Spider-Man General Discussion

We are moving onto kingpin now so kindred is out on hold

TIL the Revenge of the Green Goblin miniseries had Norman fall in love with his nurse, Kolina Frederickson, who reminded him of his late wife. Despite Norman inviting her to live with him and the fact that she wasn't killed after discovering his secret, she hasn't been seen since this storyline.

My guess is she got the heck out of there.

In Amazing Spider-Man 60 Dr. Strange faces Mephisto, and asks him what is wrong with Peter Parker's soul

I take it you didn't read the last page or so where I already covered that?

Great then, we can move on. I have also seen that Mephisto has a song now.

🎶Who’s been messing up everything? 
It’s been mephisto all along
 Who’s been pulling every evil string?
 It’s been mephisto all along
 He’s insidious (Ha, ha!) 
So perfidious
 That you haven’t even noticed
 And the pity is (The pity is)
 Pity, pity, pity, pity 
It’s too late to fix anything
 Now that everything has gone wrong
 Thanks to mephisto (Ha!)
 Naughty mephisto
 It’s been mephisto all along🎶


And I made Harry evil too!

It didn’t take a lot of effort

That boy ain’t right

The most brain breaking thing about OMD for me, is the circular paradox it created, since if Peter was never married due to a deal with mephisto, then he couldn’t have sold his marriage to Mephisto, since he didn’t have one.

The current timeline that was created because of that deal, is also mutually exclusive with the one where he made the deal, but is still completely dependent and defined by it.

It’s such a weird and very meta concept, that’s hard to explain, much less address in story in a satisfying way.

Edited by megaeliz on Feb 27th 2021 at 3:32:02 PM

I don't get that argument. Its no different than time travel.

I feel its fans trying to write their way around the fact Peter would never make a deal with the Devil in the first place.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Feb 27th 2021 at 6:07:57 AM

If you want to try and apply established Marvel time travel logic, I believe it would be that, we’re dealing with two separate timelines here. The original one were Peter and MJ were married, which was dead ended by Mephisto, and the current one where they were never married, and didn’t make a deal with Mephisto, that was created by the deal.

Edited by megaeliz on Feb 27th 2021 at 9:35:49 AM

Because they altered reality.

It's like saying Kitty Pryde didn't go back in time to save Senator Kelly because the Days of Future Past was averted.

I've kind of always handwaved it as Mephisto simply altering people's memories rather than rewriting reality.

That's not always how time travel works in Marvel comics (read: Kang).

But anyway, yes. We're dealing with a situation where Peter is living with the consequences of something that he doesn't remember, and thinking of it fourth dimensionaly helps keep it straight.

To put it simpler, look at it from Mephisto's POV: Peter got married -> Aunt May gets shot -> Peter sells his marriage to Mephisto to save Aunt May -> Peter becomes a person who was never married > Peter's soul is tampered with, and the deal comes back to haunt him.

Despite from Peter's point of view the former two never happened (thus he doesn't understand why the last thing is happening), in the big picture all of those things are the result of simple cause and effect.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Feb 27th 2021 at 1:44:47 AM

Random aside:

Science can't alter the past, it only makes a new timeline.

Magic can change the past.

Doctor Doom can do both as can Legion.

Obviously the rules are whatever makes a better story.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Feb 27th 2021 at 8:14:13 AM

Now that I think about it, was Mephisto ever really given a reason for why he decided to mess with Peter, beyond the fact that he just likes screwing with people?

Edited by megaeliz on Feb 27th 2021 at 12:57:50 PM

His marriage made Mephisto want to barf

Mephisto is not possessed of ambition. He doesn't want to rule the world. He's an embodiment of evil.

He exists to cause suffering, despair, and corruption.

You know, being the Devil.

So, One More Day is basically another trick to pass time, really.

Hurting a Lawful Good hero like Spider-Man, arguably as good as Captain America, is arguably a better use of his time than most of his evil plots.

Plus he may have ret-gonned Spider-Girl.

he has made deals with all the male spiders in 616 except miguel and kaine. although he did brainwash kaine when ben went back on the deal he made.

Recentish stuff on Avengers has suggested he's been (badly) trying to undermine Earth's defenders since time immemorial slash 1000000 BC.

Messing with the spiders could be part of that overall deal

Earth's heroes have been undermining themselves without him.

Like, he was nowhere near the first two Civil Wars, Disassembled, House of M, Xmen vs Avengers and Inhumans, or any of the other shit where the good guys fucked up completely.

And it's far too late to start trying to pin it on him either.

The first civil war at least you could easily draw a line between one more day to civil war. Nobody would be happy but you could draw that line

And yeah like I said Mephisto often isn’t good at what he does. He once spent a whole miniseries scheming and manipulating to get Silver Surfer’s soul and then it turned out it was so pure it hurt him

Or the time Thanos tricked him with some baby word games

He’s apparently been whispering in ears for a million plus years to send threats at Earth and hasn’t gotten close to seriously undermining the heroes.

But he can at least mess up Peter’s life. It really only needed a nudge

Eh, Mephisto is pure evil so he's self-defeating. Humorously, in a Marvel Adventures game, a PC made a nice speech where he pointed out in addition to wrath and pride he also is an embodiment of COWARDICE and LAZINESS so he'll never sacrifice himself or work TOO hard for evil.

Which is a nice Fridge Brilliance way to explain why The Devil Is a Loser.

So, Marduk Kioros is a much tougher Satan to deal with. Ditto Zarathos.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Feb 28th 2021 at 5:42:41 AM

Please allow me to introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
I've been around for a long, long years
Stole million man's soul an faith

And I was 'round when Peter Parker
Had his moment of doubt and pain
Made damn sure that Mary Jane
Agreed to the deal and sealed his fate

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game

Stuck around Avengers Mansion
When I saw it was a time for a change
Killed Vision and Ant-Man
She-Hulk screamed in vain
I lifted a hammer
Held an Asgardian's rank
When the Fear Itself raged
And the bodies stank

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name, oh yeah
Ah, what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, oh yeah

I watched with glee
While your Avengers
Fought a Civil War For a superhuman registration act
I shouted out
Who killed Captain America?
When after all
It was you and me

Let me please introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
And I laid traps for Supreme Power
Who get killed before they reached Battleworld
Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, oh yeah, get down, baby
Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah
But what's confusing you
Is just the nature of my game

Just as every vigilante is a criminal
And all the sinners saints
As heads is tails
Just call me Mephisto
'Cause I'm in need of some restraint
So if you meet me
Have some courtesy
Have some sympathy, and some taste
Use all your well-learned politnesse
Or I'll lay your soul to waste, mm yeah

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, mm yeah
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game\\

Okay that was great.