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Nice to the Waiter is a trope about how a character's treatment of workers characterizes them as either kind or mean. However, the title is vague and is only focused on one side of the coin.

As a result, when I did my Nice To The Wick Check effort, nearly half of the 50 wicks checked were about people being nice to the staff while only six examples involved meanness. Five of them played up the intentional contrast of someone being nice and being mean. This wouldn't be so bad if the nice examples were focused on this being characterizing, but many weren't. Many simply stopped at "X is nice to the waiter", which is technically not misuse but does not really capture the point of the trope. Thus, it's hard to determine if people actually understand what this trope is about or are simply taking the title at face value. What we can at least determine is that people seem generally unaware that being mean to the workers also qualifies for the trope, which indicates a problem with the title.

After a brief discussion at Trope Talk, some solutions have been presented:

  1. Rename to something more clear. Waiter Treatment Characterization, though less catchy, was suggested.
  2. Split, so that the mean version gets its own trope and thus more examples.
  3. Focus on a contrast between the "nice" character and "mean" character, which some examples already do; I'm less in favor of this one, but it's a suggested solution all the same.

Edit: dang it, botched the title. Thanks phone

Wick Check: Nice to the Waiter is a trope about how good characters treat workers nicely, while villains are nasty to them. The title only focuses on the first version, however, which makes it possible that the second version is not being being troped. This check will look at 50 wicks to determine the scope of the usage.

50/50

  • Nice: 24/50, or 48%
  • Mean: 6/50, or 12%
  • Both: 5/50, or 10%
  • Misuse: 5/50, or 10%
  • ZCE / Other: 10/50, or 20%

    open/close all folders 

    Nice to the waiter 
  1. Anime.Carnival Phantasm: As arrogant and condescending as he is, Gilgamesh sees himself as such, and pays for his lunch at Ahnenerbe with an absurd amount of gold and jewels. I guess this goes here?
  2. Characters.Baccano Novels Only: He treats his maids with a great deal more respect than any other noble would.
  3. Characters.Part Of Me:
    • Mónica is very kind to her house staff, whom she treats almost like family. In her will, she leaves a considerable part of her fortune for the pensions for her staff and even money to pay for Ricardo’s university.
    • He treats his employers and servants well, to the point he was good friends with the housekeeper Vicky, back before he left the country.
  4. Characters.RRR 2022: Fitting with her characterization as a Nice Girl, she buys presents for Malli (the native girl her aunt 'bought' from her tribe) to try and cheer her up, and warmly greets the guard who opens the gate of the governor's mansion.
  5. Characters.Shadow Of The Fox: He treats commoners like Yumeko, Suki or Reika and even ronin like Okame as equals, something rarely seen in people of his status.
  6. Characters.Tearmoon Empire: She establishes good relationships with the working staff of the academy, which helps her and Mia by association at least once given that they're happy to bend over backwards for her.
  7. Characters.The Meek: His most admirable trait is how nice and friendly he is with servants and commoners. They all love him. It's also worth noting how quickly and willingly he takes the blame when his father catches him chatting with guards on duty.
    Luca: They were negligent. They will need to be disciplined.
    Suda: But it was my fault!
  8. Characters.Twin Dragons: She seems to have a fairly friendly and casual relationship with Alex, a family servant. She's even tried to get him to tone down the formalities and just call her Cleo.
  9. Characters.Warrior 2019: Son of a Whore: Outright called that by Father Jun at the start of episode 2x07. Might explain why he's so considerate to the prostitutes he frequently visits.
  10. ComicBook.Blue Wraith: Her haughtiness and hot-headedness aside, Francesca is depicted as a likeable individual who's been born into wrong family. She likes natural beauty (in fact, her magic is mostly plant-based) and she defends a elven slave from being punished for showing her disrespect.
  11. Fanfic.Little Rebellions:
    • Not all the Gems are horrible to Pearls. Chaorite and the Quartzes from Chapter 30 are good examples.
    • Surprisingly, a Pearl fulfills this trope with a Coral (a Gem whose caste is even lower than a Pearl's). She's not nice, but she still helps her.
  12. Film.Roma: The children all love Cleo and treat her like family, a mutual feeling. Sofia also treats her well, but her occasional snaps and outburst (an understandable product of her stress over her husband's infidelity) remind the viewer that Cleo is not family. Despite this, Sofia affirms at the end how much the family loves and needs her.
  13. Fanfic.The Many Sons Of Winter: A key part of the Northern lords' attitude towards the smallfolk. Ned raised many eyebrows at the Eyrie when he treated the servants who interacted with him with some decency, happily surprising Jon Arryn and making him realize the differences between the Northern and Southern lords. Part of this is because, unlike the rest of Westeros, the North doesn't practice serfdom, so the smallfolk aren't tied to the land and are free to leave a lord if they want to, so the lords have to make sure they treat them well or they'll drive off all their workers.
  14. Film.The Choice: When Travis shows up at Gabby's parents' house, he chats with who he thinks is the chef and the butler. They turn out to be her parents, but his politeness to people he assumed were the help clearly impresses them.
  15. Film.The Palm Beach Story: Played with; Hackensacker is generally nice to all the service people he encounters, he just doesn't believe in tipping.
    Hackensacker: Tipping is un-American.
  16. Heartwarming.Hazbin Hotel: While walking past a saxophone player, Alastor takes a moment to tip him...and, once again, we get a rare case of someone not running from Alastor; the musician keeps on playing.
  17. Literature.Beka Cooper: Beka has a few moments in Bloodhound where she intentionally leaves food for the young girl who is spying on her for the Court of the Rogue, since she knows that the girl probably is not well fed and Beka used to be in a similar situation herself. The girl later helps her escape and find what she needs to take the Rogue in.
  18. Literature.Judge Dee: The Judge often goes out of his way to do a kindness to poor people he comes across in his cases.
    • In 'Poets and Murder' he arranges for the wife of a poor shopkeeper to get all the sewing from the Chinwa Residence which should give them a good income and improve their standard of living. He would have given them custody of a poor girl living alone in an abandoned temple, but she died of rabies before this could be carried out.
    • In 'Murder In Canton' the Judge arranges for a prostitute who gave him valuable information to be bought out of her unfortunate profession, gifted with a reward sufficient to reestablish herself in respectable society, and transport back to her native place.
  19. Literature.Peace Talks: Harry has made friends with Austri, one of the svartalf guards at Molly's apartment, and plays cards with him sometimes. Austri's kid is a friend of Maggie's.
  20. Literature.The Alien Series: Kitty's distress over the death of a pilot that aided her earns her the loyalty of the rest of his squadron.
  21. Literature.The Lincoln Lawyer: Haller is a great boss and friend to his driver Earl, even keeping him on long after he no longer needs him.
  22. Literature.Ye Little Hills Like Lambs: The Duke continues to be perfectly lovely to tenants, shopkeepers, servants, and so on. And for most of the novel – if partly tactically – even more than commonly appalling to officials and social equals.
  23. Roleplay.Hunger Games Simulation: Reba, the queen of Rebassia, is shown to be generous when she tips the earth pony waiter while hiding in Belissima, to Wanda's surprise since Reba used to be a greedy, tyrannical ruler.
  24. Theatre.Born Yesterday: Billie starts to share her books with the maid and talks about them with her.

    Mean to the waiter 
  1. Fanfic.Core: Mandark, once he gets the promotion. His arrogance really comes out and he is not Nice to the Waiter.
  2. Film.Dont Bother To Knock: Lyn is disillusioned with Jed in part because of the way he treats people, his rudeness to a hotel photographer being one example. He’s also short with Eddie in an elevator scene where Lyn isn’t with him. He undergoes Character Development on this and a few other fronts throughout the film.
  3. Literature.Star Island: Cherry and her parents treat everyone outside their immediate circle as "hired help":
    • While Cherry is vomiting into an ice bucket in the back of a limousine, she whines for someone to hold it up to her mouth; her mother (who's sitting right next to her), orders the bodyguard, Lev, to turn around in his seat and do so; when he refuses, she fires him - which backfires spectacularly on her when Maury insists on hiring the hideously scarred ex-convict Chemo to replace Lev.
    • After Lev is gone, Cherry daydreams about hiring a hulking, bald African-American to replace him "like Britney's guy".
    • When Cherry wakes up hung-over at her family's home in Los Angeles, her mother offers to wake up their cook - at two o'clock in the morning - to make her an early breakfast.
    • Despite her vital role in keeping Cherry's Alcohol-Induced Idiocy secret from the public, Ann is well aware that the Buntermans regard her as expendable, especially after she is mistaken for Cherry and kidnapped.
    • When Janet's backstory reveals that she was a cocktail waitress in a Texan cowboy bar, the reader has to guess that she's overcompensating.
  4. Series.Bull: Clyde Rutledge is an example of how public opinion can turn negative if one isn't nice to others. He has his female associate pull a heavy trolley up the courthouse steps. The first time it is somewhat understandable since he is surrounded by reporters and is busy declaring his client innocent. The second time he refuses to help even as he sees her struggle. This is not only observed by Bull but also by two female jurors. Bull immediately realizes that they have to replace Clyde as the lead lawyer or they are guaranteed to lose the case.
  5. Series.Deadwood: Subverted by Hearst. In an early scene, he's overjoyed that his black maid has arrived and claims to have a child-like affection for her. Only later is it revealed that his affection goes only so far as she continues to please him, and he can get quite cruel if she does not.
  6. Series.Scrubs: Turk was noticeably not nice to who he assumed was a parking valet. If he had been a bit nicer then his relationship with his future brother-in-law Marco might have been a lot better.

    Works that use both 
  1. Film.Giant: Upon returning to Texas with Bick, Leslie further ruffles his feathers by being very polite to his Mexican domestic staff when Bick and his sister Luz treat them like dirt.
  2. Literature.Tortall Universe: Everyone good is this, everyone bad is not. We keep being told by the huge cast of nobles who care about commoners that it's atypical in Tortall for nobles to care about commoners. The only main cast member to do this is Kel's friend Merric, who, while certainly not cruel or miserly, tells her and Neal at one point that they're too concerned and generous. This is corrected in Beka's books, however, since she has to deal with loads of annoying nobles (and even upper middle-class commoners) who are offended at being questioned by a member of the unwashed masses.
  3. Recap.Black Mirror Nosedive: Deconstructed. In this universe, everyone pretends to be nice to the waiter lest they risk a downvote. One of Lacie's first interactions in the episode involves a mutual five-starring between her and the clerk from the coffee place; in fact, the Reputelligent advisor notes that a large portion of Lacie's interactions are "reciprocal five stars from service industry workers". Later on, Lacie is nice to the agent at the airport at first to keep her from being rated down and so the agent makes an exception for her, but yells and curses at the agent when it's clear that the agent can't, or won't, give her a spot in the plane. Those behind her in line immediately give her a poor rating as soon as she gets frustrated. Following that incident, Lacie tries to be extremely nice to the workers she interacts with, but sadly it doesn't help her cause.
  4. Series.The Story Of Minglan: Minglan and Rulan are both highly protective of their maidservants. This stands in contrast to Molan, who doesn't care when her first maids are beaten to death for their part in her plot to marry Liang Han and pushes her replacement maid to betray her because she pays her poorly and won't let her leave her service to get married.
  5. Theatre.All The Way: Richard Russell, Jr., is always polite to the black wait staff even though he's fighting to keep them segregated. This notably distinguishes him from his white Southern colleagues who seem to treat black servants as furniture.

    Misuse 
  1. Service Sector Stereotypes: Waiting staff are seldom members of the main cast. Most are walking plot devices, employed to highlight an aspect of a more important character's personality. If the waiter is rude and the heroine doesn't fight back, we know the heroine has trouble asserting herself. If a waitress trips up and is rescued by the hero, we know he's a nice guy. If someone leaves a big tip, we know they're generous (if not necessarily a good guy); if not, we know they're mean. Still worse than not the non-tippers is anyone who is rude to the waiters. The restaurant and those who work in it are only there to show off the important people, the staff aren't important in themselves. Seems to think the trope is about literally being nice to waitstaff.
  2. Characters.Le Visiteur Du Futur: He is a Jerkass with everyone, except for Clothilde IV, her only superior, because he wants to marry her. Then he's just a Jerkass
  3. Manga.Tiger Mask: Tiger Mask is unfailingly polite with anyone who isn't the wrestler he's currently fighting (or Mr. X). Seems to just be Nice Guy
  4. Music.Liberace: When filming a television special in England, he made a point of learning the names of all the production crew. Years later when he returned to make another show, he was able to greet every crew member by name. This is nice and all, but the trope is NRLEP
  5. YMMV.French Kiss: Kate talking about French waitstaff:
    Kate: The key to French waiters: If you're nice to them, they treat you like shit. Treat them like shit, they love you. Just about being nice to waiters with no other meaning

    ZCE/Unsortable 
  1. Characters.Black Jewels: One of the qualities that endears her to her subjects and distinguishes her from Kermilla.
  2. Fanfic.The Cutting Edge: There's nothing to indicate Laurel was ever anything but polite and friendly to various service staff, but after going undercover as a night janitor she swears to generously tip "every hotel maid and busboy that she had to inconvenience ever again." A character decides to start being nicer after walking in their shoes; this may be characterization but it may also be a general commentary on working staff deserving respect.
  3. Fanfic.Zeros Shock: Jack to Siesta.
  4. Film.Frost Nixon: Nixon is portrayed as being quite a pleasant man in this film, his relationship with Jack Brennan being almost fatherly. Whether it averts or sticks to the rule of this trope depends on your view. It doesn't explain who Jack Brennan is, and tropes cannot be subjective.
  5. Film.The Golden Sword: Yu-long, in the tavern scene after beating up mooks.
  6. NightmareFuel.The Dark Knight Rises: It also taps into a very potent fear when you consider the myriad of people who have indeed been assaulted or murdered by employees that they trusted—housekeeper, gardener, nanny, etc. She could very well have been the kindest and most respectful of tenants and yet he was still harboring fantasies of doing horrible things to her. So much for being Nice to the Waiter. This is essentially saying that being a nice person may not save you from cruelty, all while speculating on what actually happened. This cannot be sorted but it also doesn't seem to be misuse.
  7. SamuraiJack.Tropes Season 1 To Season 4: Jack is respectful toward all. (In the episode with Da' Samurai, he's literally nice to the waiter.) I'm not sure this counts; if him being respectful is his default personality, being nice to working staff doesn't seem super notable.
  8. Series.Andor: Played with, with Dedra and Mon Mothma constrasting each other: Not sure how to sort this, given that neither example seems to be played straight and the contrast makes it more complicated.
    • Dedra is a fairly Benevolent Boss to her assistant Heert, and tells him to take an early night while she stays late. This doesn't negate the fact that she's still a sadistic, torture-happy fascist, leading the charge in oppressing the people on Ferrix.
    • Mon Mothma's first scene is her coming back from the Senate and snapping at a maid for accidentally interrupting an argument with her husband. On the other hand, she remembers her driver's name when Perrin refuses to and overall acts as the voice of conscience to Luthen's more morally extreme ways.
  9. WebVideo.Koibu: Kain towards Jeeves, unlike Malakai and Van.
  10. WesternAnimation.Blazing Dragons: Loungelot treats Flicker pretty badly. Who's Flicker?

Edited by WarJay77 on Apr 23rd 2024 at 10:48:06 AM

WarJay77 Bonnie's Artistic Cousin from The Void (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Bonnie's Artistic Cousin
#1: Mar 30th 2024 at 2:39:01 PM

To-Do List:

    original post 
Nice to the Waiter is a trope about how a character's treatment of workers characterizes them as either kind or mean. However, the title is vague and is only focused on one side of the coin.

As a result, when I did my Nice To The Wick Check effort, nearly half of the 50 wicks checked were about people being nice to the staff while only six examples involved meanness. Five of them played up the intentional contrast of someone being nice and being mean. This wouldn't be so bad if the nice examples were focused on this being characterizing, but many weren't. Many simply stopped at "X is nice to the waiter", which is technically not misuse but does not really capture the point of the trope. Thus, it's hard to determine if people actually understand what this trope is about or are simply taking the title at face value. What we can at least determine is that people seem generally unaware that being mean to the workers also qualifies for the trope, which indicates a problem with the title.

After a brief discussion at Trope Talk, some solutions have been presented:

  1. Rename to something more clear. Waiter Treatment Characterization, though less catchy, was suggested.
  2. Split, so that the mean version gets its own trope and thus more examples.
  3. Focus on a contrast between the "nice" character and "mean" character, which some examples already do; I'm less in favor of this one, but it's a suggested solution all the same.

Edit: dang it, botched the title. Thanks phone

Wick Check: Nice to the Waiter is a trope about how good characters treat workers nicely, while villains are nasty to them. The title only focuses on the first version, however, which makes it possible that the second version is not being being troped. This check will look at 50 wicks to determine the scope of the usage.

50/50

  • Nice: 24/50, or 48%
  • Mean: 6/50, or 12%
  • Both: 5/50, or 10%
  • Misuse: 5/50, or 10%
  • ZCE / Other: 10/50, or 20%

    open/close all folders 

    Nice to the waiter 
  1. Anime.Carnival Phantasm: As arrogant and condescending as he is, Gilgamesh sees himself as such, and pays for his lunch at Ahnenerbe with an absurd amount of gold and jewels. I guess this goes here?
  2. Characters.Baccano Novels Only: He treats his maids with a great deal more respect than any other noble would.
  3. Characters.Part Of Me:
    • Mónica is very kind to her house staff, whom she treats almost like family. In her will, she leaves a considerable part of her fortune for the pensions for her staff and even money to pay for Ricardo’s university.
    • He treats his employers and servants well, to the point he was good friends with the housekeeper Vicky, back before he left the country.
  4. Characters.RRR 2022: Fitting with her characterization as a Nice Girl, she buys presents for Malli (the native girl her aunt 'bought' from her tribe) to try and cheer her up, and warmly greets the guard who opens the gate of the governor's mansion.
  5. Characters.Shadow Of The Fox: He treats commoners like Yumeko, Suki or Reika and even ronin like Okame as equals, something rarely seen in people of his status.
  6. Characters.Tearmoon Empire: She establishes good relationships with the working staff of the academy, which helps her and Mia by association at least once given that they're happy to bend over backwards for her.
  7. Characters.The Meek: His most admirable trait is how nice and friendly he is with servants and commoners. They all love him. It's also worth noting how quickly and willingly he takes the blame when his father catches him chatting with guards on duty.
    Luca: They were negligent. They will need to be disciplined.
    Suda: But it was my fault!
  8. Characters.Twin Dragons: She seems to have a fairly friendly and casual relationship with Alex, a family servant. She's even tried to get him to tone down the formalities and just call her Cleo.
  9. Characters.Warrior 2019: Son of a Whore: Outright called that by Father Jun at the start of episode 2x07. Might explain why he's so considerate to the prostitutes he frequently visits.
  10. ComicBook.Blue Wraith: Her haughtiness and hot-headedness aside, Francesca is depicted as a likeable individual who's been born into wrong family. She likes natural beauty (in fact, her magic is mostly plant-based) and she defends a elven slave from being punished for showing her disrespect.
  11. Fanfic.Little Rebellions:
    • Not all the Gems are horrible to Pearls. Chaorite and the Quartzes from Chapter 30 are good examples.
    • Surprisingly, a Pearl fulfills this trope with a Coral (a Gem whose caste is even lower than a Pearl's). She's not nice, but she still helps her.
  12. Film.Roma: The children all love Cleo and treat her like family, a mutual feeling. Sofia also treats her well, but her occasional snaps and outburst (an understandable product of her stress over her husband's infidelity) remind the viewer that Cleo is not family. Despite this, Sofia affirms at the end how much the family loves and needs her.
  13. Fanfic.The Many Sons Of Winter: A key part of the Northern lords' attitude towards the smallfolk. Ned raised many eyebrows at the Eyrie when he treated the servants who interacted with him with some decency, happily surprising Jon Arryn and making him realize the differences between the Northern and Southern lords. Part of this is because, unlike the rest of Westeros, the North doesn't practice serfdom, so the smallfolk aren't tied to the land and are free to leave a lord if they want to, so the lords have to make sure they treat them well or they'll drive off all their workers.
  14. Film.The Choice: When Travis shows up at Gabby's parents' house, he chats with who he thinks is the chef and the butler. They turn out to be her parents, but his politeness to people he assumed were the help clearly impresses them.
  15. Film.The Palm Beach Story: Played with; Hackensacker is generally nice to all the service people he encounters, he just doesn't believe in tipping.
    Hackensacker: Tipping is un-American.
  16. Heartwarming.Hazbin Hotel: While walking past a saxophone player, Alastor takes a moment to tip him...and, once again, we get a rare case of someone not running from Alastor; the musician keeps on playing.
  17. Literature.Beka Cooper: Beka has a few moments in Bloodhound where she intentionally leaves food for the young girl who is spying on her for the Court of the Rogue, since she knows that the girl probably is not well fed and Beka used to be in a similar situation herself. The girl later helps her escape and find what she needs to take the Rogue in.
  18. Literature.Judge Dee: The Judge often goes out of his way to do a kindness to poor people he comes across in his cases.
    • In 'Poets and Murder' he arranges for the wife of a poor shopkeeper to get all the sewing from the Chinwa Residence which should give them a good income and improve their standard of living. He would have given them custody of a poor girl living alone in an abandoned temple, but she died of rabies before this could be carried out.
    • In 'Murder In Canton' the Judge arranges for a prostitute who gave him valuable information to be bought out of her unfortunate profession, gifted with a reward sufficient to reestablish herself in respectable society, and transport back to her native place.
  19. Literature.Peace Talks: Harry has made friends with Austri, one of the svartalf guards at Molly's apartment, and plays cards with him sometimes. Austri's kid is a friend of Maggie's.
  20. Literature.The Alien Series: Kitty's distress over the death of a pilot that aided her earns her the loyalty of the rest of his squadron.
  21. Literature.The Lincoln Lawyer: Haller is a great boss and friend to his driver Earl, even keeping him on long after he no longer needs him.
  22. Literature.Ye Little Hills Like Lambs: The Duke continues to be perfectly lovely to tenants, shopkeepers, servants, and so on. And for most of the novel – if partly tactically – even more than commonly appalling to officials and social equals.
  23. Roleplay.Hunger Games Simulation: Reba, the queen of Rebassia, is shown to be generous when she tips the earth pony waiter while hiding in Belissima, to Wanda's surprise since Reba used to be a greedy, tyrannical ruler.
  24. Theatre.Born Yesterday: Billie starts to share her books with the maid and talks about them with her.

    Mean to the waiter 
  1. Fanfic.Core: Mandark, once he gets the promotion. His arrogance really comes out and he is not Nice to the Waiter.
  2. Film.Dont Bother To Knock: Lyn is disillusioned with Jed in part because of the way he treats people, his rudeness to a hotel photographer being one example. He’s also short with Eddie in an elevator scene where Lyn isn’t with him. He undergoes Character Development on this and a few other fronts throughout the film.
  3. Literature.Star Island: Cherry and her parents treat everyone outside their immediate circle as "hired help":
    • While Cherry is vomiting into an ice bucket in the back of a limousine, she whines for someone to hold it up to her mouth; her mother (who's sitting right next to her), orders the bodyguard, Lev, to turn around in his seat and do so; when he refuses, she fires him - which backfires spectacularly on her when Maury insists on hiring the hideously scarred ex-convict Chemo to replace Lev.
    • After Lev is gone, Cherry daydreams about hiring a hulking, bald African-American to replace him "like Britney's guy".
    • When Cherry wakes up hung-over at her family's home in Los Angeles, her mother offers to wake up their cook - at two o'clock in the morning - to make her an early breakfast.
    • Despite her vital role in keeping Cherry's Alcohol-Induced Idiocy secret from the public, Ann is well aware that the Buntermans regard her as expendable, especially after she is mistaken for Cherry and kidnapped.
    • When Janet's backstory reveals that she was a cocktail waitress in a Texan cowboy bar, the reader has to guess that she's overcompensating.
  4. Series.Bull: Clyde Rutledge is an example of how public opinion can turn negative if one isn't nice to others. He has his female associate pull a heavy trolley up the courthouse steps. The first time it is somewhat understandable since he is surrounded by reporters and is busy declaring his client innocent. The second time he refuses to help even as he sees her struggle. This is not only observed by Bull but also by two female jurors. Bull immediately realizes that they have to replace Clyde as the lead lawyer or they are guaranteed to lose the case.
  5. Series.Deadwood: Subverted by Hearst. In an early scene, he's overjoyed that his black maid has arrived and claims to have a child-like affection for her. Only later is it revealed that his affection goes only so far as she continues to please him, and he can get quite cruel if she does not.
  6. Series.Scrubs: Turk was noticeably not nice to who he assumed was a parking valet. If he had been a bit nicer then his relationship with his future brother-in-law Marco might have been a lot better.

    Works that use both 
  1. Film.Giant: Upon returning to Texas with Bick, Leslie further ruffles his feathers by being very polite to his Mexican domestic staff when Bick and his sister Luz treat them like dirt.
  2. Literature.Tortall Universe: Everyone good is this, everyone bad is not. We keep being told by the huge cast of nobles who care about commoners that it's atypical in Tortall for nobles to care about commoners. The only main cast member to do this is Kel's friend Merric, who, while certainly not cruel or miserly, tells her and Neal at one point that they're too concerned and generous. This is corrected in Beka's books, however, since she has to deal with loads of annoying nobles (and even upper middle-class commoners) who are offended at being questioned by a member of the unwashed masses.
  3. Recap.Black Mirror Nosedive: Deconstructed. In this universe, everyone pretends to be nice to the waiter lest they risk a downvote. One of Lacie's first interactions in the episode involves a mutual five-starring between her and the clerk from the coffee place; in fact, the Reputelligent advisor notes that a large portion of Lacie's interactions are "reciprocal five stars from service industry workers". Later on, Lacie is nice to the agent at the airport at first to keep her from being rated down and so the agent makes an exception for her, but yells and curses at the agent when it's clear that the agent can't, or won't, give her a spot in the plane. Those behind her in line immediately give her a poor rating as soon as she gets frustrated. Following that incident, Lacie tries to be extremely nice to the workers she interacts with, but sadly it doesn't help her cause.
  4. Series.The Story Of Minglan: Minglan and Rulan are both highly protective of their maidservants. This stands in contrast to Molan, who doesn't care when her first maids are beaten to death for their part in her plot to marry Liang Han and pushes her replacement maid to betray her because she pays her poorly and won't let her leave her service to get married.
  5. Theatre.All The Way: Richard Russell, Jr., is always polite to the black wait staff even though he's fighting to keep them segregated. This notably distinguishes him from his white Southern colleagues who seem to treat black servants as furniture.

    Misuse 
  1. Service Sector Stereotypes: Waiting staff are seldom members of the main cast. Most are walking plot devices, employed to highlight an aspect of a more important character's personality. If the waiter is rude and the heroine doesn't fight back, we know the heroine has trouble asserting herself. If a waitress trips up and is rescued by the hero, we know he's a nice guy. If someone leaves a big tip, we know they're generous (if not necessarily a good guy); if not, we know they're mean. Still worse than not the non-tippers is anyone who is rude to the waiters. The restaurant and those who work in it are only there to show off the important people, the staff aren't important in themselves. Seems to think the trope is about literally being nice to waitstaff.
  2. Characters.Le Visiteur Du Futur: He is a Jerkass with everyone, except for Clothilde IV, her only superior, because he wants to marry her. Then he's just a Jerkass
  3. Manga.Tiger Mask: Tiger Mask is unfailingly polite with anyone who isn't the wrestler he's currently fighting (or Mr. X). Seems to just be Nice Guy
  4. Music.Liberace: When filming a television special in England, he made a point of learning the names of all the production crew. Years later when he returned to make another show, he was able to greet every crew member by name. This is nice and all, but the trope is NRLEP
  5. YMMV.French Kiss: Kate talking about French waitstaff:
    Kate: The key to French waiters: If you're nice to them, they treat you like shit. Treat them like shit, they love you. Just about being nice to waiters with no other meaning

    ZCE/Unsortable 
  1. Characters.Black Jewels: One of the qualities that endears her to her subjects and distinguishes her from Kermilla.
  2. Fanfic.The Cutting Edge: There's nothing to indicate Laurel was ever anything but polite and friendly to various service staff, but after going undercover as a night janitor she swears to generously tip "every hotel maid and busboy that she had to inconvenience ever again." A character decides to start being nicer after walking in their shoes; this may be characterization but it may also be a general commentary on working staff deserving respect.
  3. Fanfic.Zeros Shock: Jack to Siesta.
  4. Film.Frost Nixon: Nixon is portrayed as being quite a pleasant man in this film, his relationship with Jack Brennan being almost fatherly. Whether it averts or sticks to the rule of this trope depends on your view. It doesn't explain who Jack Brennan is, and tropes cannot be subjective.
  5. Film.The Golden Sword: Yu-long, in the tavern scene after beating up mooks.
  6. NightmareFuel.The Dark Knight Rises: It also taps into a very potent fear when you consider the myriad of people who have indeed been assaulted or murdered by employees that they trusted—housekeeper, gardener, nanny, etc. She could very well have been the kindest and most respectful of tenants and yet he was still harboring fantasies of doing horrible things to her. So much for being Nice to the Waiter. This is essentially saying that being a nice person may not save you from cruelty, all while speculating on what actually happened. This cannot be sorted but it also doesn't seem to be misuse.
  7. SamuraiJack.Tropes Season 1 To Season 4: Jack is respectful toward all. (In the episode with Da' Samurai, he's literally nice to the waiter.) I'm not sure this counts; if him being respectful is his default personality, being nice to working staff doesn't seem super notable.
  8. Series.Andor: Played with, with Dedra and Mon Mothma constrasting each other: Not sure how to sort this, given that neither example seems to be played straight and the contrast makes it more complicated.
    • Dedra is a fairly Benevolent Boss to her assistant Heert, and tells him to take an early night while she stays late. This doesn't negate the fact that she's still a sadistic, torture-happy fascist, leading the charge in oppressing the people on Ferrix.
    • Mon Mothma's first scene is her coming back from the Senate and snapping at a maid for accidentally interrupting an argument with her husband. On the other hand, she remembers her driver's name when Perrin refuses to and overall acts as the voice of conscience to Luthen's more morally extreme ways.
  9. WebVideo.Koibu: Kain towards Jeeves, unlike Malakai and Van.
  10. WesternAnimation.Blazing Dragons: Loungelot treats Flicker pretty badly. Who's Flicker?

Edited by WarJay77 on Apr 23rd 2024 at 10:48:06 AM

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
Twiddler (On A Trope Odyssey)
GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#3: Mar 30th 2024 at 7:55:44 PM

Tagged the page.

Leaning toward renaming to Waiter Treatment Characterization, since this is about what treatment of the staff says about a character, and not just about treatment of the staff on its own. While there aren't too many examples of misuse that ignore the characterization aspect, the current title appears to have led to a lack of use for examples of meanness (relative to the amount of examples involving niceness, since this has a four-digit wick count), despite that still being valid.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 30th 2024 at 9:59:26 AM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
MatthewWayne The Man Outside Reality from TVA Headquarters Since: Oct, 2014
The Man Outside Reality
#4: Mar 30th 2024 at 11:05:41 PM

Maybe for the sake of convenience, the name could be changed to Staff Treatment Characterization or Employee Treatment Characterization? I don't think this trope applies specifically to waiters after all.

Trust no one.
Riolugirl Rookie Trope Repairer from whence you came, you shall remain... (Experienced Trainee) Relationship Status: He makes me feel like I have a heart
#5: Mar 31st 2024 at 12:33:37 AM

[up]Staff Treatment Characterisation works for me; it's just about more concise than the alternatives while still being clear. As illustrated, it will need a redirect for its Commonwealth English form.

Edited by Riolugirl on Mar 31st 2024 at 8:33:49 PM

"As long as I have my comrades with me, I can do anything!" (She/Her)
Amonimus the Retromancer from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
the Retromancer
#6: Mar 31st 2024 at 1:56:33 AM

Since it's a Pet the Dog subtrope, merging may also be an option, but I feel there's enough to work with.

Since it's not about waiters, it shouldn't be in the title. I'm not sure what word would combine service workers, servants and employees.

Also "Characterization" implies we include Kick the Dog examples indicating villains, which we may actually.

Edited by Amonimus on Mar 31st 2024 at 11:56:50 AM

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
WarJay77 Bonnie's Artistic Cousin from The Void (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Bonnie's Artistic Cousin
#7: Mar 31st 2024 at 5:23:04 AM

We do. That's kind of why it concerns me that we're lacking in the mean department.

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#8: Apr 1st 2024 at 1:12:15 AM

Staff Treatment Characterization and Employee Treatment Characterization sound better if this isn't specific to waiters. It's also not a Pet the Dog subtrope because characters who are nice don't have to be villains or Anti Heroes, and characters involved can be mean instead of nice (both of which are true with the current definition, which is why renaming or splitting is being proposed without a redefinition). The description even refers to heroes being nice and villains being mean.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Apr 1st 2024 at 3:19:10 AM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Amonimus the Retromancer from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
the Retromancer
#9: Apr 1st 2024 at 1:28:47 AM

My mistake on Pet the Dog, which may be saying something, but that'd be off-topic.

As the description mentions both heroes and villains, the proposed names sound fine. That is also another agument how the current name of Nice to the Waiter doesn't really suit the "Nice" part.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
Lymantria Tyrannoraptoran Reptiliomorph from Toronto Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: Historians will say we were good friends.
Tyrannoraptoran Reptiliomorph
RandomTroper123 She / Her from I'll let you guess... (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
She / Her
WarJay77 Bonnie's Artistic Cousin from The Void (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Bonnie's Artistic Cousin
#12: Apr 5th 2024 at 12:18:23 AM

Should we fire up a single-prop? A rename seems to be the only suggestion.

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
WarJay77 Bonnie's Artistic Cousin from The Void (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Bonnie's Artistic Cousin
Lymantria Tyrannoraptoran Reptiliomorph from Toronto Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: Historians will say we were good friends.
Tyrannoraptoran Reptiliomorph
#14: Apr 10th 2024 at 4:23:05 PM

I hollered for a rename crowner.

(If the decision for a crowner hasn’t been made yet, I think there should be one.)

Edited by Lymantria on Apr 10th 2024 at 8:34:04 AM

Join the Five-Man Band cleanup project!
WarJay77 Bonnie's Artistic Cousin from The Void (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Bonnie's Artistic Cousin
#15: Apr 10th 2024 at 4:35:18 PM

I mean, I can make one myself. But I wanted more discussion or agreement before I did so.

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
CompletelyNormalGuy Am I a weirdo? from that rainy city where they throw fish (Oldest One in the Book)
Am I a weirdo?
#16: Apr 12th 2024 at 10:28:29 PM

I think we're at a point where it makes sense for a single prop crowner to decide whether we should rename.

Bigotry will NEVER be welcome on TV Tropes.
Amonimus the Retromancer from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
wingedcatgirl I'm helping! from lurking (Holding A Herring) Relationship Status: Oh my word! I'm gay!
I'm helping!
#18: Apr 13th 2024 at 4:56:56 AM

If someone could find a way to turn How They Treat Their Valet into something less dialogue-y...

Trouble Cube continues to be a general-purpose forum for those who desire such a thing.
alnair20aug93 🍊orange fursona🧡 from Furrypines (Long Runner) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
🍊orange fursona🧡
#19: Apr 13th 2024 at 10:29:56 AM

I like How They Treat Their Valet as a rename candidate. Flows better, and it makes you question how a character treats people. Staff Treatment Characterization and Employee Treatment Characterization is clear but not concise in letters.

Edited by alnair20aug93 on Apr 14th 2024 at 1:31:10 AM

ᜇᜎᜈ᜔ᜇᜈ᜔|I DO COMMISSIONS|ᜇᜎᜈ᜔ᜇᜈ᜔
WarJay77 Bonnie's Artistic Cousin from The Void (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Bonnie's Artistic Cousin
#20: Apr 13th 2024 at 10:41:20 AM

I worry it'll be confused for No Hero to His Valet (which I used to think was the opposite trope for this, before learning mean examples counted)

Edited by WarJay77 on Apr 13th 2024 at 1:41:43 PM

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
batgirl1 Her Majesty Since: Jan, 2001
Her Majesty
#22: Apr 13th 2024 at 9:33:06 PM

I agree with renaming and was myself about to suggest How They Treat The Help. Another possibility is leaning into the page quote: How He Treats His Inferiors.

FSharp Useful Note Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: What is this thing you call love?
Useful Note
#23: Apr 13th 2024 at 9:33:42 PM

I suggest the name Hostility Versus Hospitality. This suggestion has a Double Meaning: it could refer to someone being hostile towards a worker in the hospitality industry, or the choice someone faces to be either hostile or hospitable.

Welcome to Corneria!
StarSword Captain of USS Bajor from somewhere in deep space Since: Sep, 2011
Mitochondricat 3 Rats In a Trench Coat Since: Feb, 2023
3 Rats In a Trench Coat
#25: Apr 14th 2024 at 12:26:30 PM

[tup] to How They Treat The Help.

Edited by Mitochondricat on Apr 14th 2024 at 12:27:02 PM

Witty witticisms are witty.

Trope Repair Shop: NiceToTheWaiter
17th Apr '24 8:51:52 PM

Crown Description:

It was decided to rename the trope to better capture the scope of the trope. Now, we need to decide what to name it.

Vote UP for yes, vote DOWN for no.

Total posts: 34
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