Blazblue: Cross Tag Battle

They both have mediocre story modes and relatively small, derivative casts, but really solid gameplay otherwise.

Half of this game's cast is behind a paywall and all the really solid newcomers are DLC in Infinite. Neither's a home run in my book.

The difference is in presentation. You can feel however you want about the whole DLC debacle, but Arcsys at least addressed it compared to Capcom, who just swept their issues under the rug.

If BBTAG wasn't anymore popular than Marvel, they would have never put it in over Infinite regardless of the reception and yet...here we are.

In what way did they address it? The RWBY girls were made free and for the first couple of weeks you could get 3 of the other 18 pre-existing characters for free.

So even if you did that (which is another one of those pre-order, buy-an-incomplete-game-on-release schemes the game industry loves) that's still 15 recycled sprites you have to pay for if you want the whole roster. The only addressing they did was draw attention away from it with a dub announcement.

The game was also announced for EVO before it was even close to being released and is confirmed to of bombed in Japan, so it's actual popularity is a little skewed.

What you just mentioned is still far more than what Infinite did though, which is the point we're on right now. Capcom saw the negative reception and just abandoned Infinite altogether, while Arcsys stuck by TAG despite the controversy.

Yes, the game hasn't sold well but fighting games never sell that well anyway, so that's a moot point. Fighting games have always thrived through exposure from it's competitive community at tournaments events and the fact that its exceeded Smash 4 of all games is telling.

I really don't feel like arguing this with you because you're stubbornly negative about this but that's really not a justification to say TAG is a flop that nobody cares about when there's blatant evidence to the contrary. Especially as somebody who is actively playing it with people around me and across the country.

Edited by BlackYakuzu94 on Jul 6th 2018 at 1:40:25 PM

All I'm arguing in this instance is against the now very tired narrative that Marvel Infinite is the worst fighting game ever made. It's really not, and this game really isn't that much better than it when taken as a whole, DLC aside.

Obviously Marvel Infinite did a whole lot of things wrong, but there are numerous reasons for why, some more justified than others. This game also did numerous things wrong, and for whatever reason a lot more people are willing to forgive it for its shortcomings than they are Infinite's despite several of those being behaviors consistent with the company responsible for them - in Capcom's case standards were quite high, so I can at least understand why people would jump down their throats, but just imagine if Dragon Ball Fighterz confirmed 20 characters were being held back as DLC, though. Arc Sys can treat their customers better than they have with this game.

We don't have any indication it will be supported for much longer than Infinite was or for much longer than most other Arc Sys games for that matter, either and with it failing in the country traditionally most in love with Blazblue I think it's especially unlikely.

Edited by Hashil on Jul 6th 2018 at 11:46:37 AM

Here's the thing; Arcsys have a much better track record because their games are just that damn good that most people are willing to overlook some of their more questionable practices. Biases exist, don't know what to say. Not too many years ago, the reverse was true. People forgave Capcom for shit everyone accused Arcsys of, the shoe is simply on the other foot now.

No Marvel Infinite isn't the worse game ever, but Capcom was already on a slippery slope with the gaming community as a whole after their mishandling of their franchises for years and Infinite was just the logical conclusion of that.

Yes BBTAG also had questionable business practices, but people were willing to give them the benefit of the doubt because had already understood their penchant for making good games. Dragon Ball also got a lot of shit for the Season Pass fiasco and that quickly blew over, and even despite the game itself being heavily flawed overall, the gameplay itself has been greatly received and that's the part people care about. Same with this game.

You can hate on all of the "DLC, shitty practices, reused assets etc etc etc" but a good game is a good game regardless of that. I don't care that BBTAG uses those things because the game is still fun regardless, and I'm sure there are plenty of people who don't care about Infinite's problems because the game is also fun.

And we already know there are more characters coming for BBTAG in just a few months beyond the current DLC, so yes...Arcsys do plan on supporting it for a while.

Infinite also got its share of DLC post launch, same as Dragon Ball. There's nothing to indicate it'll get anywhere near how much support something like Street Fighter V has seen, though.

I'm willing to bet Dragon Ball won't either, so that's just not how Arc Sys operates normally, but we'll see.

TAG is a spin off of Blazblue and they're not even the main publishers of Dragon Ball.

So I'm pretty sure they're waiting to release a new Guilty Gear and Blazblue.

Infinite got six pre-planned DLC characters, two of which were allegedly planned for the base roster but cut for DLC, a wave of costumes, and then complete radio silence for six month as the game was removed from the two biggest tournaments it was involved with, as it's reputation sank to the bottom. It's not likely to get any more DLC. The DLC characters also added about $30 to $40 to the full price base game, something even BBTAG didn't do.

Infinite may not have been the worst fighting game ever, but what it represented was the culmination of all of Capcom's greed, lack of effort and obsession with eSports over a general audience. About three major releases of bad will, with Ultimate Marvel vs Capcom 3 (Looked back on fondly, but lambasted at the time for how quick the release was from the vanilla game) Street Fighter X Tekken and Street Fighter V. With that, and the leaked eSports proposal (Suggested to be a big reason why EVO dropped them from the main stage) people had reached the end of their patience with Capcom.

Edited by Emperordaein on Jul 7th 2018 at 4:45:10 AM

RIP Ms Marvel if the leak was true.

@ agent-trunks

There are indeed many good characters from the four franchises here, but what's four franchises when put side by side with 2 major companies? That's what I meant by "entirety".

Yea, I don't recall ever recall this ever happening. I've never seen people forgiving or give any leeway to Capcom for half the crap they've done. Especially when it came to the Mega Man franchise. If Capcom release an expansion port, they sure as hell make it clear they thought it was a dick move. Granted, the same was done with Arcsyst but it wasn't nearly as vocal since Capcom is the bigger company. It wasn't until Fighterz that people became more vocal about their bs they're pulling.

That pretty much summed up the reception on how well MVC 3 advertised. There was still plenty of thing that were controversial with MVC 3 it was handled better in comparison to Infinite.

Wow, completely misread that one altogether. Wouldn't be the 1st time I felt this stupid.

Hashil has the best critics in my opinion, really. Especially when he points the hypocrisy out. The part where he says people forgive Arc System for shit similar to what Capcom has done with Marvel vs. Capcom: Infinite.

People gush on this crossover only because it is not Marvel Vs. Capcom Infinite. That was nearly the exact same logic applied to Dragon Ball Fighter Z. By now, all I see is only an excuse to hit the dead horse Capcom's game has become in what, less than six months? And after all, why is Arc System Works a saint, given everything that happened since the Central Fiction dub fiasco?

Don't think people's patience with Arc System is any much better. Mori worn these people out over the years, this crossover is just a culmination of the whole mess. In my case, you could say my patience with this man is beyond gone. And I couldn't give any less of a damn for the game's price unless it's an emulated collection like Mega Man X Legacy Collection; I only care about a game's content and quality.

For an extra, Capcom isn't 100% to blame for MvC:I; Marvel had a huge hand on it thanks to their Executive Meddling forcing the MCU down our throats while shafting the X-Men and the Fantastic Four. Both companies had their hand on the massive flop it was.

This crossover is also one case I've been accusing the whole industry for some time now: EVO Rushed. Games are now rushed to appear on big tournaments where they think they can make money rather than by selling the games (Worked a bit, and only a bit, for Street Fighter V ^note And even then the game suffered because of this, but what about other games?). Hashil himself pointed it out; how come a game is announced to be on the biggest fighting game competitive tournament before it is even released? It's funny how people refuse to acknowledge Arc System is not the same company that made the first BlazBlue anymore.

Edited by ZeroDozer on Jul 7th 2018 at 12:33:28 PM

Y Ou sure about the critics part?

Luigi, I didn't understand that one.

I edited the post to make my opinion clearer, as usual.

Edited by ZeroDozer on Jul 7th 2018 at 12:32:34 PM

Depends on who these 'people worn out' that you refer to. For the most part, there is one thing in BlazBlue that people do not complain about and that's the gameplay. If you want to play a game, the first thing you will look after would be their gameplay. Of course, merely gameplay isn't enough. Other contents are also important. But for the most part, if the game plays really good and goes about as expected, it's mostly fine and dandy. While BlazBlue might be derided as 'a watered down Guilty Gear', it was still overall enough to carry the day without resorting to 'Pay To Win'. And in that department, Mori certainly doesn't worn out those who wants solid gameplay.

So you're just half-right with worn out fans. Maybe if they're worn out with favoritism with a certain character or the story getting way too convulted shit or your favorite topic of 'no dub in CF'... yes, they may be worn out. But the gameplay crowd? Nope, they feel fine... I think.

Arcsys didn't draw enough ire because it wasn't as big as Capcom, and aside of MVCI, Capcom has had a history of mishandling some of its franchises. The combination of 'bigger popular target to ridicule' and MVCI made them more probable to be mocked at.

Edited by ChrisX on Jul 7th 2018 at 10:49:00 PM

I agree that Capcom has had a seven-year history of killing their own franchises, but when people keep praising the crossover, they're all like, comparing it to MvC:I, just like they were doing with DBFZ.

It pisses me that Arc System makes huge mistakes and is still put on a high pedestal.

Edited by ZeroDozer on Jul 7th 2018 at 1:14:29 PM

People DO give Arcsys shit for their mistakes, what? But just as many people would prefer to just play their games, because yes, gameplay is the primary reason play video games and that's the part people generally focus on.

If you're still pissy about the dub, that's honestly your problem because there are people who don't care about that stuff either.

Edited by BlackYakuzu94 on Jul 7th 2018 at 12:25:26 PM

I don't think anyone is putting ASW on high pedestal. When the DLC fiasco happened... they HEAVILY SHIT ON ASW. It's just that ASW has had enough sense to apologize and fix things. Though probably better not to remember the CF dub fiasco again. I mean, it feels like even if they want to fix it, it's kind of too late.

No one is going to insult you for playing the game, therefore just go ahead and try the game (or go play CF) instead of mulling over the lack of dub and your preference got passed. It won't hurt, trust me.

I mean, take it from me. The lack of you-know-who is really tempting me to not touch Cross Tag as a protest, but I ended up having fun with other faves offered (though I will still refrain on the PS 4 version)

Also... DBZ, big as it is, is just one franchise by Toei, who also had other stuffs like the whole Tokusatsu business and Precure. Comparing it to Capcom, which had MANY franchises, AND Marvel, who also had many superhero series... Well, just DBZ alone is less risky when it comes to screw up backlashes.

Ah yes. That, too! Though I thought it was just the mistake of one stupid Capcom marketing division guy that should get sacked.

Edited by ChrisX on Jul 7th 2018 at 11:33:03 PM

The key is ASW made efforts to fix complaints such as free DLC. I don't remember anyone saying Guilty Gear characters are just    functions   . Sure ASW is still doing shady shit, but they have not failed to do anything to win back support unlike MVCI.

Edited by Mizerous on Jul 7th 2018 at 12:31:56 PM

But Combofiend got sacked.

It's not too late for fixing shit. Yoshinori Ono and Hajime Tabata did it with their games, after all.

And you know I'd rather go blind than play the crossover.

Edited by ZeroDozer on Jul 7th 2018 at 1:39:14 PM

Depending on the person, 'winning back support' will vary.

Still, it is more than can said for MVCI. Hell Street Fighter V was a disaster at launch, but they did not drop that game.

Combofiend didn't decide the roster, Capcom and Marvel did.

Arc Sys didn't fix anything. They gave out 5 characters for free, 3 of which you had to pick the game up ASAP for, announced a dub, and continued to sell the other 15 as if nothing happened. Acknowledging people are unhappy you're doing a shitty thing and than putting a ribbon on it is not fixing the fact that you're doing a shitty thing.

Edited by Hashil on Jul 7th 2018 at 10:41:19 AM