Main Hate Sink Discussion

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superboy313
Topic
10:32:38 PM Jul 24th 2016
CabbitGirlEmi
Topic
04:54:22 PM Dec 1st 2015
edited by CabbitGirlEmi
So, is there a temporary version of this trope? (excluding RFtSH)
MsCC93
Topic
02:50:21 PM Nov 9th 2015
In order to prevent an edit war, let's debate this entry for Diamond Tiara from My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic". In the character sheets for the show, she is listed as a minor antagonist, and this trope usually applies to characters who aren't'' antagonists, but we are supposed to hate them.

  • ** For the longest time, Diamond Tiara, who's really just a ordinary filly with an Alpha Bitch streak was presented as the least sympathetic character in the show and only appeared to exist to make life miserable for the Cutie Mark Crusaders and other school-aged characters. It wasn't until Season 5 that they presented her in a sympathetic light and shouldn't be considered an example of this trope any longer. However, the same episode also introduced her mother, Spoiled Rich, who's an incredibly nasty snob who looks down on everyone for virtually no reason and holds Diamond Tiara to ridiculous standards, with no forgiveness should she fall short.

Ferot_Dreadnaught
Topic
04:36:41 PM Aug 25th 2015
Many of the examples seem to be just really hated characters as opposed to those who are hated but not the main source of the stories conflict. Is this within trope definition? If not, should examples that are not clearly this be removed?
MagBas
04:53:03 PM Aug 25th 2015
The description is "A character whose intended role in the story (the role the authors made for him/her) is to be so despicable that the audience wants him or her to fail just as much as they want the heroes to succeed." Exist no "not the main source of the stories conflict" requisite.
Ferot_Dreadnaught
04:54:50 PM Aug 25th 2015
OK
chucknormie
Topic
08:16:11 AM Jul 20th 2015
What's with all the Big Bads being listed on this page? As far as I can tell, the Hate Sink is primarily supposed to be a character besides the BB that is just intended to be hated. Yet scrolling down I see main villains listed on this page.
Larkmarn
08:31:24 AM Jul 20th 2015
The description is poorly written. The Hate Sink can be the Big Bad, but it doesn't have to be.

That's why Example As Thesis is so bad.
Ferot_Dreadnaught
Topic
05:27:30 PM Mar 22nd 2015
  • Angel Bunny. Holy hell, Angel Freaking Bunny. He's almost universally hated by the fandom who think he's a worse villain than Diamond Tiara and Lord Tirek combined. This doesn't help that in almost every one of his appearances, he's being a jerk to Fluttershy or Spike. It goes well beyond him being a Scrappy as he has even less fans than Flash Sentry, Diamond Tiara, Prince Blueblood, and Gilda. It's gotten to the point that people completely demonize him by making him Fluttershy's abusive ex who then goes on to marry Rainbow Dash, Rarity, or Big Macintosh. With that said, he does have some redeeming qualities, but many of those are forgotten by haters and him kicking Fluttershy out of her house is treated like an every day occurrence.

This seem is a better example of The Scrappy and Ron the Death Eater, it put too much emphasis on the YMMV aspects of his hated, lacks explanation for his hatred, ignores that he got more positive characterization later, and reads like complaining. I think it should be removed or heavily revised.
MagBas
05:48:24 AM Mar 23rd 2015
edited by MagBas
I concur with this- if i understood well, this trope is "character intended to be hated" not " character that is hated".
flamemario12
Topic
03:46:12 AM Mar 6th 2015
What's with Hate Sink keep popping up on YMMV pages? It's not even a YMMV trope! Maybe I should discuss it on Trope Repair Shop.
SeptimusHeap
03:56:02 AM Mar 6th 2015
People using it instead of The Scrappy, or people misinterpreting the trope. I don't think there is a case for a Trope Repair Shop, though.
Hawaii_Knut
Topic
04:26:32 AM Jan 23rd 2015
Should Hate Sink be mentioned in the YMMV sections, since it's a sibling trope with The Scrappy?
Larkmarn
07:18:17 AM Jan 23rd 2015
No.

Hate Sink is a character created to be hated. Thus it's the author's intent. The Scrappy is a character who isn't supposed to be hated, but is anyway, so it's an Audience Reaction.
MagBas
10:33:40 AM Jan 23rd 2015
Actually, The Scrappy is a character with a hatedom, nothing more, nothing less.
HellKillUsAll
Topic
07:52:28 PM May 23rd 2014
Do the popular kids from The Fairly Oddparents count? They are design to act mean, and since they're the type that picked on Butch Hartman, he really wants you to hate them.
MsCC93
03:03:46 PM Nov 9th 2015
I think they do. They aren't the Big Bad, but you're supposed to hate them.
Larkmarn
Topic
06:34:24 AM May 9th 2014
Someone removed a bunch of examples with the reason "A Hate Sink can't be an actual villain, then they'd just be a villain."

Where does it say that? The description says they're not always a villain, but doesn't say it can't be one. In fact, the fact that Politically Incorrect Villain is a subtrope, I'd say a villain definitely can be a Hate Sink. Especially since as the page points out, there are definite examples of villains whom the writers don't intend audiences to hate.
LC
Topic
09:21:30 AM Dec 8th 2013
What if I like these characters?
PDL
09:39:10 AM Dec 8th 2013
It's perfectly fine to like the characters. The purpose of a hate sink character is that the author intends the audience to boo and hiss at him or her, and people find it cathartic to hate a character whose purpose is to be hated. People "love to hate" these characters.
DrBB
Topic
10:16:19 AM May 18th 2012
edited by DrBB
So as a sometime Prof. who teaches a course on SF, I've always referred to this type as "The Guy Who Just Doesn't Get It." I agree that the key feature in identifying this character type is that he/she is NOT necessarily the villain, or a traitor who works for the primary Big Bad. But the function isn't just about catharsis (venting hate). This character is there to provide a moral dimension to the story that would otherwise be lacking (the monster/Big Bad is just an Eldritch Abomination). Ripley's invidious comparison of Burke to the Aliens (in paraphrase: "I don't know who's worse, you or them—they're just doing what they're evolved to do") makes that explicit, but it also forges a metaphorical connection between the Critter and what Burke represents, namely corporate greed (allied to Social Darwinism) in its nastiest form, the Military Industrial Complex. Etc. etc. A force that knows no ethics/mercy and will destroy all humanity (in metaphorical as well as literal sense).

But note that there are other characters performing this exact function who are not at all the object of hate, and thus Hate Sink ends up being a subsidiary instance to the larger He Just Doesn't Get It function. The "it" being whatever moral dimension the story is actually about. For instance, Prof. Morpheus in Forbidden Planet. A classic and wonderfully compressed instance of the type. He Doesn't Get that his "beloved Krell" created a god-like power that led to their—and his—downfall. The "IT" being the "Monster from the Id," specifically Morpheus's id ("it") which he denies to the end. The thematics of his failure to get It being all about brain and no body, They Dared Think of Themselves As Gods, etc.

More commonly you have all those blinkered adults in teen-oriented 50s monster movies, who think the Kids Are Just Making Stuff Up when there really IS a weird deadly radioactive Thing in that swamp. Stodgy adult authoritarianism, lack of perception/imagination being the thematics there. They're objects of teenage frustration and resentment maybe, but "hate" is really too strong a term. It's their failure to be hep to what the young cats are saying that is their real crime, like all adults in teen movies.

And what really focusses me on the Just Don't Get It aspect as being the most salient point about this character function is the fact that they almost always meet their demise at the hands (talons/tentacles/pseudopods) of whatever It is that they've denied the existence or significance of. This frequently becomes literally true: their ignorance almost always results in them stumbling into the way of the Thing and being devoured or horribly shredded by it. Thus the ultimate proof of their failure to Get It: if you don't Get It, It's gonna Get You.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/remarks.php?trope=Main.HateSink