Justice League

I don’t think anyone remembers the crappy Catwoman now.

Also if bad movies are enough of a reason to not have a Catwoman of color, by that logic, there shouldn't be Batman movies anymore.

(I am not opposed to that suggestion lol)

Well the franchise could use a few years of inactivity to make people miss it.

Also, Catwoman came out in 2004. It's been 15 years. And 7 years since there was an on-screen Catwoman. I highly doubt anyone would object if they got a great actress who happened to be black. (Well, anyone aside from racists.)

Edited by alliterator on Jul 1st 2019 at 1:04:33 AM

Black Panther made a billion dollars. And it stars someone in a cat costume. There's no citation on this "white people would object too much" beyond vague "it would totally happen" appeals.

For my pick of Catwoman, I say Gina Torres, as she's got action chops and is Cuban, though she'd probably work best in a veteran Batman take than early in their careers.

I think what Beatman is trying to do is think like a Hollywood executive in this regard. Hollywood is full of some remarkably stupid people so it is possible this kind of absurd logic actually pops up, but I think it's fairly unlikely for several reasons (chief among them the fact that it's been over a decade, yes).

Essentially. I’m trying to find the logic against or for such decisions.

As it stands, the new talent search for comic characters seems to be talent first, we’ll deal with accuracy later. DC has had success with that, given Jason Momoa. I’m sure they just did the same thing here and hey, people like The Crown.

Unfortunately.

Edited by Beatman1 on Jul 1st 2019 at 5:22:54 AM

Hollywood execs are notoriously racist & sexist.

There are plenty of crappy movies starring white guys but when those fail they never go “Oh clearly this means no one wants to see superhero films starring white guys anymore” but they always pull such an excuse in regards to anyone not a white male.

Racist gatekeeping in Hollywood is no secret, but the response shouldn't be to keep accepting its rules. When Fast Color flopped because white executives wouldn't commit to marketing a film about a family of black women superheroes, the fault lies with them for ditching the film, not at the filmmakers for daring to cast the talents of Gugu Mbatha-Raw and Lorraine Toussaint.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Jul 1st 2019 at 2:42:57 AM

I can't understand what we would stand to gain from continuing to think like Hollywood Executives except for how coming up with a good means of rebutting them, considering many of their beliefs are decidedly the kinds of things people shouldn't listen to anymore. Most of the time the backlash they expect never does manifest and if anything it's because they refused to change or because they made decisions that were actively regressive.

Edited by AlleyOop on Jul 1st 2019 at 6:01:44 AM

Another Flash shake-up.

Andy Muschietti is in talks to direct now, while Christina Hodson, the writer of Bumblebee and Birds of Prey, is writing the new script. They're not using Miller's draft with Morrison.

Oh, for Christ's sake, could they take something and stick with it already?

The second that movie gets greenlit, they probably cancel the show. I can see why they want to have all their ducks in a row (Didn’t help that the last director wanted a darker film than the Morrison script, and now both are out).

Slightly related but Tessa Thompson is playing Eartha Kitt on Drunk History. I can totally see her playing Catwoman.

The shortlist for Catwoman is apparently Vanessa Kirby and Ana de Armas last I checked. Although Thompson isn’t a bad choice and would be the second, that we know of, person to be in both DC and Marvel.

This has the same issue attached to it as Dick Grayson being Romani and Kyle Rayner being latino. They are retcons that were introduced very late in the characters histories and have only been reinforced by a handful of writers. People, even comic book fans, are more likely to remember that Catwoman used to wear a purple dress than they are to remember she is part-Cuban (which doesn't mean non-white btw). It doesn't help that Selina, Kyle and Dick are also drawn to look white even with those retcons.

I wouldn't say no to a Selina who is black or latina (or even who is both) of course. And hey the DCEU has done racebending before. Hopefully, their writing of a non-white Selina avoids any Unfortunate Implications. The Bat franchise has historically not been good to women of color.

Edited by windleopard on Jul 3rd 2019 at 12:29:37 PM

Or LGBT characters. Remember, she's also bisexual.

Also revealed late in the character's history sadly. And I doubt WB will even include that if they want China's money.

Also would it be in poor taste if the first explicitly LGBT character in a DC film was a villain? Even if she was a more likable and sympathetic one?

It depends on the presentation. Harley Quinn and Poison Ivy as a couple have largely been well received despite being villains, because of them having storylines focusing on themselves. So their orientation directs the plot and their actions, rather than being kept to a few lines that reinforce the "gays are scary" stereotype.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Jul 3rd 2019 at 12:55:11 PM

I think Catwoman is the first Cuban-confirmed character I've heard of.

I be a native of the island.

Edited by slimcoder on Jul 3rd 2019 at 12:58:38 PM

For reference, here's her mother Maria Kyle.

Selina's heritage doesn't come up much but I did like its alluding to in the DC Ricanstruction comics, where she goes to Puerto Rico and shows she's fluent in Spanish.

On Catwoman's ethnicity, I know a lot of people, especially older audiences, associate Selina Kyle as black thanks to the impression Eartha Kitt's adaptation made. The Catwoman film didn't help things either. An afro-latino Selina would be nice too.

x4 - Catwoman runs the gambit from traditional thief to Anti-Villain to Anti-Hero depending on if she has a solo series that month. You could do something nuanced and have her be heroic like the DKR Catwoman.

Really? I thought most people associated her with Michelle Pfeiffer. I’d say that getting Vanessa Kirby is leaning into that at least visually. (Tim Burton’s portrayal of her as a Womanchild driven insane by what happened to her is probably not going to fit here).

I will said that catwoman feel more like a version of harley queen that seline actually.

In fact michel Pfeifer would have make a great harley.

The Michelle version seems less influential than the 1960s versions. It's well-known but I don't think people associate Catwoman as a blonde with DID. Catwoman is either Julie Newmar or Eartha Kitt, though her (relatively) recent design has been picking up steam despite not really appearing in adaptations.

Edited by Pichu-kun on Jul 3rd 2019 at 4:36:02 AM