Thor: Ragnarok

(2) That's... pffffffft.... alright then.

Ohhhhh.

• It seems like we're getting an introduction to Skurge as a future antagonist here. I remember him being a boss in Marvel Ultimate Alliance. Hmm. Guess not. At least he went out like a badass.
• Hulk and Valkyrie's friendship puts a smile on my face.
• What did the Grandmaster mean when he brought up how time passes differently on Sakaar?
• Why did Korg and the rest of the prisoners come to help Asgard again? And how did they steal a ship that could survive the Devil's Anus? I thought the Grandmaster's ship was the one Valkyrie went after, despite it being a leisure ship, specifically because it could survive the trip?
• So Odin pulling a Mufasa and motivating Thor is cool and all but... well what's he saying to Thor when Thanos shows up and murders the rest of the Asgardians?
• So Dr. Strange beats his villain by trapping him in a time loop, and Thor beats his by siccing an even bigger monster on her. Nice.
• If I hadn't already seen Infinity War that scene halfway through the credits really would have got to me.
• What happened to Valkyrie and Korg in Infinity War? I'm assuming they were killed?
• If Heimdall can see everything that's coming then did he know Thanos was coming?

They stole the Grandmaster's pleasure craft because Loki had the codes for it.

• What did the Grandmaster mean when he brought up how time passes differently on Sakaar?
  • Just sort of an all-purpose Hand Wave to cover for various MCU time discrepancies.
• Why did Korg and the rest of the prisoners come to help Asgard again? And how did they steal a ship that could survive the Devil's Anus? I thought the Grandmaster's ship was the one Valkyrie went after, despite it being a leisure ship, specifically because it could survive the trip?
  • It's a big bulky freighter. It probably can survive it just fine, but it's slower and would've been picked apart if the Grandmaster's guards weren't sidetracked by a whole revolution thing. Thor probably could've used it if he had a big enough crew and already deposed the Grandmaster but time was of the essence.
• So Odin pulling a Mufasa and motivating Thor is cool and all but... well what's he saying to Thor when Thanos shows up and murders the rest of the Asgardians?
  • "Uh... maybe you should try being the God of Axe-Hammers?"
• What happened to Valkyrie and Korg in Infinity War? I'm assuming they were killed?
  • Word of God is Thanos only killed half the refugees. Valkyrie in particular led the survivors to the escape pods.
• If Heimdall can see everything that's coming then did he know Thanos was coming?
  • Can see=/=does see. If he chooses to see something, he does. It doesn't mean he takes in everything in the universe at the same time.

The reason why the gladiators show up to help Asgard is because Loki suggested it. Possibly they had nothing better to do or possibly they just felt indebted for Thor kicking off the revolution.

In regards to Heimdall, a good point is how in IM 2 he completely missed Jane finding the Aether, and only even noticed her disappearance well after the fact because Thor encouraged him to look at her.

Not well after the fact. Immediately after the fact. That was one of my favorite scenes, because it highlights how his omniscience works. He's standing there, watching Jane, because he's been doing that for a while as a favor to Thor. Then Thor walks up and they get to talking. Heimdall looks away for a moment, then looks back and has a low-key freak out because Jane went missing in the two seconds he wasn't looking at her.

Hey, the comics are back to emphasizing that Hela is definitely Loki's daughter and not constructed from his imagination. Again it makes me wish that Hela could have been made Loki's daughter and Karnella instead could have been MCU Loki and Thor's long lost sister. I mean Karnella could have coerced Hela to strike back at Asgard for her and her sibling mistreatment.

I always got the impressions Asgardians aged at the same rate as humans, just stretched over a longer period of time. If Loki were to have a daughter, I'd assume she would still have to be a child at this point. And yes, I'm aware that's not the case in Norse mythology. In the comics, she's apparently the daughter of a previous incarnation of Loki, but I don't see anything in the MCU that suggests the Asgardians go through reincarnation or anything like that.

Of course, now I have this mental image of a version of the film where Hela is played by a little girl, but she's just as evil and badass as the one we got. Like, imagine an eight-year old Hela being the one to destroy Mjolnir. That would've been amazing to witness.

That would've made her a hel of a lot more interesting.

Well, maybe not reincarnation exactly, but there's the part where Thor lost the same eye as his dear departed Allfather. I kind of hope Asgard has some weird cyclical thing going on in the MCU. That'd be alright.

Just a girl and her giant wolf-monster.

Hela being a kid in the MCU due to Loki being "young" in Asgard years would've been an interesting turn. Kid villains can actually be pretty rad if done right, though this isn't the first superhero media in recent times to eschew the possibility by going for an adaptation of a character that's largely unrelated to their original concept. Arrow basically did the same thing with Damien Darkh.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Aug 30th 2018 at 6:35:48 AM

Well, more accurately a girl and her wolf brother. Also add in the Midgard serpent for fun. One thing that is a big plot hole with making Hela their sister is that you still have mythology that has Hela being Loki's daughter, even though they have never heard of her before. Unless, Loki has a daughter already and she unknowingly named after her imprisoned aunt and became the current guardian of hel.

Also like I said if they needed a female villain, who was also their sister they could have had Karnella, but Hel would still be there and be a kid. Hel in contrast with Karnella, could be an Anti-Villain and Karnella could have been the original heir who was going around conquering with Odin.

Edited by firewriter on Aug 31st 2018 at 12:45:44 PM

Myths are simply that, myths.

They are just legends & stories which change over time with constant new ways of telling & additions whether sensical or nonsensical.

Just because things don’t line up exactly with stories a thousand years old doesn not constitute a plot hole.

Thor’s supposed to be a redhead yet he’s blonde here in a culture where blondes were thought to be looked down upon as feminine & untrustworthy. Clearly in the MCU the myths have gotten a couple things wrong.

Edited by slimcoder on Aug 31st 2018 at 12:55:13 PM

Well, a lot of Marvel fans prefer Hela being her daughter, with many fan fictions going AU with it.

https://archiveofourown.org/works/15261261/chapters/36774282

Here is one that I am currently following that has her as a teenager (Or the Aesir equivalent of it). I just at heart just love the idea of Loki having a daughter who just takes after him or dotes on.

I think because with Hela they actually kept her being Loki's daughter in the comics.

Edited by firewriter on Aug 31st 2018 at 12:59:43 PM

And I don’t care what fans prefer so that’s irrelevant to me honestly.

The movie came out, she’s not his daughter & I’m like “Alright so that’s that.” I’m more interested in why Asgard is barren of an actual Pantheon.

And I’m not sure what the comics have to do with this, the movies generally do their own thing.

Edited by slimcoder on Aug 31st 2018 at 1:04:42 AM

Making Loki’s daughter the villain would not have kept the theme of dealing with Asgard’s original sin and contextualizing its prophesied destruction. It’d just be “oops Loki screwed up again.”

I do wonder if Jack Kirby paid attention to Norse mythology more then Thor would have had redhead and a beard. Then again in recent years, Thor at least has a beard which at least makes him more mythological inspired. In fact, these days it's more common to see him with the beard than clean shaven than he was in past decades. I think they really should make the beard a permanent feature of him.

Well, like I said before, they could have had another character like Karnella fulfill the role of the long lost daughter. And the anti-colonial theme could still be there.And Karnella would have tried to manipulate Hela for her own purposes. Hela's imprisonment could have been seen as a fault of Odin since in Norse mythology the punishments done to Loki's children became a self fulfilling prophecy in hidnsight.

Edited by firewriter on Aug 31st 2018 at 1:12:52 AM

Too bad they don't have one who can replace Hela as Odin's first born... Oh wait they do http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Aldrif_Odinsdottir_(Earth-616).

Edited by Ikedatakeshi on Aug 31st 2018 at 4:10:27 PM

I’d prefer just making up a brand new character than ever using Angela.

Now that’s a good reason.

Too much Loki was a big complaint of Dark World.

Personally I think reinterpreting a character would be more pragmatic than using one with her own potential storyline. She even became queen of Hel once. Not to mention they're probably never going to use Heven(I did not misspell that) and the angels thing.

Edited by Ikedatakeshi on Aug 31st 2018 at 4:18:41 PM

One thing I still wonder is why haven't Marvel made Angrboda, Loki's baby mama/wife, apart of the comics' rogue gallery. She appears briefly in one moment and then never is heard from again. Just think of how much of a badass on and off romantic partner she would be to Loki in the comics.

http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Angerboda_(Earth-616)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AngrboB0a

Just imagine her in the MCU universe, I could see her wrecking things and taking names.

Also we have to wonder when Amora is going to show up because she has to at some point.

@slimcoder

http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Karnilla_(Earth-616)

Again Karnilla the Norn as a canidate.

Edited by firewriter on Aug 31st 2018 at 1:19:48 AM

Just saying it is way too late to give Loki any kids.

He & Thor are never mentioned having any children (becuase they are the immortal equivalent of 20 year olds) so having Loki’s daughter suddenly show up & also reveal that Odin had her imrpisoned for whatever reason would be just bizarre story-wise.

As said they simply chose the pragmatic option & reintepreted the character to better fit the story.

They chose Hella because she has status & the look, simple as that. No one else had the status & look they were looking for.

Edited by slimcoder on Aug 31st 2018 at 1:21:08 AM

@slimcoder

Well, the Hela in the movie's interpretation is already insane and Odin imprisoned her.

Never before features or relatives showing has been a feature in the movies as well.

Edited by firewriter on Aug 31st 2018 at 1:21:56 AM

Would it even be necessary for it to be Odin's kid? What about Cul Borson, his brother, who he also tried to wipe memories of his existence away, this time by killing humans that remembered him? Not to mention being the rightful heir to the throne before Odin. Just twist it slightly to him originally agreeing with him and then you get pretty much the same thing.

It makes sense with Odin, he’s an old-ass motherfucker so you can buy him having a hidden first born.

Loki is a young God & is no philanderer. Dark World shows that the only person he cared for was his mother & he never bothers to mention any kids.

Plus a reveal that Odin imprisoned his kid would be at odds with how devoted Loki is to Odin in the first movie. Why would Loki love his father if he was screwed over horribly by him?

I wouldn’t mind that. Is he the Fear Itself event villain?

Edited by slimcoder on Aug 31st 2018 at 1:31:46 AM