I like the idea of a forum watch list, I'm not sure how we would implement it. Just watch certain forum threads for possible socks? I know that the recent CM/MB Wiki Talk thread has been discussing an overly aggressive approach to that as applied to Utter Koala socks that created problems. We would need to make sure that whatever standard we implement does not become too aggressive like that one did.
Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Oct 20th 2022 at 9:09:31 AM
TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
The Draftsman of Doom
Maybe we should get ~MacronNotes to give some input on this.
4tell also liked the Honkai and Genshin fora, IIRC.
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
One of his (4tell's) socks, Coconutkirin, did visit one or both of those fora.
Edited by SkyCat32 on Oct 20th 2022 at 9:20:12 AM
Rawr.
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
FWIW I found HC's most recent sock by checking the Unreleased Work cleanup, since I know his socks show up there, so there is merit to the idea, hence why I said I liked the idea.
Perhaps a mod weighing in would be good—though admittedly I'm not sure what Macron could really do here. Maybe let us know if this is a good idea?
Good to know. We should check to see if his socks showed up in those threads as well.
Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Oct 20th 2022 at 9:15:35 AM
TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
Lost in Space
I don't have any really great suggestions about that. HC watches this thread, of course, so he knows what we're doing to stop him.
Catching dumb ban evaders is easy because they have no idea how to hide their behavior. Sayaka, for example, may be very annoying and persistent but they always do exactly the same thing if they get an account through our checks. Catching smart ones is hard because they understand how to use dynamic IP networks, age accounts, etc., and because they subtly build up to their actions rather than jump right in.
It's still a ridiculous amount of effort to go to, and these people are still fixated on whatever got them banned, so they eventually give themselves away. If they were capable of following rules or willing to obey consensus, they wouldn't be banned to begin with.
Edited by Fighteer on Oct 20th 2022 at 9:20:00 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
edit: Also good to know. Perhaps if we do monitor threads we can keep an eye on those—one thing I sometimes do with HC socks is I look for a HC-like posting style. HC had a specific way of talking that I find his socks often have—it's hard to explain what it is but I know HC enough that I can tell when it's him. That's how I found one of his socks—he said in the OBC cleanup, in response to a post of mine, "we trope works, not people", something I remember HC saying a lot.
I'm aware he watches this thread. I think it's OK to talk about his exploits because while a troper with more control over their behavior would learn from what we're saying, HC always goes back to doing the same thing that got him banned, so I doubt he'll stop any time soon.
Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Oct 20th 2022 at 9:20:45 AM
TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
The Draftsman of Doom
Fighteer: Are you saying the watchlist is, or isn't worthwhile?
Fair enough.
Edited by SkyCat32 on Oct 20th 2022 at 9:32:42 AM
Rawr.
Lost in Space
SkyCat, you don't need to ping us, send PMs, or Holler these conversations. As you can clearly tell, we are following the threads and are aware of what's being discussed. This isn't drop-everything urgent.
There is no technical capability to put someone on a "forum watchlist", and every time we've tried to keep track of ban evaders in a private moderator thread it's been poorly maintained and ultimately didn't help. I am a bit leery of maintaining a public list, first because it sounds like we're shaming people and second because it invites witch hunts.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
NGL...I really don't like the idea of a 'watch list.' Catching ban evaders is usually simple, and should be done when you see them. Actively trying to hunt them down and breeding paranoia seems less than productive.
The Draftsman of Doom
These are all fair concerns. I am afraid I may have been more discomposed by recent forum activity than I thought. I withdraw my suggestion.
Rawr.
(she/her)
Since I was pinged, I'll respond (although I thought have much to say). I don't think forum list is needed and like Fighteer said, I don't want to startbwitch hunts for new tropers. HC's socks forum behavior isn't suspicious on its own; it's a combination of certain factors that make them suspicious.
Edited by MacronNotes on Oct 20th 2022 at 9:43:08 AM
Macron's notes
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
Hearing everyone's arguments, I'll drop my case for it. I was concerned about how it would be enforced anyway.
Is it still alright for me to personally monitor the Unreleased Works thread in case HC shows up again? Like I said, HC has a certain way of talking that makes me suspicious when I see it.
Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Oct 20th 2022 at 10:01:46 AM
TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
the Retromancer
I think people can do whatever they want privately, just make sure the "potential sock" argument would be really solid before hollering, because false flags were one of the reasons CM/MB thread got locked.
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
(she/her)
What you choose to do with your time is up to you.
Macron's notes
The Draftsman of Doom
I mean, if their mannerisms are too similar and there are other patterns, I suppose it doesn't hurt to check.
In any event, since I have evidently let certain things within this thread stress me out exponentially more than they should, I am considering taking a hiatus from this particular thread, at least, for the time being. Until I return, if any more adjustments to the header need to be made, ask a mod to make the changes in question.
Edited by SkyCat32 on Oct 20th 2022 at 10:06:16 AM
Rawr.
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
Oh absolutely. Sorry if I didn't clarify—when I find a HC sock through the forums, I always check the edits for HC-like behavior (which there usually is). That's what I meant—sorry I wasn't clear.
The Guss, Catdog, and Solsun were discovered to be sockpuppets of each other. Revert away.
Per this ATT, TV Troper 2018 is a sock of maddiellabie. Feel free to revert.
The Draftsman of Doom
Interrupting my hiatus to note that I have reverted Sol's Edmund Blackadder edits.
Rawr.
The Draftsman of Doom
Per EB investigation, Cooking Cat is a sock.
Revert what you can, people. With any luck, other tropers will have already altered some of their work beyond recognition anyways.
Also, Deacon 911 is an H Barnill sock as noted here. Revert as needed.
Edited by SkyCat32 on Oct 27th 2022 at 10:35:27 AM
Rawr.
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
Another ban evader.
Deacon 911 is H Barnill ban evading. Revert away.
EDIT: NVM, already got it
Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Oct 27th 2022 at 12:32:33 PM
TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
the Retromancer
tvtroper20 in EB bluntly says they're going to ban-evade if they're not unsuspended, so it may be something to watch out for.
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
EDIT: Whoops, pagetopper. Was responding to this post
.
Edited by Cutegirl920fire on Oct 19th 2022 at 7:03:50 AM
Victor of HGS S320 | "There's rosemary, that's for remembrance. Pray you, love, remember."