Death Note

Except that in the manga/anime, he DIDN'T lose because of his fuck ups. He lost because MIKAMI fucked up. Had Mikami not made his crucial mistake, Light would've won and continued to go on murdering people unopposed. In the end, they might've just made Light too "super special awesome" for his downfall to make sense.

Plus, Ryuk looked like shit. Seriously, I know it was apparently intentional to make him look "cartoony", but it looked so horrible.

That's a bit of Narm many detractors like to bring up. I personally liked it and got the intention behind it; he was supposed to look otherworldy. Literally like a anime/manga character drawing come to life.

edited 4th Nov '11 9:19:05 AM by ManwiththePlan

According to How To Read Ohba only made it that Mikami fucked up because he simply didn't want Light to screw up. It was his own preference and I think it worked effectively.

I liked the movie and most of the actors in it, but I still think it's a far cry from being as good as the manga/anime. It just never came off as exciting as the original material, and I was majorly pissed off by the ending. It turned L into a God-Mode Sue who somehow knew all about Light's plan and exactly how to counteract it.

I seem to one of the few who actually preferred the second arc to the first. Mainly because I suffered major Hype Backlash from the masses of L fangirls and actually liked Near for being a Combat Pragmatist and cheating. Plus Matsuda shooting Light was my favourite scene out of the entire series.

edited 4th Nov '11 10:28:13 AM by whizzerd

they/them || "Forgive me, regent of queer amphibians" - Lt.BGob

So you think L learning Light's plan and coming up with a way to counter it makes L a God-Mode Sue but everything going "exactly as planned" for Light and him outsmarting and killing a supposed genius like L without L ever SUSPECTING anything doesn't make Light a God-Mode Sue? The series was all about the mind games between Light and L, and it seems like which outcome people hate depends on whom they wanted to see get checkmated. And in the end, that may be a problem with a chessmatch between two genius characters. Someone will have to end up getting Out-Gambitted and the credibility of their intelligence will be lost to many people.

edited 4th Nov '11 10:43:55 AM by ManwiththePlan

But in Light's case he didn't so much outsmart L as outsmart Rem; L had no idea that Rem would do anything in her power to protect Misa so he couldn't have any idea that continuing to hound Misa would end up in his death from her hands. Light's genius isn't questioned since he beat L, and L's genius isn't questioned because he died due to circumstances he couldn't be aware of.

The film made it that L just knows Light is going to use Rem despite the whole point of his death being he didn't really know about Rem's devotion, all in favour of a Twist Ending that I thought was executed badly and made Light's death cheap.

edited 4th Nov '11 11:16:06 AM by whizzerd

they/them || "Forgive me, regent of queer amphibians" - Lt.BGob

In the manga, it's kind of explored. L KNOWS that Light is almost for sure Kira. He suspects the 13 day rule and was going to test it immediately but Rem killed him. It is a bit of a stretch, but it is possible that he went as far as to go from Light's point of view, assuming that he was Kira and the 13 day rule was fake. "If I set up a fake rule of 13 days to death, then I can prove my innocence. The only problem is if L tests it, which means I should kill him after everyone finds out about the rule but before L tests it."

Also, I don't mind Near or Mello. I thought the ending was excellent.

When you look at that way (Light manipulates a Death God into committing suicide to further his plans), you could argue that makes him more of a God Mode Villain Sue.

Which ending? Though I do love the live action movie's ending, the manga's was really good too. Matsuda's big moment, Light's ultimate downfall, and the last chapter after it.

The anime's one, however, not so much. Not because of how Light died (that I actually didn't mind that much) but because of the circumstances that led to it. Mikami randomly stabbing himself with a pen and gushing blood, Light using the opportunity to crawl out the door even when he should still be too weak to move, Near and the others just letting him go, and Ryuk writing down Light's name in the Death Note outside the warehouse even though we SAW him in there awhile back and he could've very well done it there and then. When and why did he go outside anyway?

edited 6th Nov '11 1:44:16 PM by ManwiththePlan

There was an apple tree growing just outside the warehouse of course! I think it was just for the nice shot of him on the tower. I thought Mikami's death was a bit weird, but I like Gorn so it didn't overly bother me. The symbolism of pre-Death Note Light crossing paths with current Light was pretty good as well.

But apart from that, yeah, the anime ending relied a little too much on symbolism and not enough on following the plot and actual common sense.

Also, what does it matter that Rem was a Death God? Death Gods aren't shown to be any smarter or more cunning than humans. The only advantage that Shinigami have over humans is that they can kill humans anytime they wish- which she couldn't use because, again, her devotion to Misa prevented her- and they can't be killed directly by humans- which Light worked around by making her kill herself. Light manipulates rules and feelings to get the desired result- L just somehow knew without any explanation exactly what Light would do in the films, which is why it's so implausible.

edited 6th Nov '11 12:43:58 PM by whizzerd

they/them || "Forgive me, regent of queer amphibians" - Lt.BGob

Which is a shame, since the last episode was incredible apart from that.

And now you've lost all your credibility. L's actor the WORST one? He's been praised for his performance by many people, so much that he got his own spin-off movie (which wasn't very good but still.) Not many actors could pull off L in real life, but he did.

Justin Bieber also has many fans. And for me his actor just didn't deliver L's character well at all. I only found him to be extremely boring, but I'll have to agree with you on one thing. The truly worst actor was Light's. Light's actor had no charisma whatsoever and his performance was painful to look at. It also bothered me how Light and L had no chemistry. In the anime it was funny and interesting to look at their interactions, but the movies just handled it bad and it was dull.

And about the ending "pandering to L's fanbase." Yeah, any ending that doesn't involve L losing to Light and dying must be "pandering", even if it's a logical ending that cuts out the Replacement Scrappy characters and spares us the increasingly dull convoluted-ness and Ending Fatigue of the series' second half.

Maybe you didn't like the original ending, but I did. I liked it better when Light lost because of his own arrogance and srew-ups (it really wasn't only Mikami's fault, Light should have instructed him better) instead of L outsmarting him.

"Horribly narmy" HOW? At least this version didn't have overdramatic potato chip eating.

Potato chip eating was funny Narm, but the the horrible overracting some of the actors displayed not. Also Ryuk and Rem. It's subjective you know.

Justin Bieber also has many fans.

Almost every entertainer has fans. What's your point?

And for me his actor just didn't deliver L's character well at all. I only found him to be extremely boring

Okay, I don't think I want to know your standards for L's character, then.

Maybe you didn't like the original ending, but I did.

If you look up, you'll see that I did like the original ending. I just liked this one better because it avoided going into the manga's needlessly convoluted second half and just ended the story that had been set up right there and then.

And funny though it may be, the potato chip thing still makes me question..."why?"

edited 26th Feb '12 1:18:36 PM by ManwiththePlan

The ending of the live-action has a couple of pretty serious plot holes, though: 1) Rem didn't actually save Misa's life, and thus should not have died. 2) Light and Misa had the place to themselves for, like, a week. How did they dispose of the bodies and not notice that L wasn't dead?

So yeah, I'd rather have the manga ending. Or even the manga midpoint; I'm glad for Mello and Mikami, not to mention a much more satisfying ending, but if it had to end at chapter fifty-eight, at least we'd have had our four months, give or take two years or whatever, in all their glory.

edited 5th Nov '11 9:56:40 PM by DomaDoma

Hail Martin Septim!

Almost every entertainer has fans. What's your point?

I meant this: "He's been praised for his performance by many people, so much that he got his own spin-off movie (which wasn't very good but still.)" Only because many people praised him for it doesn't mean he really was good.

Okay, I don't think I want to know your standards for L's character, then.

Jim Carrey, maybe.

If you look up, you'll see that I did like the original ending. I just liked this one better because it avoided going into the manga's needlessly convoluted second half and just ended the story that had been set up right there and then.

I liked the second half.

Jim Carrey, maybe.

Lord, no. Jim Carrey would probably go too far the opposite of how "boring" you think live action L was. Just because L is weird doesn't mean he's at all over-the-top.

I liked the second half.

And I, like many others, did not. I thought it was needlessly stretching out a story that could have been resolved chapters/episodes ago while keeping the focus on the main draw to the series from the beggining; Light vs L.

edited 6th Nov '11 9:34:28 AM by ManwiththePlan

Well, I was always drawn to the series from the premise of 'using a notebook to kill' alone, which may be why I, unlike many others, was not deterred when L died*

. I thought the series became, if anything, more interesting in the second arc; there was more conflict with Light vs. Near, Light vs. Mello and Mello competing with Near rather than just genius versus genius, and I thought that putting Anyone Can Die to full use ramped up the tension.

I'm not saying that the first arc was bad or anything, and I do understand why some people don't like the second arc, it's just that I liked it and I don't think it deserves all the hatred it gets.

edited 6th Nov '11 9:58:14 AM by whizzerd

they/them || "Forgive me, regent of queer amphibians" - Lt.BGob

Hey, Jim Carrey doesn't have to be over-the-top. You should see Eternal Sunshine Of The Spotless Mind.

I still don't think he would be good for the role though.

Always, somewhere, someone is fighting for you. As long as you remember them, you are not alone.

Also: Aizawa, Halle, and little glimpses of Kira's world come into its own. (Which is one thing the anime wins hands-down. Episode thirty was pure artistic genius.)

Hail Martin Septim!

I've only seen select scenes from the anime. I'm just going off the manga. No clue what happens episode 30.

Then go watch the anime.

Always, somewhere, someone is fighting for you. As long as you remember them, you are not alone.

Episode thirty basically covers the half of volume nine after the deathbed scene. Subtracts from Mello's role in things, as usual, and you have to be steeped in some of the anime's previously-established internal symbolism to get the full weight in a couple of scenes, but still. Dayum. And you don't need to see anything else in the anime for the montage after the title card, which is what I was mainly talking about in that instance.

Hail Martin Septim!

If I think about putting a WMG in Kamikaze Kaitou Jeanne that it shares the same universe with Death Note, what are the similarities?

edited 29th Nov '11 2:41:31 AM by DeathNoteFan

Well?

I think you'll find there's a pretty hefty dearth of people whose fandom overlaps between those two shows. Hell, you'll find a pretty hefty dearth of people who even know what that other show is. I know I had no clue.

Always, somewhere, someone is fighting for you. As long as you remember them, you are not alone.

Same here.

Anyway, you should probably try to figure out the similarities yourself by examining both shows on your own if you want to write a fanfic that badly.

edited 13th Dec '11 4:29:50 AM by Sporkaganza

Always, somewhere, someone is fighting for you. As long as you remember them, you are not alone.

I'm not writing a fanfic story, I'm putting up details for the theories for those two shows sharing the same universe.