History Main / BothOrderAndChaosAreDangerous

** The game has lawful vs chaotic alignments. The lawful alignment represents God, order, and security, and the chaotic alignment represents Lucifer, freedom, and war. At their extremes lawful characters want [[WorldOfSilence an elitist dictatorship ruled by God, with the few judged worthy of being alive under its rule doing nothing but worshiping Him for eternity]]. Extreme chaotic characters want a world of anarchy, unchecked vice, and endless war where [[TheSocialDarwinist strength is all that matters]]. You can also essentially say "[[OmnicidalNeutral screw]] [[{{Ubermensch}} everyone]]" and [[TakeAThirdOption chose the Neutral alignment]].

** ''ComicBook/TheUltimates2015'' casts both Order and Chaos as antagonists (with Order in the driver's seat). They both disapprove of Galactus' transformation into the "Lifebringer" and try to forcibly revert him to the status quo, playing into the hands of the comic's true BigBad.

** There's also the Lords of Order and Chaos, opposite ends of a BlueAndOrangeMorality scale who all consider themselves AboveGoodAndEvil. Both sides have empowered both heroes and villains.
*** ''ComicBook/TheSandman'': Representatives from both Order and Chaos show up to try to claim Hell after Lucifer decides that he's done managing Hell and it's time to move on with his life. Neither comes off as better than the other: Order seems to suffer from quite a case of CreativeSterility, has slaves, and wants to take over Hell and make into a "more efficient" realm, while the representative from Chaos incarnates as a psychopathic brat who threatens Dream with eternal war should he turn Hell over to anyone else, and later reveals that Chaos never really wanted Hell, but simply wanted to prevent Order from getting it. Both are surprisingly {{Graceful Loser}}s though, when Dream doesn't give Hell to either of them, albeit in different ways and for different reasons.

* Dragons in ''Manga/MissKobayashisDragonMaid'' tend to be members of one of three major factions: The "Order" faction who serve the gods, the "Chaos" faction who seek to overthrow the gods, and the "Spectator" faction who want nothing to do with the overall OrderVersusChaos war. Within the Order faction are dragons who [[LawfulEvil go out of their ways to cause strife among the humans]], such as by demanding {{Human Sacrifice}}s to solve problems they could easily amend, others who abuse human laws to [[AGodAmI make themselves revered as gods]], [[BloodKnight some who just want the excuse to lawfully kill Chaos dragons]], and some who are borderline LawfulStupid. Dragons in the Chaos faction include [[KnightTemplar Knights Templar]] who think that HumansAreTheRealMonsters who kill their friends and family, many who object to [[FantasticRacism humans labeling dragons as]] AlwaysChaoticEvil, [[TheSocialDarwinist Social Darwinists]] who think that dragons are never morally fallible as long as they can kill anyone who tries to stop them, and many who are simply ChaoticEvil.

* [[BiggerBad Morgoth]] from Literature/TolkiensLegendarium caused all evil, in all its forms, in Arda. He was motivated by a desire for sheer [[OrderIsNotGood control]] over all the beings and the destinies of Arda. What he couldn't control, he would destroy by sowing in [[ChaosIsEvil chaos and discord]], so Tolkien showed the danger within both philosophies. In counterpoint, the forces of good in Tolkien's worlds sometimes work by order-- in loyalty and tradition, and by faith in Illuvatar's plan-- and sometimes by chaos--free will, change, and courage.

* ''VideoGame/Persona5'': The Palace Rulers represent chaos, with how their distorted desires serve as the root of their atrocious acts in the real world (Ex.: Kamoshida's abuse, Madarame's exploitation and plagiarism, Okumura's inhumane working conditions). Meanwhile, [[spoiler:the Prison of Regression, a.k.a. Mementos, represents order, with everyone believing that societal harmony in Japanese culture is the ''only'' ethic worth upholding, even if it means ridding themselves of desires completely. This desperate and self-destructive adherence to societal harmony eventually manifested itself into [[GoneHorriblyRight Yaldabaoth.]]]]

* Morgoth from Literature/TolkiensLegendarium caused all evil in all its forms in Arda and all his ways had his ego as the sole recipient and target of them, an ego that would not be satisfied with anything less other than total [[OrderIsNotGood control]] over all the beings and the destinies of Arda. At the very beginning of time he started by introducing [[ChaosIsEvil chaos and discord]] into the Music of the World. It was at that point that his megalomania fell short of his expectations and he responded by attempting to upset the harmony and twist the work of the other Valar (and ultimately Eru himself) and even then he was both an oppressor for all the Children of Illuvatar and the rogue member of his divine order. That being said, Aule also introduced things into the world that were not in direct accordance with the will of Eru, and did not follow Morgoth in his fall. [[note]] When he was called out on it, he reacted with contrition and sorrow instead of resentment [[/note]]
** That is because Aule was never motivated by a need to assert his superiority and never scorned the work of others, also unlike one of his disciples, Sauron, who soon abandoned his service to become Morgoth's chief disciple. He instead sought Order and didn't share his lord's destructive vision caring only about utilising his evil as it allowed him free reign into enforcing his own rule which made him very much the [[OrderIsNotGood exact opposite]] and yet similar at his core. Anything can be corrupted in this cosmology, but nothing is ''made'' evil.

** ''VideoGame/MortalKombatDeception'' introduces the realms of Orderrealm and Chaosrealm to the greater cosmology of the series. Orderrealm's characters consist of Hotaru, a KnightTemplar Hotaru who aids the BigBad of ''Deception'', Onaga; Darius, a man rebelling against Orderrealm's establishment who set up the deaths of Dairou's family to get turn him against the Seidan Guard; and Dairou himself, a {{Hired Gun|s}} who is said to take jobs no matter how inhumane they are. From Chaosrealm, there is Havik, a Cleric of Chaos who managed to [[TheCorrupter help]] get Kabal [[HeelFaceTurn back into the Black Dragon after he tried to reform]], goes and aids Shao Kahn in his ''Deception'' ending, and is part of the Forces of Darkness in ''[[VideoGame/MortalKombatArmageddon Armageddon]]''.

-->'''Sheridan''': It doesn't matter which side wins this today. A thousand years from now, it'll start all over again. You're as trapped in this cycle as much as we are. But we can't afford it anymore. We don't need it. We don't need ''you!'' We've learned how to stand on our own. We'll make mistakes, but they'll be ''our'' mistakes, not ''yours!'' ... We refuse to take sides in this anymore. And we refuse to let you turn us against one another! We know who we are now. We can find our own way between order and chaos. ... It's over because ''we’ve'' decided it's over! Now ''get the hell out of our galaxy!'' Both of you!

-->'''Sheridan''': Now get the hell out of our galaxy!

* ''VideoGame/NoStraightRoads'': NSR represents order, as they have placed a ban on rock music in favor of EDM, stifling all individuality and creativity on top of its [[FascistButInefficient increasing infrastructure problems]] and their top performers shelving their mental baggage rather than resolving it. Meanwhile, Bunk Bed Junction represents chaos, as them hijacking the NSR performers' concerts, beating them up, and [[ArsonMurderAndJaywalking venting their grievances towards NSR and their EDM empire]] [[spoiler:instigates riots all over Vinyl City, as well as cause a COlonyDrop that was just ''barely'' averted once NSR and [=B2J=] found a peaceful middleground.]]

* ''VideoGame/NoStraightRoads'': NSR represents order, as they have placed a ban on rock music in favor of EDM, stifling all individuality and creativity on top of its [[FascistButInefficient increasing infrastructure problems]] and their top performers shelving their mental baggage rather than resolving it. Meanwhile, Bunk Bed Junction represents chaos, as them hijacking the NSR performers' concerts, beating them up, and [[ArsonMurderAndJaywalking venting their grievances towards NSR and their EDM empire]] [[spoiler:instigates riots all over Vinyl City, as well as cause a COlonyDrop that was just ''barely'' averted once NSR and B2J found a peaceful middleground.]]

* ''Literature/{{Victoria}}'' warns against either extreme. While order, even totalitarian order, is portrayed as better -- since [[EvilVersusOblivion chaos equals oblivion]] --, too much of it becomes oppressive and dysfunctional, stifling the human spirit. The heroes of the book attempt to chart out a middle course between the dangers of disintegration (e.g., the [[PoliticalCorrectnessGoneMad New South]]) on the one hand and too-regimented authoritarianism (e.g., the [[ANaziByAnyOtherName Landwehr]]) on the other, as they struggle to preserve and rebuild their idea of America.

* Exemplified in the second half of ''WesternAnimation/LegendOfKorra'' by the last two primary antagonists. [[EnlightenedAntagonist Zaheer]] is an anarchist whose powers are tied to spiritual freedom. He wanted to free the people from (what he considered to be) tyrants, believing that chaos was the natural state of the world. [[ControlFreak Kuvira]] is a dictator who's hellbent on bringing a continent under her heel. She wanted to protect people who were suffering in the absence of a strong government, believing that any disruption to uniformity had to be crushed. Ironically, [[spoiler:Kuvira helped Korra bring down Zaheer in Book 3 and Zaheer helped Korra bring down Kuvira in Book 4]]. The title of the final book, as well as a major theme of the series overall, is "Balance", indicating going to either extreme is wrong.

* ''Literature/{{Victoria}}'' warns against either extreme. While order is better, even totalitarian order--since [[EvilVersusOblivion chaos equals oblivion]]--, too much of it becomes oppressive and dysfunctional, stifling the human spirit. The heroes of the book attempt to chart out a middle course between the dangers of disintegration (e.g., the [[PoliticalCorrectnessGoneMad New South]]) on the one hand and too-regimented authoritarianism (e.g., the [[ANaziByAnyOtherName Landwehr]]) on the other, as they struggle to preserve and rebuild their idea of the dream that was America.

*** ''ComicBook/TheSandman'': Representatives from both Order and Chaos show up to try to claim Hell after Lucifer decides that he's done managing Hell and it's time to move on with his life. Neither comes off as better than the other: Order seems to suffer from quite a case of CreativeSterility, has slaves, and wants to make Hell into a more efficient realm, while the representative from Chaos incarnates as a psychopathic brat who threatens Dream with eternal war should he turn Hell over to anyone else, and later reveals that Chaos never really wanted Hell, but simply wanted to prevent Order from getting it.

* This is the case for the World of Light Adventure Mode in ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBrosUltimate''. For Order, there's [[OrderIsNotGood Galeem]], the [[LightIsNotGood Lord of Light]], who has power over order: he manifests as a glowing orb surrounded by geometric "wings" and creates a very orderly, [[SceneryPorn even pretty]] world... by destroying worlds and reassembling their components according to his designs. [[spoiler:Chaos is represented by, [[ChaosIsEvil Dharkon]], [[DarkIsEvil Embodiment of Chaos and Darkness]]. An eye surrounded by a mass of of tentacles, he creates a [[SceneryGorn twisted world]] of chaos and darkness, also by destroying and reassembling worlds. In order to unlock the GoldenEnding, the player has to, in the third and final world, defeat an approximately equal number of Light and Dark spirits to ensure one of the two gods does not get too powerful and destroy both their nemesis and the fighters. To drive this point further, the GoldenEnding starts with Master Hand and Crazy Hand -- themselves lesser embodiments of Order and Chaos, respectively, having spent most of the story brainwashed by their greater counterparts -- working together to punch a rift in reality so that the fighters can finish off Galeem and Dharkon at the same time. In contrast, Galeem and Dharkon prove incapable of putting aside their differences, even taking potshots at the other during their final boss battle, and it ends up proving to be their downfall once both of them are killed by the fighters.]]

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* In ''Franchise/MortalKombat'' there are the realms of Orderrealm and Chaosrealm. Orderrealm's characters consist of the KnightTemplar Hotaru who aided the BigBad of ''VideoGame/MortalKombatDeception'', Onaga. Darius, a man rebelling against Orderrealm's establishment who set up the deaths of Dairou's family to get turn him against the Seidan Guard. And Dairou himself, a {{Hired Gun|s}} who is said to take jobs no matter how inhumane they are. From Chaosrealm there is Havik, who managed to help get Kabal back into the Black Dragon after he tried to reform, goes and aids Shao Kahn in his Deception ending, and is part of the Forces of Darkness in Armageddon. To say nothing of the Elder Gods, who have shown their share of questionable behavior, such as reviving Scorpion's clan as undead beings after fighting against Onaga in ''Deception''.
** A more perverted version of this is the backbone of the entire series' plot. [[spoiler:While 'order' and 'chaos' tend to oscillate between them, on one side is the Elder Goddess of Life, Cetrion, and on the other is the former Elder God of Death, Shinnok. Both of them have been at each other's throats since the original dawn of time, and the living of Earthrealm and Outworld have always fought the undead and demonic forces of the Netherrealm. So why's it perverted? As it turns out, both deities are complicit in sustaining this war, with Shinnok going full-bore into assaulting the realms with his forces whenever he is able and Cetrion only doing the bare minimum to ensure that Shinnok is brought down. Even worse is that both of them are doing this at the behest of the greater mastermind -- their mother, the Keeper of Time, Kronika, who seeks to perpetuate this conflict as part of her twisted sense of balance in the cosmos. Kronika only ever really worked behind the scenes to ensure that this balance is sustained by any means necessary, but when Raiden permanently incapacitates Shinnok at the end of ''Mortal Kombat X'', Kronika takes direct action for the first time.]]

* In the ''Videogame/SoulSeries'', the Soul Edge is the central antagonist throughout the vast majority of the series. To combat its wanton murder, destruction and madness, many characters seek or wield its polar opposite, the Soul Calibur. However, in ''Soul Calibur IV'', it's revealed that Calibur is just as bad, in its own way. While the Edge seeks destruction, death, and ever-lasting torment, the Calibur wants stability, peace, and ever-lasting calm... by [[WorldOfSilence freezing the entire world over so that nothing can move]]. And the fifth game shows that it's not above manipulation or possession of its host to get its way, either.

* This is the case for the World of Light adventure mode in ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBrosUltimate''. For Order, there's [[OrderIsNotGood Galeem]], the [[LightIsNotGood Lord of Light]], who has power over order: he manifests as a glowing orb surrounded by geometric "wings" and creates a very orderly, [[SceneryPorn even pretty]] world... by destroying worlds and reassembling their components according to his designs. [[spoiler:Chaos is represented by, [[ChaosIsEvil Dharkon]], [[DarkIsEvil Embodiment of Chaos and Darkness]]. An eye surrounded by a mass of of tentacles, he creates a [[SceneryGorn twisted world]] of chaos and darkness, also by destroying and reassembling worlds. In order to unlock the GoldenEnding, the player has to, in the third and final world, defeat an approximately equal number of Light and Dark spirits to ensure one of the two gods does not get too powerful and destroy both their nemesis and the fighters. To drive this point further, the GoldenEnding starts with Master Hand and Crazy Hand - themselves lesser embodiments of Order and Chaos, respectively, having spent most of the story brainwashed by their greater counterparts - working together to punch a rift in reality so that the fighters can finish off Galeem and Dharkon at the same time. In contrast, Galeem and Dharkon prove incapable of putting aside their differences, even taking potshots at the other during their final boss battle, and it ends up proving to be their downfall once both of them are killed by the fighters.]]

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* ''Literature/HonorHarrington'' has the two main villains of the [[PeoplesRepublicOfTyranny People's Republic of Haven]] and the [[IndustrializedEvil Solarian League]]. The PRH didn't set out to be chaotic, but its constant disruption of leadership, ever more extreme ideology and habit of destroying anything that smells like tradition puts them firmly there. Meanwhile, the League's attempt to create a harmless legislature [[GoneHorriblyWrong instead created]] a VastBureaucracy, which by the time of the story was [[CorruptPolitician hideously corrupt]], fueled itself by [[PlanetLooters economically plundering frontier worlds]], and considered itself to be immovable and unstoppable.

* Morgoth from Literature/TolkiensLegendarium caused all evil in all its forms in Arda and all his ways had his ego as the sole recipient and target of them, an ego that would not be satisfied with anything less other than total [[OrderIsNotGood control]] over all the beings and the destinies of Arda. At the very beginning of time he started by introducing [[ChaosIsEvil chaos and discord]] into the Music of the World. It was at that point that his megalomania fell short of his expectations and he responded by attempting to upset the harmony and twist the work of the other Valar (and ultimately Eru himself) and even then he was both an oppressor for all the Children of Illuvatar and the rogue member of his divine order. That being said, Aule also introduced things into the world that were not in direct accordance with the will of Eru, and did not follow Morgoth in his fall [[note]] When he was called out on it, he reacted with contrition and sorrow instead of resentment [[/note]].

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* [[http://www.fimfiction.net/user/564/Wheller Wheller]] presents us with Prince Zephyr / Overdrive, representing Order, and Prince Maelstrom / the "Siblings Nightmare" (it's complicated), representing Chaos. Even as Overdrive in the present, Zephyr imagines his ideal world as a machine, with all the sapient creatures in it (such as [[WesternAnimation/MyLittlePonyFriendshipIsMagic Ponies]], for example) as cogs, incapable of [[TheEvilsOfFreeWill free will]] and thus rebellion, and himself as the operator of the machine; while Maelstrom is a Type-5 [[TheSocialDarwinist Social Darwinist]] whose Chaos is intended to induce Strife which culls the Weak� and allows the Strong� to prosper. Both of them oppose [[MadGod Discord]], their transformed father (as well as [[SolarAndLunar Celestia's and Luna's]] [[AlternateUniverse this time around]], but that's too wide a tangent for this page) after his wife dies and he goes mad with grief, Maelstrom for the reasons above, and Zephyr because he's Order and Discord is Chaos. [[spoiler:Both are eventually removed for a thousand years, Zephyr in the bodies of Monty Uhlan's family down to Monty himself, at some point taking the name "Overdrive" for some reason, and Maelstrom... somehow... splits into three as the Siblings Nightmare, who are all male (told you it was complicated), and both brothers become the first two Big Bads of Wheller's stories.]]

* Morgoth from Literature/TolkiensLegendarium caused all evil in all its forms in Arda and all his ways had his ego as the sole recipient of them, an ego that would not be satisfied with anything less other than total [[OrderIsNotGood control]] over all the beings and the destinies of Arda. At the very beginning of time he started by introducing chaos and discord into the Music of the World. It was when his megalomania fell short of his expectations, that he responded by attempting to upset the harmony and twist the work of the other Valar (and ultimately Eru himself) and even then he was both an oppressor and a fearmonger for all the Children of Illuvatar and a rogue member of his divine order. That being said, Aule also introduced things into the world that were not in direct accordance with the will of Eru, and did not become evil [[note]] Because when he was called out on it, he reacted with contrition and sorrow instead of resentment [[/note]].
** That is because Aule was never motivated by a need to assert his superiority and never scorned the work of others, while one of his disciples, Sauron, soon became Morgoth's chief disciple but sought Order instead of Chaos because he didn't share his lord's destructive vision and only cared about utilising his evil as it allowed him free reign into enforcing his own rule which made him very much the [[OrderIsNotGood exact opposite]] and yet similar at his core. Anything can be corrupted in this cosmology, but nothing is ''made'' evil.

* VideoGame/{{Armello}} initially had LightIsGood [[Naturehero Wyld]] versus DarkIsEvil [[TheCorruption Rot]], but lore has since [[GrayingMorality complicated]] the relationship. In the Dragon Clan novella, Oxana explains that this is why she's aligned herself with the Rot. She uses it to trim away the chaos and [[NatureIsNotNice brutality]] of the Wyld so that civilization can grow, but unlike others in the Dragon Clan, she doesn't ''worship'' it; she serves the Balance first.