Madness in Mali

Because Chad does not want an Islamist (an ideology bent on expansion) state on its own doorstep. The French are probably keeping them around because, of all the African forces available, Chad's are likely the most switched on.

Schild und Schwert der Partei

Makes sense. Any good progress the African troops are making?

For Glorious Sociopathy! Peace Through Firepower! My Halo/ Foz crossover fic http://www.fanfiction.net/s/7082058/1/Spartan_of_Zero

As for the costs, French ops have much, much lower costs than US ones. For Libya, the total cost for 6 months of air war, involving a nuclear carrier, a sub, half a dozen or more frigates and dozens of top-tier aircrafts regularly bombing and doing recon flights was around 300 million euros, so around 400 million US dollars. OTOH, the US spent more than a billion.

Here, from wiki:

Country Funds Spent By

United Kingdom $336–$1,500 million USD September 2011 (estimate)

United States $896 – $1,100 million USD October 2011[235][236][237][238][239]

Italy $700 million USD October 2011[240]

France $450 million USD September 2011[241][242]

Turkey $300 million USD July 2011[243]

Denmark $120 million USD November 2011[244]

Belgium $58 million USD October 2011[245]

Spain $50 million USD September 2011[246]

Sweden $50 million USD October 2011[247]

Canada $26 million USD June 2011[248]

One of the reasons of such a difference is, for example, the US overreliance on cruise missiles. Each shot costs you between 500,000 to 1,500,000 US dollars, and the initial salvo used 110 of them. OTOH, the French simply sent Rafales before any cruise missile was shot and used the self-defense ECM suite to say LOLNO to the Libyan SAM systems without any additional expense, while each plane could terminate six targets or more in a single mission.

Add to that the proximity of France or French bases to its operation zones (there are bases in every continent in the world, IIRC) and the costs are reduced. But it's more likely the US going in with everything, especially the most expensive tools that are not required. They sent frakking B-2 from the CONUS! When you start using planes that cost almost as much as an Aegis destroyer for 10,000 km or more trips, the costs are obviously going to be higher than with 15 ton fighter-bombers on a 2,000 km or so trip. For UK, it was similar: use of cruise missiles and flying planes all the way from home (no carriers in the RN).

In Mali, the initial attack that stopped the jihadists was done with two helicopters that are more like a Huey than an Apache (Gazelle, here). The result was that we sadly lost a pilot, but the guys in front lost enough vehicles that they got afraid and turned back, allowing the other forces to reach Mali and start kicking ass.

From what I've heard, European forces are much more tactical than the US ones, for a simple reason of necessity. If you're a US commander, you have access to tons of tactical support, from artillery to MLRS, gunships, drones, bombers, everything, while with the Euros, you have much less, thus a training to do the job with what we have.

WRT Chad, their president is working with us because it gives him good guy points with the UN and, most importantly, lets him appear as an element of stability in the region. Noone cares about the fact that someone there is a dictator as long as:

1) Said guy wants to preserve the status quo in the region. 2) Doesn't cause too many problems with the Big Guys. 3) Manages to not be too obvious when doing bad things.

He knows that if his country falls to anarchy, a good part of the Sahel and Africa will follow. And he knows that we know. He gives us some needed help, gets some legitimacy, gives us some legitimacy (by having African troops fighting alongside the Legion). Everyone wins on this one.

Except AQMI.

edited 11th Mar '13 7:12:42 AM by RufusShinra

As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero.

I think you meant AQIM: Al-Qaida in the Islamic Maghreb.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.

AQIM for you, AQMI for us (Al-Qaeda au Maghreb Islamique). We use this acronym so often in our news that I use it all the time too. And, well, the area is francophone enough for this one to also have some weight too.

As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero.

Fair enough.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.

Just saw in a Le Monde article that the costs of the operation were above 100 million euros, so it seems my previous estimation was wrong. In the same article is indicated that the government wants to let the UN take over.

As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero.

Confirmation of Abou Zeid's death. He was one of AQIM/AQMI top leaders. The confirmation came after DNA testing on one of the corpses:

http://www.lemonde.fr/afrique/article/2013/03/23/confirmation-de-la-mort-d-abou-zeid_1853073_3212.html (in french)

As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero.

Heavy fighting in Timbuktu recently ended, government and French forces are searching house-to-house now. On the one hand, it was described as pretty heavy fighting; on the other, casualty rates were surprisingly low, if the preliminary figures can be trusted.

Charlie Stross's cheerful, optimistic predictions for 2017, part one of three.

Malian authorities will give French President Francois Hollande another camel after the one they gave him in thanks for helping repel Islamist rebels was killed and eaten by the family he left it with in Timbuktu

edited 10th Apr '13 12:55:06 AM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016

They gave him a camel... Anyone else getting Tropico 4 flashbacks?

"And the Bunny nails it!" ~ Gabrael "If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we." ~ Cyran

i'm a little more shocked by the line at the end.

"Last week, a robber chainsawed a tusk off the skeleton of an elephant offered to Louis XIV by a Portuguese king in 1668. Police caught the robber as he fled, tusk under his arm."

I'm baaaaaaack

That's kind of badass in a very Jack Ass way.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.

more jackass than anything, personally.

I'm baaaaaaack

Let's compromise and call it "dramatic".

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.

Sounds more like "hijinks" to me... I can see the guy running down the street, tusk under one arm, police in pursuit, like a looney tunes character...

"We learn from history that we do not learn from history."

—coughs—

Right, so, things are pretty much wound down over there?

Proud member of the IAA What's the point of being grown up if you can't act childish?

I was thinking a bit more like this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MK6TXMsvgQg

"And the Bunny nails it!" ~ Gabrael "If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we." ~ Cyran

With museum staff, police officers, French soldiers, and a little old lady with a cane, all trailing after him...

"We learn from history that we do not learn from history."

Chad's Leader: Troops to Leave Mali Guerrilla War

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016

U.N. Votes to Establish Peacekeeping Force for Mali

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016

Oh good. Is the general situation there stable enough for a peacekeeping force to more or less do their thing without getting shot at? If so, it'd be a huge step forward.

Charlie Stross's cheerful, optimistic predictions for 2017, part one of three.

[1]

Ethnic cleansing of Black African groups by Tuareg and some criticism at France for letting the MNLA control Kidal.

Final Fantasy, Foreign Policy, and Bollywood. Helluva combo, that...

UN formally takes over the force in Mali. Note MINUSMA is still mostly an African-led organization.

Charlie Stross's cheerful, optimistic predictions for 2017, part one of three.

The state of emergency is now officially over. [1]

"And the Bunny nails it!" ~ Gabrael "If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we." ~ Cyran