History YMMV / BTS

*** [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmpTkkaKYSU ''ARSON'']] is even worse: j-hope walks around under a bridge, talking about how he [[Pyromaniac burned it all]]. At the end, we get a [[SarcasmMode sweet glimpse]] at the inside of his [[GrossUpCloseUp chest cavity]], which is [[BodyHorror ''completely empty'']], except for his [[FateWorseThanDeath heart]], which continues to [[TheUndead beat anyway]].

** j-hope's music videos for his mixtape ''Jack in The Box'' certainly turn up the scare factor. The music video for [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKdBFeewZYE ''MORE'']] ha a lot of psychological horror, with j0hope walking around through rooms that feature peopl constantly-- and maybe eternally-- stuck working forever because time is frozen there, a room where he sees himself undergoing psychosis, and a room for him to just smash stuff. The [[TwistEnding twist at the end]] reveals that what was in the box was [[MindScrews all of those rooms]].

*** On the other hand, the atypical nature of BTS compared to most Korean idol groups, the growing divide between [=ARMYs=] and the rest of the Kpop fan community, and the '''''vast''''' difference between BTS's steady climb in the US charts versus what other Kpop groups have managed to achieve[[note]][[https://www.billboard.com/articles/business/8500522/k-pop-trans-world-entertainment-retail-hanteo-korea-charts?utm_source=twitter&utm_source=t.co&utm_medium=referral According to Nielsen Music's data]], 1.6 million out of 2.2 million consumption units of K-pop groups in the US in 2018 came from BTS alone, and even the album consumption units of the other 16 Korean acts ''combined'' (570,000) didn't surpass BTS' (668,000). Aside from PSY, no other Korean artist has managed to stay on Billboard's Hot 100 for more than one week, let alone get in the Top 10; changes in Billboard's charting system in mid-2018 also made Youtube views lose significance, making an entry in [=Hot100=] even harder to achieve for acts reliant on the old criteria.[[/note]] might indicate that BTS's success doesn't exactly guarantee that other Kpop groups will be able to do the same. Having BTS constantly presented by Western media as part of a "package deal" with Kpop has also been criticized for equating all groups in artistry and quality [[UnfortunateImplications merely for being from the same country and language]], instead of treating BTS as artists in their own right.

** In a different way, the group's and particularly RM's [[PrettyFlyForAWhiteGuy hair/fashion choices and attitude]] and [[UnfortunateImplications less than sensitive lyrics and comments]] from their early years. He has acknowledged these and quite explicitly refers to them as OldShame, making efforts to improve along with the other members (he even has his lyrics reviewed by feminist scholars now, as well as songs with GenderNeutralWriting), but many Kpop fans surely won't let anyone forget it. You'd be surprised by the fact that he went as far as changing some lyrics for the US performances of "Fake Love" due to the Korean words for "I" and "you" ''sounding'' like the N-word, considering how much his name keeps popping up in ''any'' discussion about Kpop idols having problematic behavior (see "but namjoon" in [[Memes/{{BTS}} BTS' Memetic Mutation page]]).

** [[https://scontent-lax3-1.cdninstagram.com/vp/e18dd609c088b6106965c8de60fe446a/5CF65920/t51.2885-15/e35/s480x480/32224988_1102879819851797_7609249359091204096_n.jpg?_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-1.cdninstagram.com This popular meme edit]] of RM as president was made several months [[https://edition.cnn.com/2018/09/24/asia/bts-un-korea-intl/index.html before his speech at the UN]], where he had almost the ''exact'' same outfit and hairstyle.

** While rivalries are awfully common in Kpop, BTS' rising popularity (rivaling and even surpassing bigger established groups) and increasingly louder fanbase (in the sense of "BTS brought me here" becoming a meme due to being so widespread) gathered negative sentiments against the group and their fans among some Kpop circles since 2015 (some say even before), [[SeriousBusiness with some even acting out]] [[DisproportionateRetribution against BTS themselves]], the worst incidents [[note]]which include ''very'' public (now disproven) accusations towards BTS of plagiarism and chart manipulation, as well as the creation or encouragement of various anti projects and malicious rumors[[/note]] involving fans of EXO and Music/BigBang. The fact that there's also a growing portion of [=ARMYs=] who declare themselves fans of ''only'' BTS (and maybe some other Korean artists) and not of Kpop as a whole, partly as a consequence of the above - not to mention a new wave of fans coming from Western stan Twitter, with all that entails - hasn't sat well with some Kpop fans. [[Administrivia.RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgment It's better to leave it at that]].

** In early 2016, BTS had a few days of leisure time, and posted occasional updates on social media of what they were doing. ARMYs joked that Suga hadn't posted anything, and wondered if he was spending the break asleep. However, after a few days, Suga tweeted [[http://bts-trans.tumblr.com/post/137008008940/160110-sugas-tweets this]]. Yeah, instead of using the break to rest, Suga went back to the Kobe concert venue in order to sort out his thoughts and come to terms with the guilt he felt from not being able to perform. [[TearJerker Not exactly a happy vacation.]]

*** Also in the rock community, several fans of Music/{{Coldplay}} reacted positively to the cover of "Fix You" that BTS had done for their MTV unplugged segment and began to like them and respect their fandom, helped by Chris Martin himself stating that he likes and respects them.

* SomeAnvilsNeedToBeDropped: One of the main things that makes BTS who they are - and one of the reasons they are so popular - is their continuous effort to give a voice to young people from Korea and around the world regarding social issues, some of which are even taboo in their country.
** Songs like "No More Dream" and "N.O." directly criticize the way social expectations pressure young people into giving up their dreams to pursue respectable life goals.
** "Spine Breaker" criticizes consumerism among teenagers - particularly the padded jacket craze in South Korea, where said jackets as well as other expensive clothes and accessories became a mark of social status, leading some teens to force their parents to spend hard-earned money on them just to become the cool kids.
** "Tomorrow" and "Lost" reassure people who are lost in their paths in life and encourage them not to give up, something particularly relevant in a highly-competitive society where mental health is barely an afterthought.
*** Similarly, "Paradise" talks about life not having to be a race, and states that having a dream is not a requisite to be happy.
** "Dope" and "Baepsae" address the demonization of younger generations by media in an age that social and economic hardships have made working and living conditions harder in Korea, something that can also feel relatable for young people in other countries (i.e. millennials). "Baepsae" also explicitly talks about social inequality and work exploitation.
*** "Go Go" addresses the younger generations' tendency to overspend as a way to cope with an increasingly bleak future, considering that attempting to save up on money under these working and living conditions would hardly do much in the long run, anyway.
** "Am I Wrong" calls out people who are indifferent towards the news and what's going on around the world, with Suga's rap ("we're all dogs and pigs/ we become dogs because we're angry") referencing [[https://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/13/world/asia/south-korea-education-ministry.html the remarks from a government official from Park Geun-Hye's administration]] saying that South Korea should have a cast system where the majority would be treated "like dogs and pigs".
** The message of the ''LOVE YOURSELF'' as a whole seems to be ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin; however, it does it in the sense of finding your sense of self-worth ''not'' in trying to please others or only showing them your "good" side, but in accepting yourself with all your flaws and past mistakes and using them instead to grow as a person - a message also prominent in RM's UN speech. This message is particularly relevant in a context where mental illness is still taboo in South Korea and other countries, with not only fans finding comfort and encouragement in it, but the members themselves showing their own learning process to find self-love.
*** "Magic Shop" and Jimin's "Promise" follow up on this message by encouraging listeners to find happiness and growth within themselves; that is, encouraging fans not to depend on BTS emotionally, but to also direct the love they've given to BTS to themselves.
----> ''you gave me the best of me/ so you'll give you the best of you''
** Members have used their platform to send other messages that fans have also found encouraging outside of their music, such as Jungkook encouraging fans to get out of unequal relationships, or Jin saying that other people having a hard time doesn't invalidate your hardships and doesn't make it any less okay to ask for help.
* TastesLikeDiabetes: If you came solely for songs like "Fire", the Cyphers or the mixtapes, jumping to their softer songs like "24/7=Heaven", "Embarrassed", "Just One Day" (and its music video) or "Converse High" can be... jarring. Most of their work is somewhere in the middle of both extremes, though.

** "Your Eyes Tell" from ''MAP OF THE SOUL: THE JOURNEY'' is a side track that quickly gained attention and streams when it was released, especially on Spotify.

* ShipToShipCombat: There are sectors of the shipping community within the fandom that are notoriously toxic and are generally looked down upon by the rest of ARMY. Many people who like the music but don't give a damn about the entire YaoiFangirl perception of the relationships between the members have been attacked on social media by a VocalMinority (with significant overlap with the similarly small-but-vocal solo stan sectors described under MisaimedFandom above) who accuse them of being "homophobic" for not supporting their specific ship, even though this is usually not the case and some are even part of the LGBT community. And of course, the less said about the infighting between various shipping groups, the better.

** In early 2016, BTS had a few days of leisure time, and posted occasional updates on social media of what they were doing. ARMY fans joked that Suga hadn't posted anything, and wondered if he was spending the break asleep. However, after a few days, Suga tweeted [[http://bts-trans.tumblr.com/post/137008008940/160110-sugas-tweets this]]. Yeah, instead of using the break to rest, Suga went back to the Kobe concert venue in order to sort out his thoughts and come to terms with the guilt he felt from not being able to perform. [[TearJerker Not exactly a happy vacation.]]

** Anything from 2015 to late 2016, knowing that the members did suffer from the criticisms and accusations of plagiarism and ''sajaegi'' they kept receiving during those years. The highly emotional ''HYYH ON STAGE: EPILOGUE'' concerts in particular can get soured by the knowledge that they were immediately followed by the "plagiarism boys" hashtag incident (as in, it trended #1 on Korea during and after the concerts). Indeed, [[https://twitter.com/vlissful/status/939540152459948033 a VCR from the final concerts of the WINGS Tour]] confirmed that yes, the members saw all of that.

* HoYay / {{Shipping}}: A given for a Korean boy band. All of the members seem to have NoSenseOfPersonalSpace (though whether shipping is ethical even as a fun, non-speculative activity is a topic with a BrokenBase). [[HoYay/{{BTS}} Now with their own page]].

** Thanks to "Dynamite" and "Butter" paying tribute to disco-pop and rock, fans of Music/MichaelJackson (who was already very respected amongst [[=ARMYs=]] in general) gained respect for BTS. This is helped by the fact that MJ's nephew, Taj Jackson has shown his appreciation for them multiple times on Twitter and other platforms.

*** Also in the rock community, several fans of Music/{{Coldplay}} reacted positively to the cover of "Fix You" that BTS had done for their MTV unplugged segment and started to like them, helped by Chris Martin himself stating that he likes and respects them.
** Thanks to "Dynamite" and "Butter" paying tribute to disco-pop and rock, fans of Music/MichaelJackson gained respect for BTS. This is helped by the fact that MJ's nephew, Taj Jackson has shown his appreciation for them multiple times on Twitter and other platforms.

** Certain ones, like calling certain members old nicknames like "god of destruction", "alien", "horse" or "mom/[[GratuitousForeignLanguage eonma]]/pink princess", are seen as {{Flanderiz|ation}}ing or outright insulting in various ways when coming from fans, with members vocally expressing dislike for some of them. The fact that they've been ''very'' prevalent in fan-made "introduction to the members" videos partly explains the less-than-positive perception of Youtube [=ARMYs=] on Twitter. See also NeverLiveItDown below. It's worth pointing out that some [[VocalMinority smaller]] circles (particularly MisaimedFandom ones) can have the tendency to overcorrect, though.

** Played with regarding the [[CompilationRerelease compilation albums]] themselves. While they're often fan-favorites that serve as efficient series retellings with new additional songs, they often leave out songs from previous parts of the series to do so. The biggest example is likely ''LOVE YOURSELF: Answer'', which adds the popular new songs "Euphoria", "Epiphany" and the "Trivias" for a much-praised retelling of the ''LOVE YOURSELF'' story, but leaves out fan-favorites "Pied Pier", "134340", "Paradise" and "Love Maze", while other new additions to the album[[note]]read:"I'm Fine" and "Answer: Love Myself"[[/note]], while functional to the story, were less popular as songs in their own right, leading some fans to prefer ''LOVE YOURSELF: Tear''.

** At the 2019 MAMAs, many non-fans were not very happy that BTS won all four major daesaengs. A lot of the outrage was directed towards the fact that Boy With Luv won Song of The Year. Non-fans felt that "Fancy" by the girl group Twice was more deserving of the award despite "Boy With Luv" having a much bigger impact on the charts locally and internationally. This same thing happened in 2018, with many kpop fans clamoring for IKON's "Love Scenario" to win Song of the Year instead of "Fake Love", which actually won.

** Even more controversially, "Kpop". Being a long debated term in itself (notably originated in, again, Western media), it has come to be associated with ''idol'' groups rather than Korean pop music in general, with the Korean idol industry at large having a reputation of manufactured music and controversial practices that has unfortunately bled into the perception of BTS in the West. This is why many [=ARMYs=] prefer to distance BTS from the term, embracing claims from Korean critics that BTS are "beyond" or "more than" idols or Kpop. However, given BTS' proud self-labeling as both idols and artists, other fans have argued that it's no point in trying to separate BTS from Kpop, as they are still Korean idols who make Korean pop music - and that it would just be perpetuating the stereotypes that BTS and other artists are challenging.
*** This is made more complicated by the habit of some people (including, [[RuleOfThree once again]], Western media) of either only focusing on idols in their coverage of Korean music, or labeling ''anything'' from South Korea as Kpop, regardless of genre. For example, even though RM's ''mono.'' could easily be classified as "indie" or "alternative", it still appears in Apple Music under the "K-pop" category, leading to wrong assumptions from radios and potential listeners.
*** On the other hand, as it was already made clear in "IDOL" and their interviews in the Grammy studio and Entertainment Weekly, there's also the fact that BTS themselves don't mind the label of "Kpop artists" or labels in general. Suga even explicitly accepts the term, though he defines it as a music/visuals/dance package rather than a music genre.
*** Another point of view is that "Kpop" (used either as "Korean pop" or as "idol music") ''is'' applicable and (if maybe to an extent) accurate to BTS, but (much like with other Korean artists) it's ''insufficient'' to really describe BTS's music and using it persistently as BTS' ''only'' label erases BTS' unique artistry, identity, and story.

** "Dynamite" and what it means for BTS as a BlackSheepHit, being their first English single, with lyrics lacking their distinctive lyricism due to not being written by the members... and their first #1 hit on Billboard and Grammy-nominated song. A great, charming song that perfectly achieves its purpose of bringing joy in a style that remains true to BTS and tributes Michael Jackson and the disco genre, a song with cheesy lyrics that marks a precedent for BTS needing to make songs in English without their trademark songwriting to truly receive attention in the US industry, or a complex mix of both?

* ShipToShipCombat: There are sectors of the shipping community within the fandom that are notoriously toxic and a prime example of FanDumb in play, and are generally looked down upon by the rest of ARMY. Many people who like the music but don't give a damn about the entire YaoiFangirl perception of the relationships between the members have been attacked on social media by a VocalMinority (with significant overlap with the similarly small-but-vocal solo stan sectors described under MisaimedFandom above) who accuse them of being "homophobic" for not supporting their specific ship, even though this is usually not the case and some are even part of the LGBT community. And of course, the less said about the infighting between various shipping groups, the better.

* ShipToShipCombat: One of the most ''hideous'' examples in music in the 21st century, and maybe ever. All the HoYay has made the shipping community notoriously toxic and a prime example of the FanDumb in play. Many people who like the music but don't give a damn about the entire YaoiFangirl perception of the relationships between the members have been attacked on the social media by some of the most rabid [=ARMYs=] as "homophobic" for not supporting their ship (even though this is usually not the case and some are even part of the LGBT community). And of course, the less said about the infighting between various shipping groups, the better.

* ShipToShipCombat: One of the most ''hideous'' examples in music in the 21st century, and maybe ever. All the HoYay has made the shipping community notoriously toxic and a prime example of the FanDumb in play. Many people who like the music but don't give a damn about the entire YaoiFangirl perception of the relationships between the members have been attacked by some of the most rabid ARMYs as "homophobic" (even though this is usually not the case and some are even part of the LGBT community). And of course, the less said about the infighting between various shipping groups, the better.

*** It should be noted that some sections of the BTS fandom ''are'' friendly with other Kpop fandoms, ranging from fans who are multi-fandom, to [=ARMYs=] who also like some Korean artists (who may or may not be idols), to [=ARMYs=] who are indifferent to Korean idols, to a vocal portion of [=ARMYs=] who actively listen only to BTS; whether they also view the industry or other groups or fandoms positively also varies. However, a considerable portion of fans on Twitter refuses to engage with the Kpop fan community at large and are very critical of the Korean idol industry in general, even ''if'' they like the artists themselves. That people from other fandoms and multifandom [=ARMYs=] often enter conversations within the BTS fandom and try to pressure [=ARMYs=] to taking specific sides or otherwise paint [=ARMYs=] as "the worst fandom" hasn't exactly helped.
** Many [=ARMYs=] fight with older generation Kpop fans who claim that BTS did not pave the way for other Korean artists to become successful in the west and credit artists like BIGBANG and Wonder Girls instead. Not even the fact that artists like PSY, [[Music/EpikHigh Tablo]], Ailee, and Sunmi (ex member of Wonder Girls) have explicitly credited BTS for opening the doors for Korean artists has stopped the debate - with some vocal Kpop fans turning against those artists instead.
** The creation of the supergroup Music/{{SuperM}} has not made [=ARMYs=] happy to say the least. Many have argued that this group was formed out of spite of BTS and their popularity, and believe that SM entertainment wanted to make this group to replicate their international success. The controversial strategy used by SM to get into the US charts - which, among other things, included a ''very'' high amount of bundling (digital albums sold at a lower price by bundling it with merch) to increase sale numbers - certainly hasn't helped, as the almost nonexistent use of bundles during the 2 years of promotions in the US is a point of pride for [=ARMYs=] [[note]]The only instance of use of bundling was during ''LOVE YOURSELF: Answer'', with digital albums that could be redeemed after buying a ticket for [=CitiField=] and ''only'' that venue. Most of the albums were redeemed the ''second'' week (after ''Answer'' had already secured #1 on Billboard 200), and this was after BTS had ''already'' gotten a #1 album with ''LOVE YOURSELF: Tear''.[[/note]], and many find that SM's practice set a negative precedent that could add further to the already-existing prejudice against the legitimacy of foreign (particularly Asian) artists in the US.
** The relationship between fans of BTS and Music/{{BLACKPINK}} on Twitter became tense in 2018 due to various factors, including HypeBacklash among newer [=ARMYs=] towards BLACKPINK (due being lauded in certain circles as the most feminist Kpop group or "the female BTS"), media practices in part of YG that were questioned by [=ARMYs=], and Blinks reusing tutorials made by ARMY fanbases without permission. All of this quickly devolved into some people in both fandoms dissing each other's groups and some [=ARMYs=] even starting to (very vocally) criticize various rappers in female Kpop groups. The fact that a [[VocalMinority few Blink accounts]] - many of them male fans - accused [=ARMYs=] of being "anti-feminist" or "[[GirlShowGhetto men-obsessed]]" for not supporting BLACKPINK (even if they did support other girl groups) did not help matters, and it's only gotten worse since.

*** A similar case occurs with Music/{{LOONA}}. While - like with BLACKPINK - there's a good number of fans of both groups, HypeBacklash reactions from some [=ARMY=] Twitter accounts (only exacerbated by the incidents with BLACKPINK) weren't received well by a VocalMinority among Orbits, which has retaliated through trolling and spamming (and mocking an ARMY's appearance, in one case). This (once again, mostly male) vocal minority, which has resorted to insults to the members even in positive [=LoonARMYs=] tweets (such as one comparing a picture of LOONA member doing a cute pose to J-Hope doing the same), has really soured interactions between both fandoms and only worsened the HypeBacklash, even after other Orbits have apologized.
*** What '''''really''''' hasn't made things better is that some fans of other groups (but particularly the above girl groups) have also started to create Twitter accounts or change their existing ones to make [[https://twitter.com/Danaeasdf/status/1105141575460507649 deliberately offensive tweets]] while posing as [=ARMYs=], with the most infamous example being posting fancams under tweets about real-life tragedies (with comments such as "maybe if he stanned BTS, he wouldn't have died") and making BTS and [=ARMYs=] (many of which had been discouraging the use of fancams) receive the brunt of the ensuing backlash and become the face of the "kpop fancams" stereotype.

** Possibly since James Corden called BTS "the biggest boyband" (as well as many comparisons of both groups made by media since), the Music/OneDirection fandom has developed this with ARMY, starting with trending a hashtag in reaction to Corden's comment to show who ''really'' remains the biggest. Several have resorted to claiming that BTS' fandom is only made of fans of One Direction who jumped ship during [=1D=]'s hiatus - even though many [=ARMYs=] never listened to boybands at all before BTS -, and it all has led to various arguments between both fandoms from music, with topics ranging from quality to white privilege.
** At the 2019 MAMAs, many non-fans were not very happy that BTS won all four major daesaengs. A lot of the outrage was directed towards the fact that Boy With Luv won Song of The Year. Non-fans felt that Fancy by the girl group Twice was more deserving of the award despite Boy With Luv having a much bigger impact on the charts locally and internationally. This same thing happened in 2018, with many kpop fans clamoring for IKON's "Love Scenario" to win Song of the Year instead of "Fake Love", which actually won.
** [=NCTzens=] (mostly the ones that stan the subunit [=NCT127=]), the fandom of the boy group NCT, have fought with [=ARMYs=] (and [=MOAs=]) more often than not on Twitter. With their disputes being about (some) NCT fans constantly making viral tweets against BTS and the fandom and how they "unstanned" (to the point of possibly taking the place of EXO-Ls in frequency), trying to spread malicious rumors, fighting with a music producer for a track from ''MAP OF THE SOUL: 7'' for praising BTS, getting angry and (in some cases) even wishing death on [=ARMYs=] for "ON" (non-deliberately, since Korean [=ARMYs=] stream constantly) blocking a solo release of one of NCT's members from getting n. 1 in Korea[[note]]even though there was another song by another artist in n. 2[[/note]], and about how some [=ARMYs=] have said [=NCT127=] are "flops".

** Then there’s the case of Music/GOT7, Music/{{Seventeen}} and Music/MonstaX, which is more complicated. In some (multifandom) circles, the relationship between [=ARMYs=] and those fandoms is quite friendly; with friendships existing between members of BTS and members of these groups (plus a collaboration stage at the 2015 [=MAMAs=] in the case of [=GOT7=]), fans often have found one through the others and a good number of multi-fandom Kpop fans like at least more than one of them. In other places such as Twitter, however, the relationship between BTS’ and these groups' fandoms is mostly neutral; while they’re not ''actively'' hostile, conflicts do arise now and then, with the three having a history of siding with other Kpop fandoms more often than not on Twitter disputes. Carats and Monbebes in particular have become more and more hostile to [=ARMYs=] in recent years.

** Part this and HeartwarmingInHindsight: The empowering underdog anthem "Not Today" is inspired by Aragorn's RousingSpeech in the film adaptation of the third book of ''Literature/TheLordOfTheRings'', one of the defining works of the HighFantasy genre. "Not today" is part of a famous quote[[labelnote:Full quote]]"What do we say to the god of death?" "Not today."[[/labelnote]] from ''Series/GameOfThrones'', the adaptation of [[Literature/ASongOfIceAndFire the most high-profile fantasy work of the 2010s]]; it's also associated with Arya Stark, who not only was played by known ARMY Creator/MaisieWilliams, but, in the final season (aired 2 years after the song's release), [[spoiler:wins the otherwise hopeless battle of humanity against the White Walkers by killing the Night King, with Melisandre and her making a CallBack to that very line]].

*** A fan went to a BTS concert in 2018 holding a banner with the inscription "Lesbians (heart) Jin".

** ''FACE YOURSELF'' (particularly "Let Go", though whether there's an actual connection is dubious as it wasn't written by the members, being a Japanese song), parts of the 2018 BTS Festa and possibly anything from early 2018 can become either this or HeartwarmingInHindsight, after the members revealed at their 2018 MAMAs Artist of the Year Award speech that they struggled a lot emotionally at the beginning of the year under the overwhelming pressure to continue giving flawless performances after their international achievements in 2017, to the point that they talked about disbanding.